To think private education probably isn't worth it?

[Rumplestrumpet]

Not about the VAT issue... Nor the ethics of private schooling, but rather the return on investment.

Private education is so expensive I wonder is it actually "worth it"? Most private schools near us are £25-30k a year, meaning £150k-£200k for secondary education. Will it improve their earning potential that much?

Would it make more sense to pay for some tutoring/extra curriculars and put that money into a buy to let for them to have when their older? For that money they'd have a flat paying for itself for them to take over when they are older enough, rather than trying their chances on the property market.

Interested in anyone whose parents forked out and think now maybe it wasn't the best investment...

I think most people paying for private education are looking for more than just a financial return.

Mostly I agree but it depends on individual circumstances . If an affluent NT child has a lot of parental support then sure, private school doesn’t necessarily add a great deal.

For SEN pupils it can make a world of difference to have a great school.

I don’t think your idea of investing in BTL property is altogether sensible! Being a landlord has become hellish!

It depends what you mean by 'worth it' -- do you mean the child recoups by a certain multiple all moneys spent on their education in earnings? Has their academic averageness carefully burnished by attentive teaching? Gains social status? Develops the infallible confidence Mn appears to fondly think is the province of the privately schooled? Becomes PM?

It depends on the child. I’m not fussed about financial return but DD is a quiet sort who was getting sensory overload from local, very busy, state school.

Now is in private with max 15 a class and she’s having a much easier time and is less distressed by it.

Probably won’t make that much of a difference in the long run, but if you can afford to ease the way a little then I imagine most would.

From a purely financial point of view, no, it's probably not worth it. I could put the £20k+ a year into an account and give it to DD as a house deposit.

What price on good mental health and happiness though?

I moved my DD from state to private, even though neither my husband or I were privately educated and she has flourished.
If they put VAT on school fees, we'll find a way to manage, even if it's an evening bar job and cheaper food. Her happiness is worth it.

It's a dreadful return on investment.

Can easily be 250k when all extras added in and in SE.

A 2016 Durham study suggested that when adjusted for parental income and education, private school adds about half a grade at GCSE.

Taking 250k and investing it would be a better return - kid would graduate uni debt free and with a significant deposit for a property, would be able to build their own wealth more rapidly.

That would likely add more to their total wealth at 65 than the extra half a GCSE grade would have done.

I went to a private school for the last two years of secondary, transferred over from a grammar school as I was unable to cope in a busy environment due to ASD. It was certainly a much more nurturing environment but I also felt like I stuck out like a sore thumb because I was from a poor household in receipt of bursary when all my classmates bonded over expensive foreign language camps and new flashy cars their parents came to pick them up in.
So, I guess it is beneficial for some from the social connection perspective but didn't make any difference for me, personally.

My observation is that people who've had large house deposits (and this is even more true as house prices move ever further away from salaries) from parents have better financial outcomes in later life than those who went to private school. Yes, this is anecdotal, but the financial stability that owning your own house with no/small/affordable mortgage is hard to achieve simply from earnings.

Financially I don't think it makes sense. And unless you think your child really won't thrive at state school I don't think the potential nicer environment and better outcomes are worth the money long term.

My kids used to go to private school. IMO, it’s not worth it - the class sizes are the best thing plus SOME private schools have decent facilities but there’s still bullying, favouritism, etc and usually they are pushed so much harder which doesn’t suit every child. My 2 have flourished since we moved home and changed to state school.

Most private schools are also on the brink financially and rarely make a profit meaning they will, contrary to popular opinion, not enforce the zero tolerance approach to bullying by kicking bullies out as it impacts their income. God forbid like my DD you get bullied by a family with 5 kids in the school. They don’t like to upset them in case they whip them out.

I think it depend on your circumstances - if you can comfortably afford it, and the school is good quality. However, if you have a modest income, it less valuable. It may be better to gift your child a deposit. I think the value of a good primary school education than secondary.

If you paid £2k a month into a high interest savings account for 5 years then stopped contributing when your dc was 16 - by the time they were 30 you'd likely have around £300k. Enough to buy them a house outright in some areas or at least provide a really substantial deposit and massively reduced mortgage repayments.

If your main reason in paying for private is 'money' long term, it's probably not worth it and you could give them a bigger leg up sending them to state and saving the money.

It’s not about the financial return for most of the parents I know. We want our kids to be happy, healthy, secure etc and feel that they are more likely to achieve that in private schools. If state schools had smaller class sizes and better funding for SEN needs I’d be thrilled to move them into state and save my money for a different investment!

Depends on the child, the alternative options and the quality of the private school.

Where I live, there are plenty of private schools that are all very lovely but the state options are pretty damn good so for us it would have been a terrible misuse of our money. In terms of our children, dd1 is absolutely thriving at a RG Uni and mixes with both ex-PS and state students and she says that you largely can’t tell the difference either by overall social skills / mannerisms and mindsets or (more importantly) their grades. In fact dd said to me recently, “it really would have been a waste of money sending me to *” (the private school we considered once)

Dd2 is not academic and I actually wonder whether going to private school might have been terrible for her self-esteem. She loved her state school and felt very much valued and not overwhelmed by any academic hot housing; she had a much wider range of vocational subjects to choose from at A level. She’s a wonderful, articulate and kind young woman and I do not feel that PS would have benefitted her in any way other than I think it could have encouraged her to have a better attitude towards sport and being a little more ‘can do’. I’m happy not to have sacrificed over 100k for that though 😄

It's not just half a GCSE grade or a slightly better paid job, though, for lots of people.

In extreme cases, it can be the difference between ANY job or a life on the dole (or in prison), if the child is easily led and the alternative is a crap comp rife with crime, drugs, etc. It can be the difference between a "happy" teenage years against been bullied and making them suicidal.

I agree that, for the "normal" child, in a "normal" school, the difference is probably not worth the investment, but at the extremes, I think it can easily be worth it.

One of my clients is a plasterer. His son was really going off the rails in the town's "crap comp", i.e. truancy, drug taking, gang crime, etc. The thing was that the lad wasn't "bad", he was just getting led astray by the people he got caught up with. After several police interventions, with him getting closer and closer to being locked up, his parents had some serious chats with him, and the lad himself said he hated his lifestyle but felt he couldn't escape it when he was surrounded by his "friends" all day at school. He agreed to moving to a private boarding school that was known for dealing with "troubled" kids - cost his parents a fortune they didn't have, but they borrowed, re-mortgaged, and worked extra hours to fund it. It worked and the lad went on to A levels, Uni, and now has a good, graduate job that has set him for life. In that kind of scenario, it's more than worth it as it got him out of the crime ridden environment and gave him time away, on his own, to actually get himself back on track.

My dc is in private and it's not just about the education only. I'm also paying for excellent pastoral care, accessible teachers and head, knowing my child individually, excellent opportunities, every activity available, and for the experience.
My child is a sensitive, reserved yet very academic child. The school has tailored a plan just for him and he is flourishing. We have parent feedback meetings every 6 weeks, list goes on. It really isn't only about the education.

I'd love to give DS a private education. I don't want him in a class with kids who couldn't give a toss about their education and the highlight of the day is how much trouble and distraction they can cause. I'd love for him to have pride in going to school and learning things and passing the exams with the best results he can get rather than a bunch of mediocre grades as the teachers spent more time policing the class than educating them.

For me, the 'return' is that DC have a great experience in school. It's worth it for that alone, even if it doesn't change their future trajectory!

Maybe this school, if it specialised in snatching kids from the jaws of gangs, had some kind of foolproof Alcatraz-style anti-drugs security system, but I can think of several kids I know who did drugs and got into some unpleasant shit at boarding schools, including two very famous ones. Our neighbours' son (high court judge father, surgeon mother privileged upbringing) went straight from his famous school to prison for drug offences, got early release, reoffended within weeks, and got sent back. A friend sent his son to a famously remote, strict boarding school only to discover after a couple of years that local dealers were using drones to deliver stuff onto school property.

It's no guarantee.

Not all state schools are the same. It’s really about the marginal difference between the state schools in your area and the private schools you could use.

DH went to a good private school, didn’t even complete any GCSE’s as he left (long story) but his private education has given him connections and something that isn’t quantifiable that enables him to walk in to any job and get it. People take notice of him.

That’s what you are buying.

It was worth every penny for my son. My daughter has done incredibly well at state school.

From a financial perspective it doesn't seem worth it to me. I have heard people say that for some the connections they make and the 'polish' they gain helps them into jobs with vast salaries where it is financially worth it. However I suspect many of these people come from wealthy families in the first place so who knows?!

If you are just comparing grades then private school is probably not worth it - but so far my DS has had an amazing decade in prep and independent schools. He plays 3 sports to a really high standard, is currently learning 2 new sports via his PE sessions. He participates in choirs, plays, music concerts, there are first-class facilities, small class sizes and specialist teachers for him. He thinks it's fine to be clever, and produce good work and the majority of the children all have great behavior and are super sociable.

We have a very happy, grounded, sociable son and his schooling has played a big part in that.
We are as much about the journey, as the destination.

You’d have to experience both
for me worth every penny would do it again in a heartbeat
totally no regrrats

Nothing is guaranteed. It ALL depends on the person and the school(s) involved in the choice.