To find what’s happened to Michael Mosley quite anxiety provoking

[Glasto73lover]

It’s that idea of never really knowing what’s going to happen- the idea that we walk such a fine line in life. If you think too much about it, you probably wouldn’t leave the house.!

A close family member died suddenly and tragically a decade ago - literally dropped dead at home age 48 - something went pop in their head. So you genuinely don’t know when your time is up.

It’s that idea of a chain of consequence that can go so horribly wrong too- people always say ‘oh but you could get hit by a bus’ - stuff like this actually makes me really anxious. So many what ifs.

For Michael Moseley - a chain of probably inconsequential decisions may have led to his death- not having a phone on him, choosing to undertake a walk that in the U.K. is nothing but in that heat, was devastating and probably caused his death.

It makes me anxious that I won’t know if I am making those decisions - am I making sense? I think as I have got older, I have become more anxious and risk averse (thanks menopause) and as a result, you could end up not leaving the house. How do you choose a sensible approach? Not too much risk but some!

But I also want to live my life too!! I guess I find incidents like this quite difficult!

I guess always having a phone, not undertaking walks in intense heat in an unfamiliar place etc are the common sense points that will come out of this tragedy.

Aibu to find it anxiety provoking tho?!

Don't you understand there are differing levels of risk, probability, etc?

It is within everyone's power to live a normal life, but whilst reducing risks, i.e. being prepared, not taking unnecessary risks, etc.

They might seem fitter in their 60s but are more likely to have cardiovascular disease and be at risk of heart attack or stroke than a younger person. DH was still running a lot in his early 60s. Anyone would have said he was very fit. He then had a heart attack. As he says, running doesn't prevent blood clots and even a relatively healthy diet doesn't totally prevent atherosclerosis. It builds up and the older you are the more likely you are to have it.

Ah, thanks for the correction blondie. The farmer was a proper character, put it that way 😬 "I saw 'er outside the chip shop in Lynmouth the day before she went missing!".

It is so beautiful round there- but even as a regular on the SWCP I found some of the steep drops pretty alarming!

But, to put things in perspective, people falling off the coast path is surprisingly rare, given that in so many places it's a foot wide path bordered by a fatal drop. Coastguard callouts are more likely to be triggered by people getting into difficulties on the beach. It's just sobering to remember how close we all are to potential death- every day.

@crackofdoom very true. Police & coastguards, helicopter and lifeboat all called out last Thursday because some numpty had walked too far round the beach and was cut off by the tide. Can you imagine how many 10s of thousands of pounds that cost?

Again, as a non British person I'm a bit shocked that people think "this was just a short walk where's the big deal?", there's a reason why the Greek locals stay in the shadow during the middle of the day when temperatures are high and don't engage in cliff walking at 2:00 pm.

anything can happen, yes, but there are mitigations we can put into place to make it less likely.

I agree, and it's not as if it was a "normal" walk back to someone's villa on a promenade or level footpath. It was over a small mountain on rough ground which was probably going to be a challenge for much younger, fitter people in cooler weather!

Yes, and maybe after some time has passed, his family will choose to channel it into an awareness campaign . Anne Diamond did similar after the death of her little boy.

What would you call an unnecessary risk?

I would say that driving on motorways and A roads, living with a male partner (if you're a woman), drinking alcohol and being overweight are four things that can statistically increase your risk of mortality. But who avoids all those? (I manage two out of four). None of them are strictly necessary things to do, though.

The risks for those things are no where near as high as what MM did. The only reason more people die because of them is because more people do them. If everyone walked around in extremely high temperatures mortality would go through the roof especially among older people regardless of their weight.

@godmum56
anything can happen, yes, but there are mitigations we can put into place to make it less likely.
Indeed that why I started with expierenced mountaineers with right equipment etc.

Even if we do everything possible to stay safe there is always the chance that something completely unforseen can happen

Life throws some unexpected curveballs from time to time.

You can "reduce" risks by driving within speed limits, being aware of your surroundings, and not getting too close to other vehicles on a motorway.

You can "reduce" risks of being attacked by a male partner by being more selective as to who you choose, i.e. take notice of red flags like anger, aggressiveness, number of previous partners, etc.

You can reduce risks caused by alcohol by not drinking it at all or being aware of what you're drinking, your limitations, how it affects you, etc.

You can reduce risks associated by being overweight by being more aware of your eating habits, taking more exercise, etc.

Whether a risk is "unnecessary" or not depends on your own personal risk profile and your own lifestyle choices. But at the end of the day, you take your risks and you take the consequences.

And no, I know that it's impossible to have a "risk free" life, even if you do everything in your power to avoid risks, you could always end up with an abusive partners, or run over by a runaway bus, or suffer diabetes even though you're not overweight, or get your non alcoholic drink spiked in a pub. But you have to do what is in your power to mitigate and avoid risks to at least reduce the probability of something awful happening to you, even though you can't eliminate everything.

In warmer climates people know how to behave when the temperatures rise above 30. Also there are warnings in media/tv advising people, especially elderly and people with some chronic illnesses to avoid going out and stay hydrated etc. The risk of heatstroke is high in extremely hot weather.

Like 'numpties' who smoke or over eat or over drink, they also cost thousands

Yes, of course, what point are you trying to make???

indeed but it seems to throw less "curveballs" at people who plan and prepare properly.

Whilst it hasn’t made me anxious, it has made me very sad and reminded me about the fragility of life. He was fit and well looked after his health yet this happened to him in one ordinary afternoon.

It also feels unfair and unjust - in a world where we have such terrible people, it seems very wrong for this to happen to a good man. He was a force for good. He will have helped thousands of people with his brilliant easy to understand advice on health and our bodies.

We must enjoy life to the full.

Nail on the head!

I'm not sure they do longterm. I think health economists worked out that smoking saves society money ultimately as people die younger, don't take pensions for as long, need care homes for as long or at all etc.

indeed but it seems to throw less "curveballs" at people who plan and prepare properly.

I'm not so sure, me and my friends and I'm sure plenty more people have plenty of tales, manly from our younger days where they have done stuff and ' got away with it'.

I'm hearing stories from my now adult kids that are leaving me in shock and just thankfully thay are still alive!!🤣🤣

As a Mediterranean I can guarantee that none of the locals would have attempted this at any age or thought it to be vaguely sensible. That is not to say that he wouldn't have felt ill anyway, but heat stroke can have consequences at any age. Both my daughters collapsed due to the heat at different ages (12 and 16 respecitvely) and this isn't uncommon. Older people in Med countries die of heat a lot, check articles etc..and none of them are doing hill walks in the middle of the day.

It seems pretty clear to me that he quite reasonably went for a walk. Had good sun protection, a bottle of water and was fit and well, maybe only intending to walk a further 30 minutes.
But he took a wrong turn, became lost, realised this, then tried to navigate to safety, making the walk much longer than intended.
Indeed of the 1hr 45 min second leg of the walk, 30 mins was spent at the end, and before this some time will have been spent trying to find his way again.
He would have no reason to think before setting out that he would get lost.
What a tragic shame

I think people can sometimes be great at caring for/being concerned about other people, but less on the ball when it comes to caring for themselves.

Presumably MM was feeling absolutely fine after the first part of his walk, so much so that he wanted to continue walking rather than get a bus.

Much is made of the heat, but I wonder how it actually felt to him at the time under the shade of his umbrella, being right next to the sea, perhaps with a nice cooling breeze?

Did he subjectively feel like it was a comfortable temperature for him, perhaps down by the water the heat just didn’t really register all that much.

Could he have been preoccupied with something, was he enjoying the walk and the breeze with his mind totally absorbed by other things, so that it almost wasn’t even a conscious decision to keep going, he just went where his feet led him.

If he started to think he’d taken the wrong route, how much farther did he go before he was absolutely sure that he wasn’t almost there.

At the point he was sure he’d gone wrong, and perhaps started to feel a pang of concern, did he think the safer option was to carry on rather than go back?

Did the cooling breeze disappear? Did he find that with the breeze gone, and the sun beating off the rocks his experience of the extreme heat came on very suddenly, and that in just a moment it went from something he was only vaguely conscious of to something far more relentless and dizzying?

I find I keep asking myself questions like this as I try to make sense of it. I suspect if you were able to ask him he’d say there was never any sense of recklessness on his part, more just an accumulation of decisions that each felt reasonable at the time, but were taken too lightly, based on how he felt at that moment on a beautiful afternoon at the beginning of a holiday, rather than thinking clearly about what might possibly go wrong.

I find myself wondering what I would have done, would I have really been that much more careful than him? Could it have been me strolling along, enjoying the sea air and the sparkle of the sun on the water thinking to myself that I’ll just keep going for a little while longer.

*MuseKira

Whether a risk is "unnecessary" or not depends on your own personal risk profile and your own lifestyle choices. But at the end of the day, you take the risks and you take the consequences

PRECISELY.
And until two female walkers a week die in walking accidents, I will continue my long solitary walks and not cohabit with a man. That's what my own personal risk profile tells me to do.

I dont think this particular story is all that anxiety provoking as it's most likely the heat that was the deciding factor. We will of course know more once investigations are fully complete.
In other words, had he been walking in the exact same circumstances (i.e. no phone, same route, same detour, walking alone) but in cooler conditions then it would likely have been a happier outcome, a total non event.
Clearly MM's actions last week were unusual to most people, even at face value (rather than in hindsight) as thankfully Brits abroad aren't meeting the same fate with any regularity. I think almost all of us, looking at the scenery from Pedi beach, would not embark on a walk, alone, into that incredibly barren looking mountainous area, particularly at that time of day in a heatwave. BUT MM, as his wife said, was an adventurer. I'm sure he was aware that it carried some risk, but not enough to deter him.