How many non verbal children did you know growing up? How many do you know now?

[MaryMaryVeryContrary]

Not a goady thread and I wont be engaging with posters who want to speculate on the causes by starting debates about parenting and screen time.

But in the absence of any proper data, I’m interested to know whether others think there has been a rise in non verbal children (age 3 and over). I didn’t know any growing up, and now I know 3. So it seems to me there has been a rise but it may just be the area I live in.

I work in early years. There's been a definite rise.

Can you elaborate?

Growing up 3 who had cerebral palsy who couldn't speak and one who was autistic and didn't have many words other than no until he was about 8 and then only a handful more.

I don't know any now.

I was Born mid 70s.

Growing up: none.

Now I am a primary teacher and have had 2 non-verbal chilren in the last 2 cohorts.

My mum (b 1959) was a selectively mute child, it was described as shyness.

My daughter (b 2016) is selectively mute. She receives support to communicate in different ways.

My cousin (b 1981) did not talk until he was 9. He was not allowed to go to mainstream school.

2 per class or 2 in total?

My son is non verbal as is every young person in his class at his asc special school. These are teenagers not young children. I know others outside of school who are non verbal or have only a few spoken words. They have autism or cerebral palsy or suffered brain damage during birth.

There will be some increase due to more very early prem babies surviving.

As a child in the 70s and 80s I didn't know anyone has they weren't integration into mainstream schools. Over the past few years I know of 5 youngsters who attended my child s mainstream school . I asked my parents about this and was told there was non verbal children when I was a child but it wasn't talked about ( especially not to children and the children where kept out of mainstream. Thankgod the world has now change, it's not taboo anymore and the children are accepted.

But what about what.is in the disabled child, s best interest?
My son isn't in mainstream school and never has been his special.school can offer him.so much more than a mainstream ever could it's a fantastic school with amazing facilities, what could a mainstream offer him?

That's fantastic, Im pleased he is in a school that meets his needs so well. I'm was just pointing out that non verbal kids have always been around but we didn't notice them in the 80s because they weren't talked about and where certainly not integrated into mainstream. The fact that they now are ( if school fits their needs) and it's not a taboo subject anymore should be celebrated

Non verbal children in the perfect version of the UK ( presuming you in the UK otherwise this is irrelevant) get scooped up into SLD schools pre reception age.

As a governor of such a school the relatity is budget cuts. Being completely non verbal is never a stand alone thing. You need a toolkit to communicate which doesn't have to be the spoken word but you would never access to that expert input in mainstream.

It's not always parental choice. It's the LA choice or lack of choice , lack of funding.

Even if you don't have learning difficulties and are just eg deaf, you need immersive expert education.

@Perzival verbal means "using words". My DS uses words better than many adults I know. He is just non-speaking. Not through mutism but because of dyspraxia, he physically cannot speak. If a SLT called him non-verbal I would correct them (as would he).

He is also autistic, but that has not impacted on his understanding of or his use of language (apart from being a little repetitive at times about his favourite topics!).

None and two. I'm 62.

Same. I don’t know any non-verbal children now, or know of any through friends and relatives.
I’d be thinking there are fewer now because most of the children I volunteered with had serious birth defects that would have been detected in the womb, and perhaps treated.

I grew up in the 1960s, so children who were non-verbal would have been filtered out and sent to specialised institutions. There were 'very shy' children at school (including me) who hardly spoke to anyone in the school environment. However, there was a strong pressure to conform, and we were labelled as 'shy', 'awkward' and 'sullen'. I spent a great deal of my childhood, wishing I could just go up and talk to other children, and feeling that I was a 'failure' because I could not.

I had some issues as a teen in the 70s and went to an adolescent unit where there were selectively mute children, but still I had not met any children who were non-speaking through autism or learning disability. I suspect children who could not speak by this age (except for those who had physical impairments that made it impossible to speak) would be in institutions.

I do not know much about the 80s, because I was catching up in life. However, my niece did not speak until she was 4.

My own children were born in the late 90s early 2000s. My eldest son's speech delay was identified by the health visitor who had worked with my niece. My mother in law then told me that my husband (her son) did not speak until he was four. She was a teacher and was scared that if he did not start speaking before he started school he would be considered 'ineducable' (an outdated term, but one based on an Education Act that had serious consequences for children with serious SEN before 1970).

So, at a guess, I would say there were a considerable number of non-verbal children in previous decades, but societal norms, legislation and the older predisposition towards institutional or residential provision would mean it would be unlikely that we would meet non-speaking people in our everyday lives, unless we had a family member who was non-speaking or we accessed or worked in the specialised contexts.

None and none.

I'll add that I was a secondary school teacher from 1980 to 2007 and didn't meet any in any of the schools I worked in, either.

Growing up, none.

As an adult, I've worked with non-verbal children for my job, so lots. But if I'm thinking more in my personal life, family, friends, neighbours etc... Also none.

Personally, I don't think children with those sorts of significant needs are as prevalent in society as social media would have us believe.

I think as a society, there's a lot more "out there" for families with children with those sorts of needs, and less of the stigma. Not THAT many generations ago, those sorts of children would have fairly widely been in residential institutions/care homes. There weren't the specialist provisions and government support that there is now.

None and none

I was minimally speaking (a few single words) at three, I went straight to grammatically correct sentences before four. I don't know any non speaking children now.

None and none

I don’t think institutions account for increased visibility because they closed 30+ years ago and the rise I’ve noticed/heard about seems to be relatively recent.

None growing up, but I know one now who was in my DD’s mainstream class and now attends a special school. I don’t think I even knew people could BE non-verbal when I was younger. I think mainstream was so different then with far less diversity, I have a high functioning ASD son who years ago would have been in a special school and now is a mainstream child. My kids are definitely exposed to more kids with wider needs and have a far greater awareness which is a good thing IMO.

I knew a lot growing up but our school had a ‘unit’ for sen kids.

I understand what you're getting at and the distinction isn't lost on me but there are no clear definitions that are universally accepted. Our conversation goes a little way to show that. My son used a high tech device and was still classed as non verbal, only when he loses that device and uses verbal/ spoken language will he be classed as a verbal communicator.

Non verbal in terms of autism is used as being non talking/ speaking in many of the level/severity descriptors usually associated with those with more severe autism. When people use the term non verbal it gives a general understanding of how that child presents (rightly or wrongly), by using non speaking rather than non verbal you're showing understanding of that undertone by wanting to differentiate.

My personal opinion is that we need many more clear descriptors especially around autism given how differently people present with the diagnosis. We shouldn't shy away from saying autism with severe mental health needs or autism with severe communication needs or severe autism or autism with social anxiety whatever (different discussion though for another day).

Just curious is your son hyperlexic?

Institutions may have closed but special schools have not. Also not all children go to school.