What do we think of ‘gingerism’?

[Nikee20]

It’s annoying me!
Why is okay to be not okay with gingers?
Today a colleague said ‘I have a new grandchild, but they’re ginger…for now . But the sun might bleach it.’

Is this okay to say ‘shut the F up’ or -

YABU - this is fine, be quiet

YANBU - this is shit

You need to think a little deeper. WHY do you think there is prejudice against redheads in certain parts of the UK?

What irritates me about these threads is people saying but ginger hair is lovely etc. That's hardly the point, who cares if you love it or hate it. Its a part of who a persons identity and unacceptable in any circumstances to poke fun at, no more than facial features or birth marks or skin tone. It needs to be called out. Every time.

Dh often points out that comedians on panel shows publicly ridicule gingers but wouldn't dare comment on any other physical features. Like it's always open season for gingers.

I also don't think having ginger hair is the same as racism, FGS. My children are mixed culture, and they have more grief about the other side of their heritage than mine, which is pretty obvious as I'm white, British and middle-class, not a notoriously disadvantaged group.

I don't believe there's a deep-seated hatred of people with ginger hair, any more than I believe there's a deep-seated hatred of people who wear glasses, which was also a reason for bullying at school. School bullying is common for lots of reasons, and once you get out of school, I don't think I've heard of anyone having significant issues.

The one paper which shows employment differences was a crappy experiment with fake CVs and profiles, I'm not sure that is replicable and doesn't show in real-life any disadvantage.

Perhaps I have my head in the sand, but the more you make 'gingerism' a thing, the more it is a thing. Just stop going on about it and treat it like someone who makes remarks about appearance, with a withering look.

Are you being deliberately obtuse?

It's ethnicity/national origin. I'm not sure why that is so hard to understand.

You can't just dismiss the legal status/definition because it doesn't suit you. That's patently ridiculous. Our whole society is based on a framework of laws and definitions contained therein. This fits so as much as you disagree it its racism by definition whether you like it or not.

I linked a study that said redheads were less likely to be hired, less likely
to be in a relationship and red heads seemingly earn less money for an immutable characteristic. Seemingly some people think they used to be disproportionately targeted during the witch hysteria. Also it seems linked to anti-Celt bigotry.

This seems kind of textbook, no? To acknowledge it doesn’t diminish racism and the like.

I say this as someone who has no chance of having a redhead in my genes 😂

It's disheartening at best and incredibly offensive at worst.

Some family members have suffered mercilessly due to hair colour than I ever have due to my skin.

i would have asked them why they were being such a cunt towards their own grandchild.

all -isms are Othering. And Othering is twatty behaviour.

But it’s not even close to the same as racism, and is now so far removed from Irish xenophobia, and it’s deeply offensive to compare the two

I don't think they are the same, but you are choosing to take deep offence.

If person A says - I have a right to dislike certain colours of hair, and broadcast my opinion

Then person B says - you think it's ok to put people down and tell them a part of their body is ugly. I wonder if you do the same with skin colours, do you have some you don't like?

How is that offensive?

Not every single reference to skin colour is offensive.

People do actually get mistreated, bullied, and historically even persecuted for hair colour. So it's not a trivial comparison.

I'm a ginge. I've had a life of people thinking it's ok to make negative comments about it. I started making offensive comments back, strangely people don't like that!

One of my favourites was when someone asked if I'd considered dying my hair as why would I want ginger hair? I asked if they'd considered a nose job as they looked like the Child Catcher. Apparently that was not OK!

@HunterHearstHelmsley

👏👏👏and also 🏆

I had assumed that it was less prevelant these days because there has been a small decline in anti-Irish racsim compared to e.g. the 90s, which is why I always thought it was less of a thing in the US as they tend to be less racist about the Irish more generally.

I remember it being very bad during the 90s/00s.

No. It was as big a thing in the US when I lived there. Definitely a negative association with having Irish/ Scots heritage. I was in Texas.

And let's not forget the horrid abuse Nicola from girls aloud got based on her ginger hair.
People are definitely bullied for having ginger hair. And I some statistics do show an unconscious bias against gingers. Especially boys. It also tends to come with pale skin and freckles which are also seen by many as unattractive characteristics. And no matter people on here saying 'I love ginger hair' doesn't change peoples experiences.

I wish people wouldn't faux fetishise it. Ds was bullied out of year 7 and had to be withdrawn from school for his own safety as he was bullied so badly and they'd shout foul ginger slurs at him.

It's miserable having ginger hair and I was disappointed in the maternity unit when I realised his was ginger. It looks pretty, but the negativity just isn't worth it. If you're ginger in a nice area or have a feisty personality you might not get any bother, but they eat their own young in my neck of the woods, so it was just too much for ds.

We think that they are jealous because we are kissed by fire.

I agree WP it’s fine if we don’t like a certain hair colour, that’s our own choice after all.I don’t care for black hair tbh and it would only be wrong of me if I told a black haired person that or made sarcastic comments about it.
people do seem to think it’s ok to make comments about ginger hair out loud to others and I think it’s got worse not better as time’s gone on.
A very small proportion of the world population has any kind of red hair, so you’d think it would be valued.My best friend at school had ginger hair had a long lustrous pony tail and I was dead envious!

And I think it’s much worse for boys with ginger hair nowadays.

While it may not be meant as a racist comment, it has it's roots in racism. Like anything, it's all about context. If a British person of Indian descent jokes about a Scottish person's ginger hair then they are being an asshole. If a white British person comments on an Irish person then it's not unreasonable to take it as something much deeper. It's generational too, I might bristle a bit and dismiss it, but my Dad remembers the open racism of his youth so to him it would be much more offensive.

Put it this way, in 50 years time if (hopefully) society is more open and blended and without institutional racism, will it be funny to joke about afro hair? If not then that's your answer.

This thread brought to my mind this case which was presented at a seminar I attended some years ago. As the legal bods say, each case turns on its own facts and context here in this case is everything. But I found it quite surprising at the time.

https://truthlegal.com/discrimination-claims-was-calling-an-employee-a-fat-ginger-pikey-banter-or-harassment/

It definitely can’t be compared to racism however I think some commenters don’t understand just how bad the abuse you can receive just for being ginger is. It’s much worse than a few jokey comments. I have ginger hair and absolutely hated it at secondary school, every single day someone (not just pupils, teachers too!) would make an unpleasant comment. My toddler DD has my hair colour and while she gets lots of lovely comments now, i’d be lying if I said I wasn’t worried for her and hope that she has a better time of it than me.

It's interesting people raise the issue of the associated skin colouring/freckles as part of the issue. I am very freckly- all year around- all over my face/shoulders/chest etc. I've never had any negatives comments about it (although I personally don't like them at all). The difference is I'm dark haired/eyed and also tan easily. My freckles are mainly mid/dark brown.

I personally find ginger hair beautiful although as others have said, this isn't the point. It's a disgusting prejudice and unacceptable that people are mocked and bullied for their hair colour/skin colouring.

How is it OK to "not like ginger hair"?

What does that even mean?

I remember the time I was walking my then five year old child home from school, and a group of secondary boys walking home shouted "ginger prick" and the like at him.

He didn't quite make out what they were saying or that it was directed at him and asked what the big boys were saying, so I pretended not to know.

As he's got older, he's had ginger this ginger that from pupils his own age. It's horrible.

I used to dye my hair to get rid of the ginger in it after getting bullied for being ginger at school, but once I had ginger kids I stopped, because why should I dislike and disguise a harmless trait I share with them?

It's racist and not OK.