Should father pay towards children when both parents on benefits

[SevenAteNineAgain]

I'm sure this will attract some 'you shouldn't have had children if you couldn't afford it's posts - I was working right up until I had my last child and realised that I had to leave my abusive relationship and was left caring for 4dc alone. If I hadn't been with a man who refused to wear condoms and regularly forced sex on me I wouldn't have had so many dc. But here we are.

So I have 4dc, 2 of whom are disabled and as they have got older their needs have become more complex such that I am unable to work because of their care needs.

I am extremely fortunate to own my house due to a family inheritance years ago, and after escaping I moved to a cheaper area so I could buy outright with equity from previous flat. Since I cannot work I get carers allowance, and other child related benefits. My two disabled dc get DLA which mainly pays for stuff they need due to disability. We don't have luxuries but we are currently ok.

Ex doesn't work due to mental health issues and gets PIP and other benefits. He stopped paying child maintenance a long time ago, saying he couldn't afford to pay it as well as paying costs for when he sees dc.

Every time he sees the dc he complains about how much it costs him, asks me to contribute, and says that I get money for the dc from the government and he doesn't, so I should be giving him money when he sees them.

Only 1 actually goes to stay with him ever, only for short periods during holidays. Others he sees for the odd day out here and there. Finding stuff that the dc actually want and can manage to do can be expensive since they don't want to just go and hang out with him at his house, so this is why he always complains that it's too expensive and asks me for money towards these activities.

For eg this holiday he took them to an activity and food which cost him £300 for the 4 of them (1 dc wouldn't go at all) and he has been ranting to me since that I have so much more money than him and it isn't fair etc.

I feel like they mostly don't stay with him, he doesn't pay maintenance, I pay all of their costs apart from activities when they see him - it is reasonable to expect him to pay for what he does when he does see them. AIBU? Does the benefits thing mean IABU?

A rapist and expecting tax payer to pick up tab for kids he fathered.

Yet another pos society drainer. Mental health my arse!

No OP, do not give this shit bag a penny.

You need to put in a claim. It won't be much but your children are entitled to it.

Women don't have the option to "allow" men to see their children or not. I don't know why this idea is perpetuated so much. In the case of this OP its a shame she can't just tell him to sod of. In other cases its a good thing the woman can't block contact for no reason and with 0 legal recourse for the man. But it is neither the case that hoards of women are using the misandrist family courts to stop doting fathers seeing their children out of spite. Or the case that neglectful parents like the OP are allowing rapists to see their children when they could easily stop it. Family law doesn't work like that. For better or worse.

This.

But yes, don't fund his (unnecessarily expensive) days out with the children. He basically thinks he should be paid to see his own children.

I'd provide him with a full breakdown of what it costs you to provide for your children and tell him when he pays half of that you'll rethink sharing the benefits.

He's a piece of shit.

I’m in a financially similar position, two disabled children and get carers allowance. My ex does pay me, about a quarter of what CM would make him pay from his wage. He also believes that I’m living some high life (forgetting I’m renting at twice the amount of his mortgage) and his token amount is more than enough as he cries poverty (then spends more on expensive man-toys in a week than I do on food in a month). I’d absolutely howl in his face if he expected me to pay him regardless of his situation, and in our case he’d never have the career he does or even his own house if it hadn’t been for everything I sacrificed (may be getting personally bitter here). I pay for everything the children need, at one point I was taking them with huge bags of clothes and such they needed for sleeping at his until I realised it was bloody ridiculous and told him to buy stuff for his own house.

So tell him to get stuffed - DLA is for the children and unless he can produce receipts of things he’s bought specifically for their needs (not wants) for his place, he has no right to their money.

It’s not just 'a shame she can’t tell him to sod off', he fucking raped her. He is a rapist who is allowed access to children. Like I said, he should be in prison.

Well yes, maybe shame is the right word. But I don't like the way people (not you!) will jump on women who have already been through something very traumatic and try to make them feel guilty for a situation outside their control. Its tied to this complete misinformation that's pushed about the family courts. Meanwhile: Family courts: Children forced into contact with fathers accused of abuse (bbc.com)

Outnumbered83 you can't be this obtuse surely? This is a totally unhelpful derail. Where this prick should be is completely by the by. She reported him, it was dismissed, end of story. What OP needs is support from us to help her stay firm she has done nothing wrong, which she hasn't.

Just grey rock him OP. He can bitch all he wants, remind yourself you you owe him nothing either morally or legally.

@Outnumbered83 If you don't like it then you can campaign to change the law. Or tackle face on the people who already truly believe the family courts are misandrist and that women can just make up abuse claims and stop men seeing their children or who peddle completely debunked myths around parental alienation. Its not fair to put this on the mothers.

@SevenAteNineAgain To get back on track, you have clearly done really well to come from very difficult circumstances to a situation where you and the children are doing OK, and have a secure roof over your head and where your children are well looked after and safe. I know you said you were lucky but it isn't just good luck. You are 100% entitled to the DVLA and other benefits - that's exactly what it is for and even my daily mail reading traditional tory family members wouldn't begrudge support for disabled children or their full time carer. Your ex is not entitled to the money in order to blow it at the arcades because he is too lazy to entertain his children. If 300 is nothing to you (unlikely) put it towards a nice holiday for you and your children. Don't give him a penny.

You shouldn’t have to co-parent like this with a man that raped you. I would go to court and have contact set up in a way that you do not directly have to deal with him. And no you should not be giving him money to take your children out, unbelievable that he’d even suggest that, he should be paying child maintenance, it isn’t much because he’s on benefits

Ffs. State of this country.

The op isn’t in control of any of that-

She didn’t allow him to rape her- he made that decision.

she isn’t allowing him to see them- the court made that decision.

She hasn’t decided he won’t be in prison- the justice system made that decision.

Don’t lay the blame for that bullshit at the feet of the women who are victims of it.

Would you like to expand further or actually add anything useful? What state of the country is particularly the OP’s fault or problem right here?

You mean like the advice I gave her to stop funding him while he sees the children?

I’m sorry, where exactly did I put the blame on the op for her rape? Quite the fucking opposite actually. I’ve since commented once she updated that it had been to court but hey, that doesn’t fit your narrative does it.

Without the mothers (not the op) reporting the abuse to the police, how is it going to change? This isn’t about women making up abuse claims, this is about a man who raped his partner and this subsequently lead to the birth of children.

He sounds quite stupid. Tell him you phoned the DWP to ask if that is the case and they said no. In fact they said he should be giving you money for maintenance. That should shut him up 😉

OP, you have enough on your plate and he is a piece of shit. Tell him to FOTTFSOFOAWYGTFOSM.

And then suggest that when he has the kids, he prepares a picnic and researches fun free activities. He won't, but hopefully the suggestion that he should pull his finger out will annoy him.

And put that CM claim in. It might not be much, but at least you can buy your DC a round of ice-creams every month and say "Look, your useless piece of shit dad paid for these. Isn't that nice of him?"

Sorry - this is probably obvious to anyone else but I'm just not very good at trusting my instincts. I just want to check - if he wasn't an abusive person and hadn't done what he's done - would it still be wrong of him to expect money from me to pay for stuff when he sees the dc?
I mainly ask because - in his head he has never acknowledged that he has done anything wrong, he appears to be genuinely in denial and to genuinely believe that he is the victim of a crazy woman who has made up stuff about him. I never talk to him about it, but he will send me messages talking about the past and trying to rewrite our relationship. He thinks that the police dropping the investigation means he has been found 'innocent' and he will periodically tell me that it's my fault he can't work because I went to the police and so now no one will employ him. He was arrested and assaulted a female police officer, which he was convicted of, but this is also my fault according to him.

I mean - it probably doesn't matter what he thinks, but I just want to check. Honestly - I feel really horrible about bringing up children with the role model of a non-working mother who has to rely on the government for money. I feel like a sponger.

No even if it was a normal relationship that ended normally etc you don't pay him to have his kids.
He should also be paying you the measly 7 per week out his benefits.

Don't feel like a sponger you've had it hard. Wasn't a choice

If he wants to be Disney dad, he needs to earn some Disney money.