To not accept this offer from ex to give the dc £10k and instead pursue CM

[stripycats]

I have posted about my financial arrangements with ex several times over the years (under different user names) and had loads of good advice. This morning he has made me an offer and I would massively appreciate some advice on it please. I'll try to be brief but backstory is obviously relevant but if anyone does have time I would love some advice.

I was main breadwinner in marriage (lasted 8 years, together for 10) and he had always been shit with money - was well into his 30s when we met with no career, which I had. He does bits and bobs of freelance writing and works on his music. He was a decent enough househusband when our dc were little. When we split our assets amounted to £30k and he had no hope of getting a mortgage alone so selling the house was never even mentioned and I bought him out and gave him £15k with an agreement to give him an additional £10k when ds2 is 21 (in 6 years time now). He wanted to move out as he wanted 'a break'. He never wanted to stay or be the one responsible for the dc. We had had money for a deposit from his dm but I had made all mortgage repayments and he had decided we should take a remortgage to fund improvements which were not essential. He also pushed for us to move to a bigger house thereby increasing the mortgage just a year before we split, despite knowing he was cheating. He didn't make a claim against my pension. We split 10 years ago and he has the dc around 4 nights per fortnight.

After the split it became clear he was never going to put his hand in his pocket for the dc beyond feeding them when they were with him. He still saw paying as my job. They had no clothes or toys there until I provided them etc. I tried to get him to pay for stuff like swimming just to make a contribution as things were quite tight for me then but he wouldn't so I opened a CMS claim, really just to make the point. There was a period of about 18 months a few years ago when he was paying around £100 per month but other than that he has either just not paid or they've said his income is too low to have to pay anything - that was after moving to direct pay. About 3 years ago he inherited approx £200k and bought a property outright. Nothing was given to dc.

My income has recently gone up following promotion but I'm on my own and solely responsible for everything financially. I earn approx £65k now and have around £20k in savings. Both dc are likely to go to uni in the next few years, which I worry about as on my income they won't get much of a loan. I have saved separately for that via their child trust fund things and both have around £9k in those, which, together with the £20k means we should be alright. But just. I recently told ex my fears about uni as he was talking about taking the dc away for a fortnight, which he has never done before and I questioned why he was contributing nothing if taking two week holidays. He didn't reply. What I really want is for him to write off the £10k and then I would be more than happy to pay all costs for the dc going forward, which I have been doing anyway but the £10k hanging over me is a massive issue and worry.

Today he has suddenly messaged telling me he has taken out a loan to help with the dc uni costs and has received a letter from the CMS saying he will have to pay £80 per week from now on. No idea why this would be the case as they wouldn't be aware of a loan would they and it wouldn't affect his payments anyway surely? So presumably along with the loan he has got some better paying work, though if he has I doubt it will last as it never does with him. Anyway, he is saying he will put £5k in each dc's bank account tomorrow if I cancel the CMS claim and say we have come to an agreement.

What should I do? I don't trust him. Why take a loan out for the dc at least a year before they need it? It would make more sense to tell me he doesn't want the £10k. I don't care about the CMS anyway and in any case I highly doubt £80 per week would last for any length of time so I have no issue with not having that, but I want the £10k cancelled. How do I handle this in a way that's fair to the dc and doesn't leave me vulnerable to his shit and irresponsible behaviour with money?
Thank you so much if you have read this far!

I'm generally a bird in the hand type of person when it comes to this sort of thing but 10k is a lot of money, and the sudden CMS liability - it all adds up to him coming into something significant somehow, and trying to avoid you finding out about it/contributing reasonably to the kids.

I'd do some digging before I agreed to it - check the companies register and stuff just in case maybe?

Does he do any cash in hand work? Could the £5k per child be dodgy cash? Pays dodgy cash into child's bank account, get's legit amount back from you when you pay the £10k later.
Otherwise, it makes little sense to receive £10k and then pay out £10k, whilst losing any CM - why would you do it?

@stripycats Based on my own experience with my equally useless ex husband who has never worked since out divorce, if the CMS are telling him her has to pay something, he has a job.

My ex is funded by his parents who bought his house (2bed so not enough room for our 3 kids) his car and provide him with a monthly income of around £2k according to his boasts.

That money will have hit his bank every month for 10 years and because he is unemployed and doesn’t claim benefits, CMS say he isn’t legally required to pay a penny. Even though they know he has this money.

I’m probably sneaky but I’d tell him I was closing the claim, let him pay the kids and continue the claim.

That said, my ex has put me through the ringer so I am bitter 😂

The only reason to actually try to work out what is happening is if you think there's any chance that, if he has miraculously come into some money and/or a well paying job, that he would actually meet his financial obligations. It sounds like even with CMS, he has not exactly been stepping up to pay his share and is in arrears?

In which case, twisting yourself into a pretzel to understand what's happening in the background is pointless. Tell him that you'll only stop CMS claims if he agrees to cancel the £10k you owe him in 6 years. If he also wants to give the DC money in short term, great. But that's nebulous. You need to know that you have a legal document saying that he has no financial hold over you going forward.

He’s come into money. he doesn’t want any responsibility for contributing to DC’s university fees or any significant CMS. If he gives you 10K, and you stop CMS claims, I have little doubt he would pursue the 10K you owe him.

Check with CMS about his assets and don’t agree to anything yet. If you have an agreement, get a solicitor.

He's hiding money he doesn't want you to know about.

Can you do sone digging on him or afford to pay someone to dig for you. If you find the money you can prove that he's lying to CMS and they won't be happy bunnies to know that.

I would contact cms yourself.
Log onto your portal and see any letters from them; you'll see how they got to £240 a month.

How is the 10K payment to him enforceable?

It sounds like either - he won't put the money in their account after you've closed the cms - and he's just saying he will.

How old are the children now? I'd work it out that £240 a month x 12 (1 year) - £2880 ..... paying that for 3.5 years makes 10,000 - so if you have to pay him 10,000 when your child is 21 - is that more than 3.5 years away?
Then how many more years does he have to pay for the both of them? Because that may alter the amounts above.

Also, why does he want you to cancel the cms so badly? That would be my main concern - he's hiding things! And probably doesn't want you ask the FIU team to look further into his accounts / dealings - I'm sure they'd find hidden money somewhere!

I don't think the CMS proactively seek people out to get them to make CM payments. They would only be looking into his finances if you someone makes a claim. So if you haven't made a claim it's either a scam, mistaken identity, or someone else has made a CM claim against him.

I don't think, based on the information that you've given us, that he'd owe you £80 a week in CM. I'd suggest he contacts CMS to find out why the letter was sent (if indeed it isn't a scam), but then he'll probably work out that he doesn't owe you significant CMS payment and withdraw his offer.

So should you take the £10K? Yes, if you're happy to effectively scam him out of £10K he almost certainly doesn't actually owe you. And only you know how detrimental this will be to your co-parenting relationship.

@mrsm43s
I think the op does have a claim with cms. It's just that it's always been zero...

But something has changed in the annual review, based on what HMRC have told cms.

He obviously has or will have a significant sum about to show on his tax return that will mean he pays more than the £10k he is offering

You mentioned that he previously didn’t pay CM when he was supposed to - could you tot up what he didn’t pay in the past and get that amount written off the £10,000.

This

It sounds like your ex is up to something. I would personally keep everything above board. Make note of every time he has t paid cms- he probably already please you 10k which would cancel out any claim he had on the 10k you have to give him... and frankly he would have to pursue it and you could defend it on that basis.

Why are you giving him £10,000 anyway when you bought him out of the house and gave him halc the assets at the time? Why an extra £10,000.
Considering he inherited 200K I'd take what he's offering and neither mention or pay the £10,000,spend it on kids uni instead.

Totally agree. You need to make sure cms keep the claim open and don't write anything off.

Then when he pursues you for the 10k, you'll have a bill for him from cms.

KEEP the cms claim. LIE to your EX and say you have cancelled the claim.... wait to see if you receive the 5k mean while... tbh I can't see him handing over 10k if he bought a house and your DC didn't see a penny... I doubt it very much.

5k is very little also.

He sounds like a slippery fish so I'd try to get to the bottom of where the money is coming from.

Thank you for all replies.

I think I am going to say that if he gives the dc the £5k each into their bank accounts AND gets the £10k legally written off then I will close the CMS case. He has £6k arrears (or did last time I checked years ago) and, afaik, I could claim for 2 dc for another 3 years and 1 dc for another 2 on top of that (until 20 and in f/t education) and I work that out to be about £11k if he were to be charged £80 per week for that entire time (which I doubt, but hey...). Therefore, the £10k to the dc and writing off the £10k for me would amount to his CMS liability past and future, and £3k extra to make up a bit for all the years he paid and owed fuck all because he was doing his own thing rather than working to support his own dc. If he goes for that I still think it would be a good deal for him but would also be a bit fairer to me than the current situation.

Obviously I won't be cancelling anything until the dc have their £5ks and I have some sort of legal document about the other £10k in my hand. Even then I may cancel the direct pay thing but keep the actual claim open.

Good Luck OP. That sounds fair.

Out of interest why was the agreement for an extra 10K when you'd already given him half the equity?

Just FYI, maintenance would stop of the year they leave school unless they are still under 18. It's not claimable up to 20 when at Uni, only up to 20 in non- advanced education, Uni is specifically excluded. I'm not sure if that affects your calculation?

Also, I wonder if the higher amount, which doesn't appear to be in line with his earnings accounts for the £6k arrears? Are they calculating that if he pays the £80 per week, he will have paid it all back including arrears by the time he stops paying CMS which will be 31st of August of the year the child leaves school?

I wouldn't entertain what you are asking of him if I was him, it would almost certainly be cheaper for him to just pay the CMS what they ask for. That said, he doesn't seem to know what be on the ball about this, so you might manage to manipulate him into giving you more than you're entitled to if you're comfortable with that.

@VeryStressedMum I think I have rounded up or down some of my figures, though not by much. So I think our assets weren't exactly £30k and were more like £35 or something. And I also think the figure he got at the time wasn't exactly £15k but was a bit less. Also, he didn't go for my pension, which is a fairly good one.

Ah yes, a quick google shows that CMS will take up to 40% of total income by direct pay in order to clear arrears in 2 years where possible. So the £80 per week is almost certainly clearing the arrears in two years as well as paying ongoing contributions (which end when the children leave school).

After 2 years or whenever his arrears are paid off, his ongoing CMS will drop to what it was before.

So the amount owed in total is probably less than the £10k he's offering, and certainly nowhere near the £20K you want.

Personally, I'd take the £10K he's offering as money in your hand (or your children's) is better than a CMS order that he may or may not pay.

@mrsm43s Are you ex?! You seem determined to see him pay as little as possible?

The Gov.uk page says as long as they are in full-time education and doesn't specify further than that?

No they haven't calculated anything to ensure he pays back the arrears as far as I know. He's had them for years as they were accrued during the first few years of the claim and, from all my dealings with them so far they seem to keep the arrears separate from all their other calculations. That may not be the case - I don't have any paperwork for this new liability he has yet.

I would be absolutely fine with getting whatever I can from him, thanks. The man has paid the grand total of around £1500 for two children across a period of 10 years. He came into £200k and didn't so much as offer to get some of their school uniform for the year (he got it in August). He does as little work as possible because he knows I'll always provide for the dc, while I often end up doing a 70 hour week , which I'm not really sure I can keep up for another 7 years as they go through uni. Yes, I'm fine with getting 'more' than I (well, the dc) am 'entitled to'.

So based on £80 a week that is 4,160 a year .

if he paid 3 years cms he would pay more than 10k .

I wouldn’t cancel any claim . I would take the cms payments . He definitely is looking for the better deal from himself … if you cancel the claim you are back to square one .