AIBU to feel sad about how the internet's turned out?

[GordonBlue]

It could have been a truly amazing information and cultural exchange hub but instead it's a sewn up monetized abomination where people shout at and con each other.

I was going through some old papers today and found web pages I'd printed in 1997, back when I still thought if you wanted to read something again you had to print it. They were from two different discussion groups. One was about Fibonacci number sequence in nature, the other was about a numerical interpretation of Shakespeare's sonnets.

I also remember the early days of file sharing, and the sheer joy of finding music including music you hadn't heard for years, where you could tap into everything and no one owned anything, there were no adverts, none of it was buttoned down.

I dunno, I just feel really sad that that's how things used to be on the internet and now it's all porn/ red pill /fake news/limited characters angry crap. AIBU to think we've fucked this thing up? Or am I an old lady shouting at clouds?

Yes there's lots of bad stuff, but the good stuff hasn't gone away - there's immeasurably more of it, in fact.

I have to say that in 1997 when we first got the internet in our house, there were plenty of people online sending dick pics through ICQ and we had Ask Jeeves, Joe Cartoon came about in 1998 so we were all putting virtual cartoon hamsters in the microwave and a frog in a blender. Porn was abundant, as were sex chat rooms. It's always been the best of things and the worst of things.

I used it mid 90s for studying and emails. Then it seemed just like a fancy database. We had a lecture at uni on the potential dangers of it, which at the time seemed ludicrous to me.

I think it's got to the point where it's easy to take the good stuff for granted and be really aware of all the crap and the really bad stuff.

Personally I think childhood would be better without it - but as an adult it makes life so much easier and better. Internet banking, online shopping, reading reviews before you book a holiday, keeping in touch with people where ever they are etc.

Yeah I think large corporations monopolising and monetising the web; the rise of algorithms, ubiquitous data mining and now AI; and the decline in quality and neutrality of the search engines, all served to destroy a lot of what made the early web have such potential.

I miss the early(ish, I'm talking about early 2000s) web too. It was so much more fun and interesting, I agree. But it was dangerous and gross and facilitated awful abuse and radicalisation even back then (I remember the 'Is Anybody Up' saga, I think that was what it was called, and unregulated 'thinspo' eating disorder communities populated mostly by teenager girls). The failure of governments worldwide and the big companies to tackle the growth of child sexual abuse imagery, bullying and radicalising extreme harmful rhetoric has been there from the beginning.

Oh, dear. Kind of making my point for me, really.

But that is exactly what you said! 😂

Sorry, YABU. It's bloody great all you have to do is filter out the crap. Same way as nobody reads the pages of adverts in a newspaper or magazine.

I am still a member of numerous on-line groups with loads of fascinating stuff and there are still Youtube channels which aren't run by desperate wannabe "influencers".

You need a better quality crap filter OP, that's all,

No, I was lamenting the loss of the forums that existed in those days, and the possibilities for the sorts of productive discussions that could be had.

For instance, anything and I do mean anything that you read on MN or elsewhere about NPD/narcissism - all the terminology, all the lore, all the books that have come out since and have popularised the terminology - was drawn from a particular forum where those terms originated: flying monkeys, grey rock, etc etc etc.

Those sorts of early days chatrooms and forums have gone; you can't even find them on the wayback machine. They have been replaced with other sorts, but it is not the same. Here I am on one now.

I love the internet. I love being able to look things up so easily. I'm currently learning a language which I'd struggle to using books. I'm a huge reader but love reading online.

I wish more could be done to stop the scammers and the evil shite that's out there. Social media companies need to be doing an awful lot more than they are.

It is what you make it. I remember when I was a kid I often had to get a bus to the library to look up things I was interested in. Now I have access to the entirety of all human knowledge on a small device in my pocket. The downside is that device also gives access to the entirety of all human stupidity as well. The trick is to focus on the signal and avoid as much of the noise as possible. That's down to the individual.

In fact - teaching about online safety is much higher than it was when I started online

Adults now are aware of the Internet and the dangers. More parents are aware and check their children's phones, know what to look out for etc. New worries are also easily communicated via the Internet to parents about what to watch out for

When I was a kid online, we didn't have Internet safety lessons, it wasn't taught in schools or clubs. We had unfiltered access to everything online and no-one was talking about what to look out for, what to be aware of, that porn was right there, that men would send dick pics and ask for pics and that you shouldn't lie about you age online.

Those of us who grew up lying about our ages know how dangerous and stupid that was and are advising our children about why they shouldn't do it etc

Internet is just a digital extension of the world. So it's going to have its good and bad bits.

Find the good bits and ignore the bad.

Depends on what you focus on. I use it very selectively .

@GordonBlue I'm sorry you thought you had to print things to be able read them more than once? Even my mum didn't think that and she's 65! How old are you?

@FrothyCothy Thank you for the link I'll look forward to spending some time looking at his Insta this later this eve! X

i don't think there is anymore crap/porn/fake news/anger in the world than there used to be. It's just more accessible now. In the past it was printed on paper in red top tabloids amd scandal sheets or on VHS etc and you had to seek it out. Now it's available after a few clicks.

that being said, I think the benefits of the internet outweigh the disadvantages.

You think, in the past, when people with fetishes were searching for a cannibal to eat them alive piece by piece they just popped an ad in the local tabloids?

lol . No obviously not. But I grew up in the sixties/seventies in Greater London when all we had to do was walk behind the Gents loo in the local park to see as much porn as I'll ever want to see. And in those days the pages were often stuck together with the previous users bodily secretions.

You're not being unreasonable OP, there's a lot to be said for that barrier to entry.

The optimism of the early Internet and its potential as a positive force in the world is long dead. Yes, its convenient for some things but we're like frogs being boiled as far as the effects on humanity are concerned.

Stuff like Instagram and Pinterest are becoming unusable due to all the silly AI art crap and bots.

I think the solution to this is to go back to the idea of centering internet use around real-life stuff.

Like, if you’re into knitting, have a real life knitting group, make a group that is for those users and have real conversations and share real pictures of real stuff on there. That’s basically the kind of thing I do.

As opposed to scrolling page after page of bot-generated fake knitting images on Pinterest.

I feel the same, it is such a disappointment.

Personally I feel that most of the internet is now just bots and anything good has been suppressed by Google's algorithm.

It's alike how they ruined radio. It was easy to have unique, interesting radio but before you know it, it gets monetised, monopolised and ruined.

Also, I feel like everything they promise will be good ends up actually shit.

Take cars for instance, people thought they meant freedom.

Now though, they are expensive and heavily regulated. You don't often have a choice whether to get one or not, traffic is anything but freeing. Parking is expensive. In a lot of ways, we actually have less freedom as our local services have been once again monopolised and have moved away.

I'm cautious about any new big tech that they try to convince us will improve our lives.

I have loved the Internet since I got on it back in 96, when I went to Cyberia, London's first internet cafe (near Tottenham Court Road IIRC). I started working in a university not long after and had Internet on my computer, I thought it was amazing. But it was deathly slow loading pages, and downloading anything was tortuous and probably virus-ridden (LimeWire!) I got a home pc from Tiny soon after, along with a load of disks like Flight Simulator, but I was there for the dial-up internet. It was all an adventure, from UseNet to ICQ, I have fond memories of Joe cartoon, crappy flash games and Dance I'm a pussycat. But anyone who thinks it was better then has rose tinted spectacles. There was loads of porn and it was so bloody slow, I do not miss waiting for pages to load! You really do have the world at your finger tips now, and I still think its bloody amazing.