To want my family to cut ties with my ex-husband?

[Oodiks]

in late 2021 I asked my husband to leave the family home because of the emotional damage he was doing to our daughter. He then filed for divorce, and we have been divorced since late 2022.

I've explained the damage he caused to my sisters and told them that he has not made any real effort to build a relationship with our daughter. She's 18 now and he didn't recognize her last 3 birthdays, or her school graduation, and hasn't sent Christmas gifts, or anything, but they, and my BiL, continue to be friendly with my him, talking on the phone and meeting him for lunch occasionally.

Am I Being Unreasonable to want him out of my life, including out of my family's life.

I'm not trying to control anyone, I'm hurt.

YANBU - I think some people think the world is black and white when it's not it's many shades of grey.

Why would anyone who cares about you and your daughter want a continuing relationship with someone who emotionally abused you both!?

YANBU. You say he's narcissistic so this is actually even worse than you think - because he's treated you, and more importantly, your joint DD, appallingly badly. Normal loving family members would therefore want nothing to do with him . But they do. So either they are not normal loving familiy members. OR, more likely, they have been, and continue to be, sucked into his bullshit. Because I'm trying to imagine a situation where my dad, for example, happily hangs out with DH when me and the DC have been left without his input for three years.

Does he pay CMS even?

I would be very concerned about what he's telling them. So when they say that it's separate to you what they really mean is that he's told them enough for them to believe that at the very least, there's equal issues/fault on both sides. Or even that actually YOU are the problem.

Let's not forget that one of the classic ways to spot a narcissist when you first meet him is when he tells you about his crazy ex who won't let him see the DC.....

I'm sorry, that's a rotten situation to find yourself in.

But this is about the pain of a divorce, the events which led to that, and a family member trying to rebuild their life, ideally with family support.

Not Gerry from the golf club doesn't like Charlie from the golf club so you can't either.

I suppose you can't stop them but I would be really upset about this OP.

OFGS

He's treating his ex and his daughter like shit and they're still playing Happy Families

If the separation was mutual and respectful then fine to keep in touch

This isn't that.

Also, just to add that this type of personality is astonishing good at ongoing manipulation of extended family and friends. I'll give you an example - DH's family all know how appallingly exBIL acted, and continues to act, including taking no responsibility for their DC, paying nothing etc etc etc. And yet.... he's so good at the subtle manipulation that he'll often precipitate an argument when her family are around and afterwards, they'll be all "well, she does do x or y" and every single time I have to come along and remind them that in fact, the reality is completely different. It's mindblowing.

They seem supportive and sympathetic, and then I don't see them for a while and find out they've seen him!! I'm baffled.

I'd cut ties with disloyal family members, op. It's what I've done, anyway. The day after my ex hit me and was arrested, my mother hugged him and said she would always love him because he's the father of her grandchildren. Things went downhill from there, she ended up siding with him in family court and lied about me to a social worker.

I've become very skilled at the grey rock technique, so even when she arranged Christmas meals with my ex and our dc, pretending I was the one with the problem and they were a happy family without me, I kept my rage to myself and didn't feed the drama. They all got bored quite quickly, and my dc saw through their nonsense so wouldn't play along. Thankfully we are all NC now.

Yes, and I hate that they're still taken in by his BS!!!

Another one saying yaNbu! Your family need to cut the cord. I'd be really angry and upset if my nearest and dearest didn't show me that loyalty.

Yes, and I hate that they're still taken in by his BS!!!

It's infuriating, I completely feel your pain. I actually considered therapy because I was finding the way he continues to manipulate everyone so frustrating and it was causing me a lot of distress, which I felt was RIDICULOUS as it's not like I'm in a relationship with him.

I really feel for SIl. Her MH (and her finances) is destroyed and the really really sad part is she's still not completely free of him, including in her head.

He hates me with a passion because I not only refuse to buy into his shit, I am constantly pointing it out to everyone else.

If they can't see the problem, they are part of the problem. Your DD must feel so betrayed. I would limit contact with them and eliminate ANY discussion of your or your DD's private activities, thoughts, feelings etc.

If my sister asked me not to have cosy lunches with the man who inflicted pain and suffering on her and my DN, I’d be fine with it.

This is purely hypothetical though because she wouldn’t ever have to ask. I wouldn’t want to be friendly with someone who caused my family distress.

Why would you be ok with it?

Interesting.

So far, 1 out of 3 of you would be fine with an abusive ex remaining in close contact with your family.

I think that the 1 out of 3 are the people identifying with your family, and not with you. They are all about "I won't be told who to be friends with so neither should OP's family". Completely missing the part where you shouldn't have to ask them because they wouldn't want to be friendly with someone who has abandoned their under age family member.

I imagine these are the same kind of people who like to nod sagely and say, "where there's smoke there's fire" as they hear yet another story from some man about his crazy ex....

Also, narcissistic men are very very good at targeting a certain type of women. One who has been brought up to believe her needs/wants are secondary, to be deeply empathetic of other people's perspectives, to believe in compromise, to want to help other people etc. Also an over-inflated sense of responsibility.

So the family, by definition, is likely to be inclined to believe she is the problem or that she should do certain things....

I voted YABU - not because I'd be fine with it, but because I'd accept I can't stop who my BIL remains friends with and I'd drive myself crazy if I let myself care.

Your ex is clearly a dick. I'm glad you and your daughter are free of him. If your BIL can't see that, just shake it off and carry on living your toxic-ex-free life.

YADNBU X

I wouldn't be happy about it and I'd be withdrawing contact with them if they continued contact with him. Bear in mind that if he's a convincing liar, he's probably filled their heads with all sorts of lies about you and blamed you for his daughter's rejection. A lot of people think there's two sides to every story. It's a shame and I'm not surprised you're hurt. I don't think I'd want much to do with them.

My mother was the same, so full of understanding for my poor bastard of an ex. Needless to say that ended any trust I felt for my mother and although he is no longer in contact with him, I will never be able to see her on the same way. It felt and still feels like a betrayal, and yes, I also had to become very careful of what I said because my mother would always managed to spill the beans with my ex even if that would put DC and I at risk.

His mother on the other hand, was really nasty to me until she realised she had been unfair and after some years contact was re established as she wanted to be more involved on DC’s life. The moment my ex knew she was in contact with me, he cut all ties with her.

People who do not have families like these might not understand your point but, if your family’s attitude to your ex is hurting you, remember that then you shouldn’t care much about what they think or feel guilty about distancing yourself from them.

I’m still in loose touch with my sister’s ex. He’d been part of the family for over 20 years. So like a big brother to me. From what I understand the break up was pretty bad but honestly I don’t really care.

Some key differences (I hope) from your situation… my sister is bat shit crazy and when they broke up I wasn’t having anything to do with her. Did I mention bat shit? Yeah at the time they were both alcoholics… he has since stopped the self-destructive behavior… she not so much.

And lastly (this one is probably similar to your situation) their relationship was totally different than the one I had/have with him. I’m not an extension of my sister but a person in my own right.

so you have consciously chosen your sister's ex and maintain a relationship with him, but not her. That is not the same as OP's situation. Although frankly, I still find this a bit bizarre, but obviously, family dynamics are complex.

Well so far he hasn’t called me at 3am belligerently drunk to scream at me and tell me I’m a horrible person while I’m on the phone with the hospital about my dying mother. (Seriously the bat shit crazy title I used twice wasn’t a clue that just maybe she’s off the rails? And truly I don’t think there is anything wrong with her mental health… she’s just a truly miserable person)

If he did.. I’d reevaluate that relationship as well to be fair.

But this is derailing… I did not bring this up in the thread to say this is in any way comparable to the OP’s situation. But to explain to others that ‘can’t imagine how a family member could do this’ or ‘find it bizarre’ that this can happen. I’m sure if asked the family members would have their reasons for staying in touch, that probably doesn’t have anything to do with the OP.