The age of conscription should be lowered to 16

[Lovepeaceunderstanding]

The world looks much less stable than it has for a long while. In the event of war our depleted armed forces will need all the help they can get. We should lower the age of conscription to 16?

All something much more sinister!

Yes, I wonder which country the OP is posting from, I do wonder….

Yes there is weapons handling in the cadets. No it's not a new thing to prepare kids for war by stealth. Air cadets get flying experience too but a few hours in a glider doesn't mean the government are about to put them in a fighter jet and point them at Russia.

Why does it surprise that military skills are taught in a military group?

Extract from the Army Cadet website:

*One of the most exciting activities you’ll get to do in the Army Cadets is shooting. It is the main activity that differentiates the Army Cadets from most other youth organisations. Learning about shooting will teach you a number of key skills, the most important of which are discipline and safety awareness. It also brings with it a great sense of achievement.

As a cadet you will learn to shoot accurately using a range of cadet rifles but you will not be allowed to shoot any rifle until you have demonstrated a full understanding of the use of the rifle and the vital safety procedures.*

They trained and in a controlled environment, not handed a gun and told to see what they can hit.

In cadets in the 00s we were learning to shoot rifles, flying, first aid, navigation, field and survival skills, fitness tests and training, drill, aviation knowledge resulting in a Btec in Aviation studies etc many of my peers received their Private Pilots License etc.

The air cadets was developed in the 1940s inorder to supply better trained personnel and many cadets took on domestic war time duties. Not that anyone was forced to join but it meant personnel weren't starting from scratch.

Thanks for clarifying, that's really helpful

Oh did half term start early for you?

Yes totally agree.

Surely if you need numbers, conscription needs to include those who are 60+. The birth rate has fallen, the baby boomer generation is one of the largest.

My earlier post questioned what, in particular had led @Lovepeaceunderstanding to think that a serious conflict was approaching that would not be managed or contained by existing forces.
Sweden has organised a Civil Defence Organisation which is focussed on Resilience. We are a very different country, they are closer to Russia and they have a very spread out smaller population than us. Perhaps we need a similar organisation?
Details here: /www.government.se/government-policy/civil-defence/this-is-civil-defence/#:~:text=Civil%20

Whilst my children are younger, I see the Yr11s walking to school who would be about 16 and they're very much still babies. Too young to vote, drink, drive, get married and get a mortgage. I don't think they know enough of the real world and sending them to war would no doubt cause some irreversible damage. I even think 18 is too young to an extent.

Well I would suppose the usual way in which disobeying the law is dealt with - the courts.
In my country, if a man totally refuses national service (so won't do military or civilian service) he goes to prison or house arrest.

Interesting, my old neighbour was conscripted in the 1950s and was sent to Korea, nobody really wanted to be there so they would deliberately disobey officers. He punched an officer as he knew he would be sent home to military prison and he said that was preferable.

Cadets have always done weapons training. No near to fear monger.

You have to do a course first to learn the history of the weapons, how to use them safely, how to clean them and to be signed off. Then you go to a heavily supervised range and fire them at paper targets. The rifles are old and heavy .22s, single shot not hand guns. It is great fun and a real achievement to get your marksman.

None of my friends ever turned into gun wielding maniacs, however I am still a fantastic marks(wo)man which is fun to suprise people with when at venues with air rifle type activities the look on DDs face when she saw me hit the targets was very funny.

Those types of rifles with correct training are no more to be feared than arming a child with a bow and arrow. If the individual is not disciplined not follows the procedure they are removed from it immediately.

That certainly sounds preferable!
But not preferable here, conscripts aren't getting sent to war here, they're just learning the skills and networking (very helpful for finding careers later on), so not many people refuse.

Oh yes, I would imagine that is totally different.

no they shouldn't
Have you been in the military? are you going to sign up?
if no what is your excuse reason?

no.
Germany used to have conscription, not everyone was elligible, and it was only boys. And if you could opt out of the military and do social type service (care homes, driving people to medical appointments etc etc)

then they stopped it and introduced a "social year" open to all. And they have recently said that if/when conscription returns there will not be exceptions for trans women since they are men.

It has zip all to do with the recent passing of self ID laws.

eh? as i've said here before: i spent some time in the Cold War keeping the 3rd Shock Army rolling across the north German plain towards overrunning the UK.

You're welcome.

another point about German conscription, it is technically suspended as pp said (since 2011) but even the concientious objectors, and those who now do the FSJ (free social year, voluntary and open to boys and girls) get paid. Not much but they are literally not, under the German constitution, allowed to force anyone to work for free.

Norway has it for both m and f age 19+

As do a lot of African countries

Because today's 16 year olds are so emotionally mature, level headed and follow instructions so well you want to give them weapons?

Again, are you a British old man that as conscripted?

I'm against any form of non-voluntary military conscription.

We spend shitloads on our nuclear deterrent and should benefit from the fact that it's there to protect our children if we ever got into a situation where the homeland was under threat. This should negate the need for our youth to have to fight in Europe (ie be forced to) as happened in the world wars.

We might have to contribute to a NATO force but it should be the professional skills that our army specialises in. And, quite frankly, there needs to be more public support for our armed services and we need to look after those who choose to serve. It's embarrassing how it is at the moment

WE DONT HAVE IT!!! You’re arguing about something that doesn’t exist and as I’ve already pointed out, both men and women are able to join the Amy. But as a side point, who do you think decided only boys and men should be called up in the past? I’ll give you a clue, it wasn’t women.

@Dotjones

A good idea would be to make the minimum term for the non-military version be double that of the military version. This would encourage more people to "voluntarily" go down the armed forces root.

Why? I volunteered in homeless shelters during my gap year. Why is that less valuable than National Service in the armed forces? Why is forcing people who don't want to be there into the armed forces a good idea?

@Higglings

Prisons have veterans in them, sometimes for very violent crimes. There's research that they are more likely to be in prison for violent and/or sexual crimes. I've worked with veterans who have, for example, committed murder. Trauma + training = not good. Your 'discipline' theory is just wrong. pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31779726/