To think fat equals lazy to prospective employers

[Oldfatbrenda]

I've been to a few interviews lately and I can't help feeling at a disadvantage because I am fat. I'm a size 20/22 for context. I think we larger people are judged for it whether it's conciously or not. AIBU? I also feel this because I'm mid forties.... So a double whammy.

Assuming you’re talking about non-physical jobs, then I think it depends what you mean by ‘fat’. I don’t think many employers would judge a woman who was a size 22 as lazy, but I think they might judge a woman who was a size 32. Which is very unfair because obviously it has no bearing on someone’s ability to do a desk job.

There comes a size point where it’s harder for women to get interview-appropriate clothes. Again, not an issue for someone who’s eg a 22, but I have an acquaintance who is pretty much the largest size available in plus size shops (so size 30+) and her clothing options are really limited - there’s almost nothing that’s tailored and most shoes she can wear are stretchy flat slip-ons. So she’s kind of limited to applying for roles in places where you can wear a casual jersey dress or a maxi skirt and a loose top to an interview. It shouldn’t be that way, of course.

Except, it's not remotely possible to go from female to male or black to white. But it is possible to go from fat to thin. 'Going on a diet' may have been proven to be ineffectual, but a long term strategy of eating the foods ones body needs in the quantities it needs will for the vast majority who don't have a medical condition, result in weight loss. Very few people are 'fat' as a fixed characteristic in the way they are female or black.

It doesn't seem to be possible (at a meaningful, population level) to go from fat to thin though. Check the statistics on this if you don't believe me. People try so so hard, spend money, are very unhappy in their fat bodies but still remain fat.

I am not sure that employers think a fat person is lazy. But I think there is definitely an instinct to hire thinner "more attractive" women. There is absolutely bias towards overweight people.

It's not insurmountable, but I don't blame you for feeling it. I am a size 16-18 and definitely feel it. I have a possible interview for a job soon and I'm already agonising over what to wear.

I've heard it said that most people have unconscious bias towards fit and lean people.

It takes dedicated hard work and sacrifice to maintain fitness and a lean physique therefore when a person walks in the room you can see the results of their hard work instantly. You can't buy fitness so it is an obvious indicator of consistent hard work.

I was at a conference last week where an obese global CIO was on the stage then joined by lean fit colleagues. I have to confess I found my mind wondering to how he could be a credible leader when he didn't go to the gym.

I have to confess I found my mind wondering to how he could be a credible leader when he didn't go to the gym.

This is ridiculous when there are so many slim and healthy people who have never been inside the doors of a gym in their lives.

It will depend on lots of things but you do wonder if employers are mindful of it. The people who take the least sick leave are younger males. They don't get pregnant and don't suffer age related or menopause related illnesses. Unfortunately men are also much less likely to take sick leave that women for mental health related issues.

These stats are amplified in certain sectors such as NHS etc.

You can explain the stats in all sorts of ways but the end result is the same.

You have to wonder how much discrimination goes on.

Losing weight, and keeping it off, is incredibly hard as it involves wholesale significant changes to your lifestyle that many folk are not prepared to do. Instead people get temped by fad bullshit diets and mickey mouse exercise regimes that are sold as quick and easy fixes but are ultimately doomed to fail.

Im a coach and I have seen hundreds of people join my rowing clubs learn to row courses over the years and everyone who has completed the course had lost significant weight. These are often people who have done very little exercise for decades and have decided to do something about it insofar as signing up to a new exercise regime and making alterations to their diet. It is possible.

There is definitely prejudice. I’ve had clients who have told me in varying degrees of “recruitment code” that they want slim candidates.

The industry I recruit for hires slightly more women than men and between “must be extremely well presented” and requests for “fit and healthy as a lot of running around” and everyone wants to see a sick record from previous job. One former client was very clear that fat candidates shouldn’t be presented for 1st round as they wouldn’t make it to a second, reasoning being there would be someone equally good at the job with equally good experience who would be less likely to be unwell but it was clear that aesthetics were the lead reason so we declined to work with them on roles.

To be clear, while more women than men get placed, this industry applies their fattism to men too.

I agree.

I wouldn't hire someone significantly overweight, nor would I employ someone covered in tattoos.

It depends on whether the employer is a shallow moron or not.

From personal experience, I do think you are treated differently if you are overweight. I was 5.5 stone overweight for a period after having children and lost it over lockdown. The difference between how I was treated before and after was marked. People’s general attitude towards me is far more respectful now I’m no longer overweight.

Of course everyone’s experience is different, but it wouldn’t surprise me in the slightest if interviewers are biased against overweight candidates.

I think ageism probably plays a part too in that if an employer is going to employ and overweight candidate, they'll probably want a younger overweight person than an older one, as younger tends to equal fitter in a lot of people's minds.

Indeed.

That is why being thin isn't a reliable indicator of health either. You can have a normal bmi and have all sorts going on internally.

Additionally some overweight individuals will remain overweight no matter how dedicated they are. It's far too simplistic and tbh ignorant to make judgements based purely on weight.

I didn't say it was easy. Simply that for the majority its not impossible. Its just very challenging because it involves hard work, self sacrifice, time, plus head space that many can't afford, and all within a society with an attitude to food that acts as a hindrance rather than a help. However, being very over weight is also hard, in my personal opinion, far harder than managing my diet, so I think it is important that people don't get the message that, well that's tough, you're fat, that's who you are, so you need to accept the discomfort and unhappiness it causes you; when for most of us its a case of 'choose your hard'.

Half the population seems to be fat. If that's the criteria for not employing someone a lot of people will be unemployed. I got a decent office job after two years of being home nursing a sick rello age 50+ and I'm fat. Act confident, keep trying and good luck.

I suspect some of this may be down to your confidence - if you aren't feeling your best, this is possibly noticed in your interviews, rather than your weight. Obviously, nerves at interviews are understandable, but if you're projecting a lack of confidence in yourself, this is likely to affect things.

If you're able to, go shopping with a friend and find an interview outfit that flatters you and makes you feel fantastic. There are definitely clothes out there that will - sometimes it's worth exploring options and stepping out of your comfort zone.

I've interviewed a fair amount of people by now and I'm not at all bothered by their size - all I'm interested in is their ability to do the job well and their personality.

Yes this definitely happens.

Some people make all sorts of value judgements connected with being overweight including laziness, mental and physical, lack of self discipline etc.

I found this to a horrible extent when employed in an office job in my early 30s in a very macho environment. I had put on weight due to some essential neuro medication and was about an 18-20.

The extent to which I was treated differently to the other women my age was noted upon by colleagues. I was attractive and well dressed, definitely not scruffy, just temporarily overweight and was absolutely judged for it. I remember discussing a sport with a particularly obnoxious colleague and his disbelieving expression that I would have any experience of something like that.

Not every workplace is like it so I'd suggest if your face doesn't fit for whatever reason, move on unless it's a truly unmissable opportunity. But rest assured this is a real thing, you're not imagining it.

From the BBC article posted above:

“The findings were part-funded by pharmaceutical company Novo Nordisk, which makes the weight-loss injection that the NHS is now prescribing.”

Interesting.

And yes, there’s research to show that fat people are disadvantaged by this sort of thing. Weight stigma and fat phobia exist and it doesn’t just affect employment.

Subconsciously we do tend to "fear", for want of a better word, people who are considerably overweight/ obese. We aren't afraid of them but of the possibility that we may become them.
And the same goes for extremely underweight people.

When it comes to offering a job to someone I presume it would depend on the job as to how much of a difference it made, with some jobs being almost impossible for a person far outside the normal weight zone to get, and others having a smaller difference.

OH has a team member who is very obese. She sits on her chair all day and says she can't to things that involve bending down or stretching up so everybody else has to do all of these things. On their busiest day of the year, it was decided that everybody would take turns behind the counter and out on the floor helping people. She announced that she wouldn't do it and sat on her chair all day.

@Willyoujustbequiet
That is why being thin isn't a reliable indicator of health either. You can have a normal bmi and have all sorts going on internally.

That's obviously true for some people but as a group people who are overweight, or obese are more likely to be unfit and take quite a bit more sick leave than people who are normal weight.

It's not an insignificant difference.

@LoveRules That's a really weird thing to wonder. Do you expect CEOs to go to the gym as part of being a CEO? What about roles below CEO - at what point does the gym stop being an expectation?

I know this is merely anecdotes and not data but I go to the gym and am a size 20. I don't claim to be fit, I am fat and I know it affects me... but I am fairly strong and have good endurance. My best mate is a size 10 but has myriad health problems and is too weak and chronically fatigued to go to the gym - her body simply isn't strong enough. She doesn't eat much though, because her body reacts badly to many foods. Is she more deserving of CEO than me? (In reality neither of us would want senior management roles, far too much stress.)

Yes, but often not in the way that would directly impact an employer. Employers tend to be effected by people who take a lot of odd sick days for colds, bugs etc, and increasingly for issues related to MH. The type of health problems linked to obesity tend to be the more serious ones that often take people out of the labour market altogether, or cause disability, and often don't hit until later in life.