To think it’s unacceptable to expect a 16 year old to work an 8 hr shift and stay an additional 2hrs because they’ve been busy?

[peggysue82]

DS1 (16) recently started working as a pot washer at a local pub. It’s his first job, and after a tricky couple of years with him we are really pleased he is doing something positive. However, it feels like they are taking the piss with their expectations of him at times. This week he has been asked to work 2 x 2-10 shifts and 2 x 4.30-10 shifts, but they seem to think that it is acceptable to expect him to stay until all the work is ‘done’, so when it is busy there is much more to clean and he is expected to work past closing time. Tonight for example, he has just called to say that he doesn’t think he will ready to be collected until gone midnight, he has been there since 2pm. They know he is in the middle of his GCSEs at the moment and that he isn’t able to make his way home alone as we live about 15 mins drive and there are no buses, so he is reliant on me or DH picking him up. It just feels like such a big ask of him when he is so young. When he has asked to finish a bit earlier their attitude has been, ‘if you don’t want to work then we will find someone else who does’. Am I being unreasonable to expect them to be a little less demanding on a 16 year old?

This is what's expected if you work in hospitality. When I used to work pubs we didn't get paid for the extra time either. Retail is pretty similar but they close earlier over all and in retail I always accrued the time if I wasn't paid. That said, I'd be worried about his GCSEs too.

Urgh hate attitudes like LL91 that you need to put up with bad treatment in the workplace is a terrible message for a teen!

He needs to prioritise his exams.

I’d tell him he’s done a brilliant job, and he’s gained great experience which he can use when he’s finished his exams, but for now he needs to focus on them.

when I was doing my GCSEs I was out raving every weekend til 7 in the morning!

Im sure plenty of kids spending similar time gaming

I would take this as a great lesson in standing up for your rights at work. good for him getting out and working

Hospitality worker here, in general if he's looking for pubs/restaurants evening shifts then finish times are likely going to be a bit unreliable as it does depend on the level of trade. However until he's 18 he shouldn't be working past 10, or over 8 hours so it's bad planning on the pubs part. Given that they are breaking employment laws already he is probably better off looking elsewhere (perhaps report them as well).
Don't let him be disheartened if it is tricky finding another one, because of the limitations on under 18s it can be harder to get hired if you aren't allowed to do everything the pub needs.

No, you need to be the adult and sort this. GCSE results follow you and his exams are the priority.

This pub is illegally exploiting your child. This isn't time for hand-wringing haplessness. You need to extract your son from this situation, report the pub, and support him to find a decent job somewhere else (after his exams). They don't hold the power. They're breaking the law and they're assuming you'll just ignore it so they can continue to benefit from cheap labour at the expense of your son's wellbeing.

Do some power poses or something and deal with it.

DD did pot washing at our local last summer for a couple of weeks (this was AFTER GCSEs though). They were terrible and were trying to make her work all day every day for £5 an hour or whatever was the minimum wage they can get away with for that age. She also got shouted at by the knob heads who were in charge for the slightest mistake. Came home in tears several times. She soon decided the money wasn’t worth it and got another job in a cafe on Saturdays - she loves it there.

We made our DD leave a job in White stuff because they were taking the piss. All the 17/18 year olds, had the worst rotas, including working all of Xmas Eve, Boxing Day, NYE etc etc. They were told if they didn’t like it they could leave, so about 4 of them did, the week before Xmas.

It's not the law that's changed, it's the legal age in which you can leave full time education. 2011 was the last school year to be let loose at 16 to get a full time job (without an apprenticeship) as an alternative to further education.
David Cameron increased the age to 18, so the law is technically the same for children in education as a priority, just he changed the ages for full time education.

OP point out the law via text/email some kind of writing - if your DS does get the boot, then explain that you will take it to tribunal. Casual staff should still receive a wage slip, and you would absolutely win on the basis of child labour laws which will cost them thousands.

Or get your DS to leave quietly, and civil with no mention of laws and then blow the whistle once he's quietly out the door into a new job.

I don’t think it’s legal for that age to work past 10pm. My DD worked in Tesco at that age and they were sticklers for this until she was 18. Her first job mind at a soft play venue used to keep the young staff for hours after closing on no additional pay.

You need to be the parent here and stop him from working those hours during his GCSEs. If he fails his exams, that's likely the kind of job he'll be doing for the next 50 years. Is that what you want for him?

He needs to quit and focus on his GCSE's.

I worked for somewhere like this, absolutely horrific. I remember getting a black mark against my file for not coming in because someone had rang in sick. The reason I didn't come in: I was at school waiting to sit my maths GCSE 🙃

Please be aware, as the Pub are letting him work longer hours than are legal for a 16 yr old he will not be covered by their workplace insurance. I know of a young man who lost the use of his arm while doing underage work who received no compensation. It was a life changing injury for him. If he’d been working legally he would have received 1000s x £.
Professional kitchens can be hazardous places.

DD worked in McDonald's in the summer after her GCSEs and she quit after similar crap. Making her stay until midnight to fill things up when she finished at 10pm, making her work loads of extra shifts finishing late and starting early back to back. She pointed out the law but they weren't interested so she quit. She wasn't even at school anymore and she was knackered...

@TheaBrandt not excusing bad treatment at all. From OP’s post it looks like the issue is the overtime which is completely standard in the service industry.
If issue really is GCSEs then this should have been thought of before this and time off should have been requested.

I’d actually be the first person to advocate for someone if they thought they were being mistreated in the workplace. I rushed back from my parents house 2 days after my grandfather’s death because work wouldn’t allow me time off because he wasn’t a ‘direct family member’. I was scheduled for a 10 hour shift, stayed an extra 2 and then when I asked to leave was told they needed me for probably another 2 hours. I went into the office and cried because I didn’t know what else to do, I was 19 and full time at uni while trying to support myself. This was right after I’d just been forced to work almost a year with a (now convicted) sex offender because I’d have no money for rent if I quit and I couldn’t find another job - I discovered a phone he’d put in one of the toilets at work. I was working with the police to help convict him while watching my boss lend him devices at work because the police had confiscated all his electronics.

Please don’t assume I’m over here just saying to suck it up for no good reason. But I do believe that as a first job in the service industry he will be expected to stay until all the plates are clean - the business owner isn’t going to finish the washing up at 11pm if it’s not done! I do also believe that jobs like this teach you respect for service industry workers - to this day I scold my mum when she is rude to waitresses as she’s never worked a day in her life and it shows.

If working overtime is an issue then shop work may be more suited? But definitely less fun!

Honestly for the sake of his GCSEs I’d tell them they can shove their minimum wage job up their arse.

it’s on his CV, it’s experience. When asked why did he leave a very honest to concentrate on GCSEs is all he needs to say.

Unless you all need the money as a family, he needs to focus on his GCSEs.

I totally agree he needs to concentrate on his exams and they shouldn't be flouting working regulations.

The pot wash is integral, they don't just wash plates, they get supplies, they ensure pots & pans are cleaned ready for the next meal to be cooked, they keep the chefs areas clear and tidy, they sort bins and cutlery for waiting staff - they stop and then everything stops. Nice to see people calling it a shit job, it's vital to smooth and effective service overall and I bet some of those saying that would have full expectations of that smooth and effective service happening wherever they decide to go.

But, this is totally normal for hospitality as an industry, it's not right but it is how it works. Because it's customer driven. People want as low prices as possible, accuse businesses of being greedy if their prices are higher, want to be able to be spontaneous, want the service there when they want it and want it to be good - but only if it's someone else/someone else's loved one providing that service when it's crap money, long and unsociable hours and poor conditions.

This is why the hospitality industry is struggling for staff, that and the way hospitality workers are treated by management and customers alike.

The hospitality industry needs to change if things like this aren't going to happen, but that's going to affect the way service is delivered, which people would be complaining about. That or they will just employ older people - then people will be complaining the young ones can't get a start and of course higher prices to cover the higher wages.

@peggysue82

They probably don't realise unfortunately not everyone who runs restaurant and pubs know the law or abide by it.
In all areas of pubs eg a food hygiene.

Unfortunately my personal experience is that they will use and abuse him and won't be care.

I think you need to have a big talk with him and show him the legal side and tell him he's better than this.

It's not worth risking his exams. No way could by currently gcse dd cope with that.

This is the expectation of a pot washer - yes, they and the KPs are the last out due to all the cleaning needed. He literally got a job at the worst possible time for his academics. This is not the publican's fault. Does he care about the GSCEs or is he focused on a career in hospitality or similar? It seems a very odd way to go about things from my perspective and both my DC has jobs from age 14 onwards, but by GCSE time had built up great relationships with their bosses so could swap their shifts to fit with the exam pattern.
It is not your sons employers job to care about his GCSEs, in short, they care about their pub!

Could you not sue the fuck out of them? I’m from the States, but this is extremely illegal over here.