To think it’s unacceptable to expect a 16 year old to work an 8 hr shift and stay an additional 2hrs because they’ve been busy?

[peggysue82]

DS1 (16) recently started working as a pot washer at a local pub. It’s his first job, and after a tricky couple of years with him we are really pleased he is doing something positive. However, it feels like they are taking the piss with their expectations of him at times. This week he has been asked to work 2 x 2-10 shifts and 2 x 4.30-10 shifts, but they seem to think that it is acceptable to expect him to stay until all the work is ‘done’, so when it is busy there is much more to clean and he is expected to work past closing time. Tonight for example, he has just called to say that he doesn’t think he will ready to be collected until gone midnight, he has been there since 2pm. They know he is in the middle of his GCSEs at the moment and that he isn’t able to make his way home alone as we live about 15 mins drive and there are no buses, so he is reliant on me or DH picking him up. It just feels like such a big ask of him when he is so young. When he has asked to finish a bit earlier their attitude has been, ‘if you don’t want to work then we will find someone else who does’. Am I being unreasonable to expect them to be a little less demanding on a 16 year old?

I voted YABU because that is the expectation in a job like that - you can't just leave the dishes unwashed for the next day. I also think doing some age-appropriate hard graft is a good idea for teenagers - a taste of the real world in a safe environment.

But he shouldn't be doing that job right now, during exams. I've no idea how difficult casual jobs are to get right now, but if he possibly can I'd tell him to quit now, get through the exams, then get another job. It's probably a shitty place to work for, he might find somewhere better now he's had a bit of experience.

They are awful employers but kudos to your boy for working so hard at such a God awful job. It’s much harder than people think. It will stand him in good stead.

I agree you need to step in and ensure he takes time off. Extra long shifts are illegal - point that out to the pub.

At 16 he is still a child that you are responsible for - what a shame for his exam results to suffer for the sake of a minimum wage job.

Those hours are far too much (regardless of overtime) while he is at school, when his education and exams are priority. Mine did 4/5 hours on a Saturday unless it was the school holidays, when he did more (but never that late, until he had his own transport). Unreasonable all round.

He should not be working like this during his GCSEs

Message his boss and try to get him/her to state that they need to stay over his hours. Eg say that he’s been working since2pm and he has to stay until when?

I would have picked him up at 10pm and taken him home. If boss says he’s fired, I’d make it clear I’m reporting him for breaches of child labour legislation. He might not give a toss, but I’d report him anyway.

Your son is working too many hours at the moment. Tesco let mine take holiday over his A levels- he only worked two shifts over the four weeks.

Can't believe he's working these hours during his GCSEs. Not just the lost revision time, also the tiredness will really affect his performance.

I agree it's late nights but as others have said it's the type of job you have to finish before you leave which presumably he/you knew when he took the job.

When I was 16 and doing my GCSEs I worked 9-6 Saturday, 11-5 Sunday and 5-9 one week night so did lots of my friends - it didn't impact my revision or my grades. In the school holidays I definitely worked extra too especially in the run up to Christmas as we were really busy. Was my employer and every other shop/hairdressers/cafe etc in 2005 that employed 16 year olds breaking the law or has the law changed? I knew there were laws for under 16s but I thought once you were 16 and had a national insurance number you could work more hours?

Surely year 11s these days are not revising all day and night everyday they still have a life outside of revision? Exams are important of course but so is having some "down time" whether they spend that time working or socialising so they don't burnout. So I don't think your son or you are doing anything wrong in him having a job - it's good to have a good work ethic but equally if the late nights are impacting his exams then maybe he should find a job with more convenient hours.

It's the nature of the job. Pubs are like this. They can't predict absolute finish times because as you say, it depends on how late punters stay and how much mess they leave. What is the alternative? There isn't one.

these people sound awful. Quit and then report them

What time do they serve food till? Because most it's 9pm, then an hour to get cleaned up by 10pm. Last orders at the bar, and a few loads of a glass dishwasher are different to food prep pot scrubbing at 11pm.

Why is he even working at all during his GCSEs? Dd stopped her job at Easter before GCSEs now doing a levels job was binned weeks ago. They need to focus on study and look at the bigger picture. These results stay with you for life why on earth jeopardise that fir some pocket money?

Its exploitation. You know it, they know it... and deep down your son knows it.

They also know they could replace your son quickly with another gullible teenager.

I think this is just what pubs are like. From the pub's position, who is going to wash the pots if your son leaves early? There won't be anyone else. Your son won't have a contract and there are probably other young people who will take the position. It's not right but he probably needs to look for a role in a bigger company like a supermarket who will follow employment law - 16 year olds certainly used to get more breaks etc in supermarkets.

I don't think the law has changed, but it probably only gets enforced if someone reports them. Employers frequently abuse the working time limits, even for adults and even for well paid professional roles.

Agree that revision shouldn't take up the entire time but presumably he still needs to see friends and exercise too...it doesn't seem ideal. Perhaps 2 shifts a week rather than 4 would be ok

Report them to the relevant body. There are laws to protect young workers.

Sadly, having to work past the end of your shift, until the job is finished, if its been busy is part of working in the catering industry. It can be an awful industry to work in. And they are definitely breaking the law, asking him to do such long hours.

They should either be revising or having decent down time. We got a letter from school about this too as they had experience of teens working and getting lower results.,

Sorry op but I’m quite shocked you as the parent aren’t stepping in here. Teens can’t see the bigger picture. He can work all summer if he wants.

That's kind of the norm in that line of work though.

I worked in pubs when I was that age and for a few years whilst at uni and it was rare you'd finish on time. The whole team would stay behind though until the kitchen was clean.

It will also be more like that during the summer months.

If they’re willing to disregard the law with regards to the health and safety of a child, what other corners are they cutting. If you report them they will probably sack your son (win, win in the context of his exams) but you will hopefully make them think twice about abusing the next employee.

HR person here.

It's not school holidays currently (study leave does not count) and they are absolutely taking the piss. I agree they probably know this and are chancing their arm but if they were to sack him for pointing it out, this could be a tribunal claim based on age so they'd need to be careful.

I completely get not wanting to rock the boat because he's taking positive steps forward after a tricky time in his life and at 16 I was working 2 jobs, including on a Saturday where I'd work in a shop all day, get changed in the back and walk over the road where I would waitress until whatever time the last table was done. But given what I do for a living now I couldn't say nothing

Great opportunity for you to teach/show him how to be assertive! IMO he needs to go them and say during his GCSE's he will need to work fewer hours, but afterwards will be flexible. Sit him down and role play the conversation.

If they say that he doesn't have a job if he won't say late then he needs to walk. It's important young people know their worth and understand about being treated decently. I bet yes only earning £5-6 an hour plus it's difficult to get staff (and evidently) so he doesn't have to put up with it.

You also have an element of control as presumably you are dropping off and picking up.

I'd tell him you are really proud of him proving his ability to hold a job and have a good work ethic, but GCSEs are FAR more important than any pot-washing job right now. He will pick up a job like that incredibly easily once his exams are over. Focus on what matters long term now and ditch the job.

Not that unreasonable, he’s an employed worker and I’m assuming they’ll pay him for the extra time. They won’t care about his travel arrangements - they just need a warm boy to churn plates through the sink, and that’s fair enough!
If you make a big deal now then he’ll make a big deal when he’s older and working a ‘proper job’. First jobs are meant to be menial that teach us the value of a £.
I do think a couple of weeks off during GCSEs wouldn’t go a miss though - is it too late to ask?

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