To think train travel is too expensive?!

[MissDollyMix]

I'm just booking some travel for work. Recently had to book a return flight from Manchester to New York - cost £350. This morning booking a return train from Newcastle to London - cost (standard class) £390. How is it cheaper to fly to New York than it is to get a simple train down to London???? I mean, I know there are special offers available (I have a friends and family railcard for when I'm travelling for leisure) but still? Something is wrong here.

That's unions for you. They only work for public organisations which have cancelled ignore market conditions due to their access to the government money tree

Is it though? Because surely French unions hold more weight than their British counterparts yet the French don't need to remortgage their house every time they want to get from Lyon to Paris....

I'm travelling Newcastle to London on Friday afternoon for £69.50. Only booked last week. When are you travelling to get that price?

Use a national express coach? It's absolutely peanuts in comparison.

7am to get down for an 11am meeting - unfortunately it's the peak rate train that's costing £££ - if I travelled a bit later it would be more reasonable...

Just drive. I don't get public transport- crowded, Smelly, unreliable and SO expensive. Not worth it. I drive everywhere! Occasionally I might get caught in traffic but not as often as there are train/tube strikes 😂

Is it just me or does anyone else always immediately think of the Divine Comedy song at the mention of National Express??.... no? just me....

If I didn't have to get down for meetings and back again for childcare in the evening then that would be an option but really, my point was a broader one... it surely can't cost more to get a train to London than it does to fly to New York??

What total nonsense. Unions don't set fares (or set the fuel duty at zero for aviation fuel).
Rail fares are high for a number of reasons - and privatising the railways is certainly part of it - even Thatcher thought it was going too far.

Not true. Other European countries have heavily unioised public transport systems but they don't pay anywhere near the extortionate price for tickets we do. They're often run a lot better too. Underinvestment and privatisation has a bigger part to play than the unions.

The eastcoast mainline is much faster to central London than driving. It's great.... when it's working and not super expensive... Also I'm not sure a tank and half of diesel, plus congestion charge, plus parking, plus wear and tear on my car (plus me after a 6 hour drive!) would be great value for money....

Agree they’re crazy.

I thought we might take a little trip to the seaside down in Devon/Cornwall as a family and it was coming up at about £500 return just for the train tickets.

Was your flight at a convenient time?

The trains getting into London at that time cost a premium due to the number of people needing them.

We have the most expensive train fares (and one of the poorest services) in Europe don’t we?

It was at a normal time for transatlantic flights yes - not leaving at silly o'clock or anything like that.

In 30 years of work, it has never once been cheaper to take the train.

In my first job, the Birmingham based company had a stand at a show in London. When I queried the use of a company car, the director kindly allowed me to look into train tickets. By the time you had factored in the taxis to collect people for the early start, plus the provision for hotels as the last train wouldn't get back to Brum in time and you may as well have bought the train.

Erm, how is it the unions fault?

Sounds more likely to be market forces i.e. milk the consumer for as much as they can get away with.

There has been extensive work for electrifying the network - that can't have been cheap, and the cost of that in investment must be bourne somewhere.

And still people complain.

Can't you fly to Newcastle?

The eastcoast mainline has been fully electrified since 1991 (just looked that up, I'm not a train geek) I'm not sure that explanation justifies the expense of the train tickets. Also, the mainline between Yorkshire and Manchester is still NOT electrified - where are all these lines that are being electrified? cos I don't think it's the north of England

@Jc2001

. Other European countries have heavily unioised public transport systems but they don't pay anywhere near the extortionate price for tickets we do.

I live somewhere in Europe with some very powerful rail unions and agree with the above.

Also many of the airlines on the Atlantic, most especially the US ones, are very very very unionised, yet manage to charge reasonable fares.

The answer to the question posed by the OP isn’t “the unions”.

Newcastle to London sorry.

When my dc was living in Newcastle it was far cheaper for me to fly or drive from London to visit them than it was to get a train!

With a family railcard?

Cars aren't cheap to buy or run

I've just booked return travel (8am out and 9pm back) for 3 of us (4 of us travelling but little one is free as under 5) from Durham-London next month for a total of £164 which didn't seem too bad although I remember when all the trains were only £15 each way if you booked early enough.
There's definitely still lower fares available but the earlier and then later return fares are the cheapest.