To think train travel is too expensive?!

[MissDollyMix]

I'm just booking some travel for work. Recently had to book a return flight from Manchester to New York - cost £350. This morning booking a return train from Newcastle to London - cost (standard class) £390. How is it cheaper to fly to New York than it is to get a simple train down to London???? I mean, I know there are special offers available (I have a friends and family railcard for when I'm travelling for leisure) but still? Something is wrong here.

Yes, imagine when they reduce flying and driving due to climate change and trains would be the main mode of transportation . The rip off that prevails in the U.K. is always there already when crisis hit. If you work you are fuck. Middle class always mainly affected by all this as well.

Bollocks. The problem is privatisation. Trains were better and cheaper when they were state run - and workers has higher pay than now in real terms.

No, I'm just saying people forget the full cost of driving the car when making comparisons, I didn't mention convenience.

So the only way to reduce rail fares is to slash rail workers salaries and Terms and Conditions?
How about slashing the fat salaries of the bosses of the privatised rail companies and saving money by not paying out dividends instead?
What is good about destroying ordinary people's livelihoods?

How much do you think the bosses are paid, and how much of a difference would that make to your average train fare?

Let's assume there are 10 directors who are paid £1m each per year. Hell, let's make it 100 directors, with total salaries of £100m.

First Group alone did 260m rail journeys last year, and the entire group (so not just rail, buses too) made about £160m profit.

Confiscate 100% of both the profits and those directors salaries and you'll save... £1 per ticket.

So the only way to reduce rail fares is to slash rail workers salaries and Terms and Conditions?

Doesn't that seem like a rather backwards, race to the bottom approach?
Why do only the bosses get improvements?

That's a whole load of untruths in one post @CoatRack .

The unions represent the workers employed by the private companies charged with running the (very fractured) railway. With exception to NR (or Great Britain Railways) which is publicly owned. But the unions represent them as well.

Unions do not set prices of tickets. They do not run stations, nor trains, nor pay staff, nor do the engineering work.

What a redundant point - I never said they do those things.

It's disgraceful. Public transport in the UK is appalling, not only is ridiculously expensive since, it NEVER runs as it should.

Exactly, it’s like pick a struggle - you can’t be expensive AND unreliable… not to mention quite dirty & unsafe sometimes.

So what point were you trying to make exactly when you responded to the OP's observation that train travel is too expensive by stating "that's Unions for you"? Are you now saying Unions have no role at all in the fact train travel is expensive?

My point, as is quite clear, is that unions make running the trains expensive, which makes the tickets expensive.
If you want cheaper tickets then you have to reduce the costs. That means cheaper/fewer trains, or cheaper/fewer staff.

It's also complete and utter nonsense.

Many other countries are capable of running efficient and cheap public transport, often with much stronger unions than we have. It's about government and desire, and our government desires to make a profit for it's donors.

Any time it is specifically highlighted that Unions don't cause high fares you say you never made such a claim, but still claim they have to be "smashed" to reduce fares. It dosen't make any logical sense.

Try two singles

I travel down to London from Newcastle every week. The return train was £150 two years ago the same trains are £250 now. The train in the morning is the main cost. It's always completely empty. I bet if they charged half the price they'd get twice the customers but they probably get slightly more profit doing it their way. So fuck the customers right. It's daylight robbery.

Safer than cars

I'd like to add in another moan - when there are engineering works, and rail replacement buses (changing my 4 hr direct journey to a 6 hr journey with 2 changes), why do I have to pay the same, or often more?

It's absolutely ridiculous. An hour long train journey to our nearest big city costs more than it does in fuel if I were to drive. If I go alone, it's sometimes worth it for the convenience of arriving in the city centre, but if there is more than one of us going the cost is unjustifiable.

I really hope government gets on top of this. I would like to use public transport and not drive everywhere, but I can't justify it when it costs more than fuel. Similarly, our local bus service into the nearby small city also costs more for a return ticket than it costs in fuel.

British train travel is a joke

I agree. I have a meeting coming up. Half an hour by car and £17 all day parking.

Train, just under 2 hours, have to get connections, and over £20.

It's too much in both time and money to take the train.

The cost of your car journey is more than fuel slone

This is false

So over all train is probably cheaper

I reckon convenience and comfort can be offset against all other costs aside from fuel.