Touching himself on public transport

[froggirl]

I was on the bus earlier this week and a guy in his 40's sat across from me was manspreading and squeezing/ fondling his dick. I'm a woman in my 30's.

It was grim. But I didn't say anything. I just got off the bus.

It was one of those awkward situations where I wasn't sure if it was anything to do with me as a woman sat near to him, or if he was just doing it because he felt entitled to/ couldn't leave his dick alone for the short bus ride home.

I didn't feel sure enough that he was deliberately intimidating me, to do anything about it. Maybe he was aware of this and getting off on it.

I'm normally a fairly assertive person and felt ashamed that I didn't call him out on what he was doing - AIBU to not have said anything - what would you have done?

Any tips for if I am in this situation again that will make me feel more empowered?

funny how few old-lady-bladders get caught like that. Because they stay home rather than piss in a bush because that is inacceptable.

I go to football, we have toilets outside our stadium. Nice new and clean. But so many men seem to want to piss in the bushes rather than walk an extra 50 metres to the toilets. And the temptation to walk over, peer over their shoulder and shout back to my mates "aw, it's just like a penis but very small" is tempered by the knowledge of what would happen next.

Report it but don't expect any action. I was groped on the bus and whilst the initial response from transport police was good after they said they would check CCTV I never heard from them again. But my main aim was to have a record of it so that if he had done it or will in future do it to others, they have my incident so they can build up a pictire of behaviour.

So you are saying that as I saw it, I'm a direct victim?

Not sure what you mean by the description of behaviour changing and I'm also not quite sure why I'm having to defend myself.

I am not saying anything, you were there and only you know how you feel about it. It’s not for me to ascribe you victim status or not. Your description of the males behaviour was notably blunter when you directly made the reference to him masturbating, which you omitted in your initial post. As for having to defend yourself, nobody is asking you to do that - but some of your posts have been at odds with others, and some posters are picking up on that.

Well not quite. The definition of victim is "a person who has suffered harm, including physical, mental or emotional harm or economic loss which was directly caused by a criminal offence".

I had to get off the bus because his actions made me feel unsafe, ergo caused mental/ emotional harm. The victims of crimes such as public indecency, indecent exposure etc are the public or whoever witnesses it and is caused mental or emotional harm by it.

I didn't really expect I'd be defining victim blaming here, but I'm a little bit shocked by the fact that some people are telling me to report a crime, and others are telling me I'm not a victim.

I don't think I will get anywhere reporting a crime which had no victims 😒

I said he was fondling and squeezing his dick. Don't be so obtuse.

Thats quite different from masturbating.

So, you are not going to report it? What’s the actual point of this post then? You have asked if you were BU not to do anything - and in my view, which you obviously don’t like, you were!

On the previous page you posted arguing with a poster who said he might be 'self soothing' saying that was a dangerous stereotype.

I honestly don't know what you are on about.

If someone tells you a man is fondling and squeezing his dick whilst manspreading, that means he's masturbating.

No, because when people like you on a website purportedly for women, are arguing with me and making me feel like I have to defend myself, I don't exactly want to speak to the police about it.

I'm leaving this thread now.

I said it’s a dangerous stereotype because it is. Nothing excuses an adult/adolescent male playing with their genitals in public view. None of this changes the fact that you don’t seem to feel strongly enough about it to report it, even though you have asked for tips on what to do 🤷‍♀️

“People like me” 😂😂😂

Why are you trying to make someone who has experienced something distressing feel more shit? 😐 you know there is an actual human here? Who is actually pretty upset about this experience?

For goodness sake, that’s not at all my intention. But you keep contradicting yourself.

Crabs.

Saying someone is fondling and squeezing their dick, and then saying they are masturbating, is not a contradiction.

I've asked for this thread to be removed.

Victim Support 0808 16 89 111

Bloody hell - now intimidated women are being criticised.

When are women going to be able to stop having to take responsibility for the actions of males?

Fair enough. We may have disagreed, but I hope you get help and support if you need it.

I do 🤭

@froggirl DD said she was pretty shocked the first time it happened (she was a student in a new city, not used buses much before). Now as an adopted Yorkshire woman she is more comfortable about telling the driver.

Being more used to it doesn't lessen the offence, only the shock.

Actually I totally get where op is coming from. These incidents tend to happen out of the blue when we are thinking about other things and it takes our brains a while to process them partly because fear, shock disbelief and disgust start to kick in. And, as op has stated, we are not always sure of context and what is happening until a few minutes have passed.

It’s quite likely that this man is doing this deliberately. He gets off on making women feel uncomfortable by being subtle. But he will push the boundaries more and more until he gets reported.

This is not the op’s fault at all and it’s unfair to blame her. It’s obvious she came on here because something unsettling had happened to her and she needs to process it. Posting on Mumsnet is one way of doing that. Next time she will be more prepared to act.

I have not blamed the OP at any point. I am firmly in the ‘report him’ camp as we urgently need this behaviour to be stamped out and you acknowledge this in your post. Unfortunately, it comes down to us as women to report it, and the unfairness of that is just one of those things we have to deal with! I understand it’s a shit situation, but what else can we do?

is reporting to the bus driver/police being responsible for a man's actions? that's an odd thing to say.

OP didn't feel like confronting the guy, can relate. Didn't tell the driver - can't relate. Didn't tell the police - not having told the driver not much point, but you could report after the fact, just in case you're not the only one.

Reporting it to either or both the driver and police is surely supporting other women to potentially not have to put up with this? (if the police take action). It is not victim blaming and it is not making anyone responsible for the bus wankers actions.

Just because you can't relate doesn't make Op's actions wrong or right. I also haven't mentioned victim blaming.