Do you begrudge high earners?

[cheerscheerscheerstomeyeahcheers]

Do you actually understand what they do and why they earn so much?
Would you be actually willing to put in the time and effort yourself?

I see so much griping about people that earn a lot, but I also see a lot of ignorance about why they earn what they do.

Saying high earners work hard is not insinuating that low earners do not. We need both. The high earners to pay the taxes to fund low earners. Only 40% of British people are net contributors.

@WoodBurningStov I get what you're saying I didn't mean I disagree with high pay outright. I just think you can't have a truly healthy society without both. Human beings welfare, health & well being just shouldn't be bottom of the pile whilst the number of billionaires grow year on year. Poverty and lack of services is a huge problem in the UK and it's my children's generation who can't afford to work in the public sector, it's so unattractive for bright, caring capable people.

Are you suggesting that the average MN user should understand every single job role and pay scales?
Are you suggesting that only high earners put in time and effort?
Are you suggesting that being a 'high earner' is the only way to happiness?

I don't care what someone else earns, it's none of my business, though do find it hard to understand how anyone can justify what some professional sports players are paid in relation to other professional sports players (why do some male football players get a ridiculous salary, for example).

Make the best of your life it's true that we don't all have the same opportunities and choices to start with - some folk are more privileged however different folk do different things with that privilege!

@jeaux90 fair enough and I totally appreciate this because I travel for work! However, you normally get taken for nice business dinners and experience stuff that a hardworking public sector worker wouldn't! I know it's not all fun and games but I just don't understand what the OP wants from this post?

@cupofteaandasliceofcarrotcake
"Nice business dinners"

It's just an extension of the working day quite frankly.

I am in the bracket, I pay a shit tonne of tax which I am happy to do so no I don't begrudge other high earners.

What I do begrudge is certain work sectors not being paid enough. Health, Care, teachers, social workers...all can be high stress jobs too.

So far in this thread - standard MN.

Mixing up wealth and those who pay little tax: with high earners who pay the majority of tax to support the country through PAYE. (Links have been posted to highlight this fact for people who don’t know.)

All high earners are billionaires, millionaires are using celeb style tax avoidance schemes. Absolutely lol’ing at that when I look at the HMRC bill.

All high earners think they are better than everyone else and poor teachers and carers. So far, the only people saying this are lower earners projecting these so called thoughts.

Standard MN then. What people fail to understand is that high earners on PAYE are some of the most over taxed people in the world. We have a system which discourages people to work more at certain levels. Hence your consultant and dentist shortages. The over taxation on PAYE is not only harming productivity, it’s harming essential access to important services.

People saying “fuck off then” well they are. People who earn their money and have in demand skill sets are relocating to places like Singapore and Canada. You’re looking at the wrong people. Those who are employed and pay via PAYE are paying huge amounts of tax on their salaries. Certainly their fare share.

Sometimes people get snappy yes. That’s because it’s never enough. People are always projecting things that just aren’t true. This thread is black and white proof. Tax dodgers, they hate cleaners, they must’ve all been born into privilege. It’s such bollocks. It’s also that bollocks alongside eye watering tax that are turning people in skilled jobs away. Fantastic job.

I don't think any job should get £300k a year, that's an insane amount of money!

i see your points too, it could be debated that there are always some rouges in any industry

Depends entirely how they earn that money.

I do think there are a lot of very overpaid people in senior executive roles who do not earn their money. Can we honestly say that the CEO of Thames Water is good value for over £1 million quid a year? What about Paula Vennells? Worth the hundreds of thousands a year in pay and bonuses she earned while on charge of the Post Office?

Surely many of us have experienced working for organisations that give poor pay rises while their CEOs' big pay packets are splashed over the media, or is that just me?

I have worked directly for and in close proximity to senior leaders who are high earners in a number of organisations. My conclusion is that the only thing remarkable about most of them is how they have ended up in such positions.

I also know of plenty of business people and others who work very hard, take significant personal financial risks and definitely deserve their rewards.

So no I don't begrudge high earners because they earn so much, but I think excessively inflated executive pay and the mechanisms that have created it are a scourge on our society and need to be dealt with. We have created a group of very rich people that have not had to take the significant risks others have had to we earn their wealth and are incentivised to minimise their accountability and focus solely on short term personal targets regardless of their impact on others and the longer term sustainability of the organisations they lead.

The problem is some high earners are making a lot of money from paying the low earners a pittance.

I agree you see reports of ceos on say £6million and you have to wonder are they really worth 171 times average workers on £35k?
I always wonder why they don’t employ 6 people on £1m. For that salary you would get some great people and more work done.

No I don't begrudge high earners. I know myself well and what they have to do is just not my cup of tea at all.

All the high earners I know (100k+) have to give their blood, sweat and tears for that money, to the detriment of their family.

They aren't and that is the truth. We all know this but the old argument "going rate" argument is always deployed alongside the idea that these people are always exceptional (they aren't). The system that has been created in the corporate world is an ever ratcheting system of execs giving each other big rewards and shareholders accepting this as long as the dividends keep flowing regardless of the health of the company concerned.

at a guess some of the value of the 6 million would also be made up of stocks, shares etc, besides if the majority of workers dont want the top poisition then there has to be some way of ensuring someone will be captain and then the rates have to be competitive to keep the captain with x company etc

I think society values the wrong things sometimes, and that high earners usually don't "morally" earn their wages - it's often at the expense of others.

Doctors earn a pittance compared to bankers, but work far harder, train far longer, and endure more stress and responsibility.

However, I don't think communism is the answer either - people need something to strive for. It's just a bit depressing that society is so very unequal, and that we don't value very tough, necessary work (like caring, or teaching) enough.

I'd not restrict high earners from earning their wages even if I could, social economics is really complex, but I don't think most of them get there due to hard work alone. There's a huge amount of luck involved, and wealthy families usually produce wealthy, high-earning offspring - it's who you know, not just what you know in many cases.

Hard work isn't relevant when deciding salary. Maybe it should be, but it isn't.

It's the market value for your skills and expertise, with a number of contributory factors like how rare that skillset is. But how hard you actually work is never that relevant to the pay.

People have an innate sense of fairness and this feels wrong to many, but what's the alternative?

Do we want to live in a world where everyone gets paid a flat salary, or the government decides the worth of each job?

As a student I was employed in the student Union to work the bar. Wages were good, but the socialist leaning student executive committee had decreed that supervisors were paid the same as ordinary staff, one flat rate for everyone regardless of job content or responsibility levels. They then found it strange that nobody wanted the more responsible jobs 😂

OP are you a high earner or is it your DH?

It's her husband 🙄

Only begrudge the hoarding of the super rich:

Total wealth of UK billionaires

▪️2012: £212 Billion
▪️2022: £653 Billion

That's up 3-fold.

Well said @whistleblower99

It's tiresome but unlikely to change.

My father was highly educated and a high earner.

He maintained until the day he died that the hardest he ever worked and the hardest job he ever had were his summers working on a fishing boat in his late teens.

He had great respect for people in jobs that didn't pay well but were clearly hard work. He always, always, always tipped well, and extra when he went out for breakfast, as he said it was the 'cheapest' menu of the day but they worked just as hard as the lunch and dinner shifts. He also never forgot the cleaning staff in hotels.

So no, I have no 'respect' for high earners just because they make a lot of money. I have respect for people who work hard AND treat other people decently and respectfully, no matter what their job is.

@whistleblower99 well said.

What should VPs and CEOs earn? What’s a fair wage for someone running a company or division that keeps thousands in employment?

My brother is a very high earner.

He takes on a level of responsibility had would be mentally way too draining for me. My mental health would suffer.

I'd rather have good mentally health and a Ford Fiesta than a £70000 BMW and sleepless nights.

I don't begrudge high earners their money provided they pay their taxes and treat their staff well.

The relationship between high pay for CEOs and business performance is very weak. Equally a lot of high earners in the UK work in finance and there's a strong case for the power of finance being damaging to both society and the wider economy.

So whilst I don't begrudge it, I do question whether it is appropriate.

As others have said it rarely links to how hard they work and income and wealth inequality is pretty well demonstrated to be socially damaging.