AIBU to think a potential 2% pay rise for the NHS staff is ridiculous?

[Sunflowers68]

NHS England is cautioning against giving employees raises of more than 2%. is A band 2 salary is now only 10p above minimum wage due to the recent increase in the minimum wage. Surely, a 2% increase is insufficient for a job this challenging? If you are still working in the NHS, can you share your reasons why?

NHS salaries are clearly too low as evidenced by recruitment issues. We need to raise salaries significantly in my opinion and also address working conditions and the general work experience for health workers. Some of this would be improved by filling the high current vacancy level.

I do also think that whilst we need to properly reward the work of staff in the NHS and ensure that it is also a good place to work, there are multiple and massive inefficiencies that need to be addressed and also a lot of work place bullying. The NHS should not be ruining the health of its own workers, that is plainly stupid.

the sick pay is an absolute bonus, as is the annual leave

Are you joking?

£12k index linked pensions would cost upwards of £800k to buy on the open market as an annuity.

The 'standard' retirement age is 65 in the private sector, so roughly 45 years of work.

If somebody in the nhs worked for 45 years, they'd receive 83% of their final salary.

I dint think this is correct, certainly not for those who aren't in the 1995 scheme and there are very few left that are.
And remember you can't take your NHS pension till you've reached the official age of retirement so currently 67.
The pension really isn't as great as people seem to think it is. Particularly for those who joined after 2015.

I don't understand why people are so upset by the pay of band 2 staff. They are unqualified staff and have access to a very good pension scheme.

@ThisOldThang no it's really not

www.wesleyan.co.uk/pensions-and-retirement/nhs-pension/guide

I've been a qualified medical professional for 43 years and my salary is pretty good. I love the work and the hours suit me, I have a 9-5 role weekends off and lots of holiday, great pension so I'm not bothered for myself.
But band 2 - fuck right off. If I was a band 2 being worked like a dog on what is basically minimum wage I'd be off to work in Tesco.

I was basing my calculations on those posted above (1/54th of final salary per year of service).

Could the government give a greater pay rise to those on a lower band? Does it have to be split evenly across all bands? For instance, could the lower bands get a 5% pay rise and the higher bands 4%?

They did that last time. Band 2 got a much bigger increase than the rest. There is only 22p an hour between band 2 and bottom of band 3 and understandably lots of people don’t think the extra training and responsibility is worth it. Band 3 does increment up to £1/hour over band 2 with time to £1285.85 net per year - less than £25 a week if working full time. In my trust band 2s get free parking and band 3s pay so that narrows it even more. Lots of band 2 HCAs in our trust are being upbanded to 3 as they have been doing the job by stealth. There is a lot of that - giving people extra work and responsibility and spinning it as a privilege rather than a job that they should be properly paid for. For the first 2 years they will get an extra £285.08 - but lose their free parking.
The difference between bottom of band 5 and top of band 4 is £500, but band 5 jobs are “qualified” jobs - nurses, physios, etc with degrees and the student loan repayments that go with them.

I’m a band 6. I don’t feel inclined to push myself to a 7 atm. I’d need to do a masters (or at least upgrade my PGcert to a PGDip), take on a lot more hassle, take on a lot more responsibility. I would also lose my unsocial hours shifts that I get more money for so even after 5 years when I would be top of band 7 then I wouldn’t necessarily be better off. If I didn’t do unsocial shifts now, moving to a band 7 would get me £4112 a year more after 5 years. It’s a much more difficult and stressful job.

Do you have any idea what they have to do and how complex their roles are now?

I’m nhs (10 years) and we’ve all just gone through consultation with some of the team being made redundant. I got a job but had to sit a formal interview panel to prove I could do the job I’ve done for years. Sadly no job is secure.

The obsession with masters is so limiting for most people. I’m b7 and studying for a level 7 pgdip (hoping that will be enough because with 3 dc and a full time job it’s breaking me and the thought of writing a dissertation is not appealing).

@EmilyTjP as do nurses who want to move from 5 to a 6 - here we need a masters level qualification to move up

A lot of people on band 2 will be opting out of the pension. It's a great pension scheme but people will prioritise the need to pay their bills and feed their kids now over their pension

I don't know why so many people are fixated on the pension.

Yeah, it's great and all, but it doesn't pay the bills of the people currently working in the NHS and struggling. People need to heat their homes and buy their food. If Aldi pays more they'll end up going there and then what will folk do if they need a hospital appointment?

@Sunflowers68 a band 5 is a registered nurse and a band for is an associate - they have differing responsibilities and level of qualification even if some tasks are the same

Band 1 closed to new recruits in 2018 but does still exist for people already on it who chose not to move to band 2. The salary is the same as band 2

To be a 6 here we need a PGDip or MSc - I'm just doing my final module of PGDip

We’re all in the same boat. Low pay rises isn’t something exclusive to the NHS. Most of us are doing jobs that are important to society, and I can’t muster up too much sympathy for a poorly run NHS I’m afraid. My experience with the NHS over the last couple of years has been dire.

@Livelovebehappy and the reason it is so dire is because people won't work there due to the pay/unsustainable workload. If we give up on paying staff properly then we'll lose it and end up paying for private healthcare (those who can afford it). I agree that lots of jobs are important to society but argueably ones health has to be near the top?

While I don't know what you've been through, and won't begin to argue that all HCPs are angels etc, can you see how a bad experience with the NHS over the past couple of years could be linked to understaffing, lack of retention of good nurses, retirement of a whole cohort of older nurses post-covid, staff burnout post-covid, reduction in government funding, and the goodwill the NHS has run on for years finally running out?

I work in the private sector and 2% pay rises are pretty standard where I am. We dont get the pension perks or the publicity either.

we have lost so many nurses, nothing to do with pay, more towards with the disappointment in the job - changes bought about by covid and kept up by management, who will not listen
they are still nursing, but elsewhere

How do the overall gross pay, working conditions, stress and responsibility compare?

Also in private sector and my employer has done below inflation pay rises for the last few years too and are not a small company ☹️