AIBU to think a potential 2% pay rise for the NHS staff is ridiculous?

[Sunflowers68]

NHS England is cautioning against giving employees raises of more than 2%. is A band 2 salary is now only 10p above minimum wage due to the recent increase in the minimum wage. Surely, a 2% increase is insufficient for a job this challenging? If you are still working in the NHS, can you share your reasons why?

2% doesn’t recognise the problems of retaining staff in the NHS. At the same time it is unaffordable for the taxpayer.

The answer seems to me, after a lifetime in the private sector, to make efficiencies within the NHS to be able to afford a better pay rise for the staff. Asking the tax payer for more funding with the current levels of waste and financial mismanagement is offensive.

My pet peeve, prescribing ibuprofen and paracetamol which can be bought OTC for 30p a box. If the NHS has to prescribe it at all, it would be cheaper to give them a petty cash box to give the patient a quid to buy their own.

Here is a good graphic. So this assumes a pension of £13k per year after 20 years service, starting at £18k salary. But interestingly assumes the salary goes up by 4% each year, which is unlikely!

I was looking into moving into the NHS from my local authority however, the pension contribution in the NHS are ridiculously high (nearly 10%) at the band I would be on. Pay is also shockingly poor, and the structure of going up pay scales takes so much longer. In my local authority, you go up automatically each year unless you go up a pay grade.

It really made me doubt applying for the role.

Security, and pension are the obvious reasons. Decent holiday allowance. A union.

Working in the private sector I've been made redundant 7 times in 38 years, once on my first morning back after maternity leave (because I had dared to take maternity leave). Then had to fight a tribunal case for a year while unemployed.

Despite working full time in the same grade role I still get paid less than I did before I had ds and he's now 15. That's the IT sector for you.

It shouldn't be a race to the bottom, and pay rises should at least keep up with inflation. But the security of the NHS is a real plus.

Benefits went up 6.7% according toto Google? No way we should then accept 2% and be made to wait months for it!

Efficiencies! After 14 years of Tory austerity and cuts, do you think there’s anything left? Look around: CAMHS waiting lists for children months long, referrals rejected (is that an efficiency?), hospital w/l years long. Its not a few poor people wanting paracetamol freebies.

That really is excellent and a real benefit of working in the NHS. That more than my pension is forecast to be, and I’ll have to work 40 years to reach that. I work in the private sector in a job that requires a lot of qualifications, less sick pay and less annual leave than the NHS. The lowest band NHS has a pension equivalent of a £50k salary in the private sector. That makes the pay so much better than Asda or equivalent.

I am a band 2.

It works around childcare and it has decent enhancements for working weekends.

I love my job, however it's very stressful on a busy and demanding ward.

There isn't no pay grades in a band 2. It's just one set wage. So unless I move to a band 3 ( which then my weekend enhancements go down) there is no pay rise for me.

It's kinda a lose lose situation.

This is right, and a lot less click baity that how the OP has phrased it.

NHSE is NOT against a pay rise higher than 2% - they are asking the government to appropriately fund any pay deal higher than that.

Last year, in order to meet financial balance, trusts and ICBS were allowed to scrape money from services and nationally funded initiatives and use them to fill the gaps. A large part of the reasoning for this was to meet the impact caused by industrial action and pay deals that were not sufficiently funded by the government.

I don’t think that workings out of the Nhs pension is correct? i’ll admit i pay into it but it confuses me when i try and work it out. The 2015 scheme brought in was not as beneficial as the previous ones.

The pension also relies you on working in the NHS for a long time to reap the benefits while paying a chunk out of your wage. Many lower paid staff won’t stay in the NHS for that length of time nowadays cos it’s a shit show and they can work elsewhere for the same wage.

Many of my colleagues on lower bands aren’t even in the pension as they can’t afford to be!!

It's also worth knowing that you can't claim your full pension until state retirement age. For every year early you retire, you sacrifice a fairly high %. So nobody is realistically getting it after 30 years. And yes, they moved us onto a new scheme in 2015 that is much worse. They could also presumably move us onto yet another worse scheme between now and my retirement (projected 2058...). Pension contributions are relatively high too.

They did this in Scotland last year, but all it does it narrow the gap between bands, reducing motivation for promotion. Why would you take on a skilled, difficult/management post when you could earn not much less in an entry level post? Top band 3s in Scotland earn less than 3k a year (gross) less than newly qualified nurses who have a huge amount more responsibility. Even top band 5s don't earn much more.

Not true, there are no pay increments for band 2 anymore

Are you for real?! A HCA on a band two working in A&E takes blood, staples heads, dresses wounds, performs last offices, comforts families in some absolutely heartbreaking circumstances and you think that’s ’not difficult’ 🤦🏽‍♀️🤦🏽‍♀️🤦🏽‍♀️

Interesting. I think they should standardise the bands for all of UK. Seems like there is a lot of discrepancies with banding. My friend is a band 5 but the same job is a band 4 at another hospital (in the same area). I have also heard of HCA jobs being banded differently despite having the same responsibilities. I think all HCA jobs should be the same band in all hospitals.

I thought Band 1 went years ago.

No, there is no Band 1 for new starters. I am a domestic and started on Band 1. A few years ago, Band 1 was abolished and those on Band 1 were offered a move to Band 2 but that came with extra responsibilities that I didn't want. I was top of Band 1 and the bottom of Band 2 was less than that. Another disincentive. My pay is same as Band 2, £11.45 an hour.

Worked for the NHS since 2007 (!!!) But not band 2, why do I stay? Good question, and there have been times I've thought an awful lot a about leaving. When I got my masters combined with a professional qualification, the same year I recieved a real time pay reduction due to a freeze in pay and increase in my pension. That did set the tone of my career somewhat. I suppose in the early days it wasn't just about the money, but I loved doing my job and understood the value it contributed to society. I have become more cynical since then though and like so many have experienced some terrible toxic teams.
I am staying now for the benefits, index linked pension (with contributions in the 1995 and 2015 schemes), annual leave (33 days plus bank holidays) and sick pay (6 months full pay, 6 months half pay). These days I have a young family and work part-time- truly part-time which I appreciate from other Mum's simply isn't an option in other professional roles. Thanks to working part-time I can also work freelance (as childcare permits) which is much more lucrative financially. But actually when I break down my fees and factor in pension, annual leave and sickness, then actually I am not sure there such a huge difference in pay afterall! But the flexibility of freelance is unreplicable in the NHS and invaluable with a young family.
My partner always jokes that at least I have a 'job for life', and he's not wrong, that security I perhaps have taken for granted.
As for band 2 roles, the worse thing I have encountered as a union rep is the expectation of band 2 staff to take on roles and responsibilities well beyond their pay grade, with no mention of any kind of progression or renumeration for that. So much responsibility for so little pay, appalling.

Having looked at pay scales, you must be fairly senior. Remember the different tax thresholds and pension contributions in Scotland. Above 43k you pay 42%, and about 52k you pay 11.3% pension contributions. I worked out for a new 8a the gross difference is almost 7k but difference in take home is £200 a month.

I'm a band 2 gp admin and I can guarantee you it's not easy! The stress from patients, complicated tasks and the high workload. I've been in the job 2 years and I stay because I do enjoy the work and I'm one of the ones that can diffuse situations quickly. I'm also part time. Not sure I could stand it doing it 40 hours a week.

Band 2 pension at age 67 after 20 years full time work would be £8k
If you had worked 40 years full time it would be £16k

8K! Life of Riley (sarcasm).

Anyone who thinks they're being underpaid should go to the union. We had most of our band 2s upgraded to band 3s recently, but they need to go through their job description and prove they deserve the higher band. Some HCAs take bloods etc, some don't. I think that's the difference.

Something else to consider. In Scotland the unions have agreed a move to a 36 hour working week (FT). But there's been no agreement on more staff or reduced duties. So most of us suspect this will be used as leverage to not increase our pay (arguing that our hourly rate has increased) while we continue to work X hours unpaid.

I've worked for the NHS for 7 years as a band 4, in that time my pay has gone from around £10.10 per hour to £14.10. Opportunities to progress to band 5 are slim. I think the pay is pretty rubbish for what I do and national minimum wage is catching up. I think the only reason I'm still there is job security, good sick pay and annual leave entitlement.

My OH works in private sector. Engineer. Hasn't had a pay rise for over 8 years. Pay cut 5 years ago. Is a contractor so no pension, sick pay, holiday pay. Laid off after downturn in industry for 9 months.