To not hand notice in until I see the new job contract?

[Celia24]

I've been offered a job in writing with the position, salary and start time outlined.

I don't know any of the other t&cs, pension, holidays etc

They have said they understand I'll need a few days to speak to my manager. In the next breath that they will send the contract within a few days.

AIBU to tell them I'll give notice once I have the contract?

Frankly, if you lose the offer because of this it probably wasn't worth having in the first place

You'll need a start date in order to actually sign, but I see no reason why they can't send the contract across with "TBC" written in that part

Who gets a lawyer to read over a standard work contract? The OP hasn’t said she has been in a big negotiation for some massive deal. It’s a standard job offer and employment contract. What an insane comment

Depends what turns out to be in it
If it's a bog standard days/times/etc thing anyone can deal with that, but it's when "surprises" crop up that advice can be needed - though if it transpires that they're trying it on most with sense will walk at that point anyway so wouldn't need the lawyer

A lawyer? For an employment contract? Are you in the UK?

Definitely wait until you've signed the contract before you hand your notice in - I knew someone who accepted a job offer that got withdrawn the week before she was due to start - and after she had left her previous job.

Because she had signed the contract, she was able to claim her first month's wages because there was a notice period/payment in lieu of notice caluse in it. The new not-employers were not impressed but took legal advice and were told they needed to pay her the amount specified in the contract.

Wasn't ideal but at least it gave her a little income while she was having to job hunt in a hurry!

I would never sign a legally binding contract without having expert advice, they can also help negotiate on your behalf for any terms you might not be happy with. It's a personal thing for me, clearly, but it's something that's hugely important to get right to avoid issues further down the line.

Never would resign without contracts signed. Never have. And employees haven’t expected me to. I’ve always worked for small start ups so no way of finding their policies online and quite often those policies may not exist yet!

I’ve never given notice until I have signed and returned a contract. It’s silly otherwise.

Yeah, you need to see the pension etc

It's your life, your job op, they don't care

Are you in the UK? Or negotiating very very high level jobs which would come with all sorts of negotiated perks?

It kind of sounds like you don’t work because it’s a little odd to have a solicitor read your standard employment contract.

Ok Ive conveyed my delight and asked for the necessary offer details before I can resign.

I can't comfortably resign without this so even if I lose the position it's right for me. Any company worth their weight will provide this as others have noted.

All, my partner is a lawyer, so I don't have to much to worry about there...

What, even for general day to day contracts such as phone contracts, Netflix, subscriptions, etc? People enter into contracts all the time. It would be very expensive to keep doing that.

It’s really not at all odd if you’re in a remotely senior role / there are share options / post term restrictions/ bonus provisions or other contingent payments etc etc etc. It astonishes me that people blindly accept the terms that suit the employer! Notice periods, benefits etc are all negotiable

My last contract was 20+ pages long and required NDAs so yes I definitely wanted a lawyer for that, but I was always taught by DF to get a lawyer to go through anything before you sign, and I am my father's daughter.

I've regularly dealt with this situation from the employer's side.

You can agree a start date with your new employer, based on your notice period in your current job, plus the time it will take the new employer to issue your contract; you to sign and return it; and you hand in your notice at current job.

So if you're on one month's notice, I (as the new employer) would be suggesting a start date of maybe 6 week's time. This would allow time for us to send a contract request to our HR department, for them to issue the contract (allow up to one week in my company), for you to receive the contract, sign and return it, hand your notice in, and then work your one month notice period.

One time I got a written offer with a salary and start date and everything, so I resigned. The contract never arrived. I just kept getting told it was in the post. Apparently they changed their minds but didn’t tell me for a few weeks.

By that time I’d worked my notice and been replaced. I’d bought suitable clothes on my credit card and signed a hire purchase for the car I’d need to get to the new job.

I couldn’t claim benefits because they said I’d made myself unemployed by resigning. I was in debt that I couldn’t pay, with a car that I was trying to hand back at a huge financial loss, and I couldn’t pay my rent or even buy food. Because those twats “changed their mind”.

Luckily I managed to get another crappy job fairly quickly, return some of the clothes I hadn’t worn, and I handed the car back and said “take me to court because I can’t pay the amount you’re asking”.

I got a solicitor involved, who said I didn’t have a legally binding contract and there was literally nothing I could do.

In short - never resign until the contract is signed!

The post term restrictions were a big one for me, as legally I wouldn't have been able to work in my field of expertise for 6 months after leaving the company if I hadn't had that element changed. I know it can be difficult for employers to sue if you go to work for a "competitor" but I definitely didn't want it in writing that I couldn't.

Those clauses are an odd one - if they’re really outrageous they’re best left unnegotiated because they’ll be unenforceable. It’s the ones that are tough but enforceable that need to be carefully picked apart (ie gardening leave paid!).

You’ve got more rights than some comments might lead you to believe https://www.acas.org.uk/if-your-job-offer-is-withdrawn

I would always wait for a contract. I had a contract that said one weeks notice on either side and two weeks after two years- I found that so. along with some old fashioned wording around grooming. If you think you can let me go and only need two weeks to cover off on my role then you can’t think I’m that useful, I got another contract at the same time and I passed on the one week notice job.

Well, that was easy. They will send it in Monday! And said they completely understand.

Excellent outcome, OP - really pleased for you

Don't accept without offer/contract with all the details.

Tell them a few days longer than what you are required to give. For example, maybe you need to give 2 weeks, so tell them you can start in 3. Get the contract then tell current workplace.

I agree

I would wait for signed contracts

My last job wouldn't give a contract until the probation period was completed. I stayed 4 months then gave a week notice, and they wanted a minimum month, I pointed out that if they want any notice, then they need to give a contract, and I was considerate of giving a week. New job gave a contract before I started. Been there a couple of years now.

I don't think it's unreasonable, but it is impractical in many cases, especially in the public sector. My last 2 jobs I didn't get a contract until months after I started!