To think if we can't get help, who can?

[drspouse]

DS (12) has ADHD and can be aggressive. We are seeing positive changes but he can still flip on the drop of a hat and last week threw something at me that made my head bleed, DH took him out to cool off, I had called the police and they had arrived meantime and this triggers social services to call which is why we do it.
Had a really patronising, I felt, call from social services today. They keep saying we've "refused services", throwing names around (names of people we may have met but we've met about 20 new people and some have actually rung DH or seen him not me, and names of services that we may or may not have been told about).

We have recently been awarded respite which is supposed to be a certain number of hours but none of the agencies can find us any workers and the SW acted surprised (despite there being a national care recruitment crisis). I contacted a mentoring agency - they charge £75/HR and we get minimum wage to pay the worker...

Both DH and I thought we were told we'd be getting a disability social worker. Apparently we should know he has the wrong sort of disability so no social worker.

We are fully aware that we don't always handle him well and the incident last week has also left me with bruises but it was the result of me telling him off for ignoring my instructions and he then pushed me against the metal radiator so I fell over and then he threw cutlery at me. I completely lost my cool as I was covered in blood and I wish I didn't because it just makes DS more wound up and more aggressive.

We've asked for help around staying calm and our mental health (because we are on edge wondering which day he will throw a kitchen knife or push someone down the stairs, and because we don't know how not to react when we are bleeding or bruised). We also want someone to help us with how we handle him and what to do when he's dysregulated. We were explicitly asked "what do you think you need" only to be told "we don't provide that" and then apparently we'd "refused services".

We've been told about 20 times to "call your GP". We've both been through their CBT course twice, me three times, and we're both on medication.

We are at risk of being seriously hurt. We are afraid for our lives and safety. But nobody can do anything about it. What are we supposed to do - wait till one of us is dead? Until he's in prison? Until he's old enough for us to say he has to move out and then he'll just be on the streets and on drugs but we might still be alive?

@drspouse

Just to add, I agree with you re: the NewboldHope (cult). I was on the group/site briefly. I got kicked off because a poor woman posted asking what she should do because her child had fractured her eye socket and nearly blinded her. My response of call the police absolutely did not go down well. Regardless of their multiple issues, our children have to function in society, be it on the fringes. As adults, they will be given no leeway for fracturing the eye socket and nearly blinding another human being. I also hate the cult of NVR. Are adult victims of domestic abuse asked not to dysregulate their abusers? No, they are not and we would all be appalled at the victim blaming. The truth is that some children, probably majorly due to their poor starts in life or their disabilities or differences, ARE violent. As a fellow victim, it would really help if society stopped gaslighting me. It does happen, it’s not my fault and it’s a consequence of what’s gone before.

@Attention I did think I'd given you a full reply - apologies if not - I don't think I know everything but I know a lot about what does and doesn't work for my DS and I also know about what might give us temporary, partial relief but doesn't work for more than half a day e.g. the time when we were due to go to church, he was aggressive for a fairly unrelated reason, but DH was also ill so we didn't go, and the next day DS said (about a more generally appealing outing, in fact) "I'll just be naughty and then I won't have to go".
It would be lovely if the things we know work, worked all the time and perfectly - but just like with his medication - they don't, they just help, they don't fix things. It is just that we are not that patient, but from experience schools are even less patient and expect a change to make him a happy and calm child overnight. I could tell this is what his first school thought medication for ADHD would do and we had no illusions it would.

@WhompingWillows thank you so much - totally agree about Newbold Hope - I am minded of the girl who was permanently wrapped in a blanket with menstrual blood dripping down her legs but was STILL aggressive towards her family and they couldn't understand why because they'd reduced all demands.
I have not fully investigated those organisations, I will check them out.

More generally - yes, we and school find a lot of things labelled "autism friendly" to be helpful but others not so much - again, we use things we've tried and found helpful - but even just "using new things that might be helpful" are VERY unlikely to be taken on board by DS first time and we do often have to say "we are doing this, like it or lump it" and then three days later it's a part of his routine.

For example, I wanted to make some new routine pictures to help him with EF and things like putting on his deodorant BEFORE clothes. I wanted to take photos of him doing his regular things (because research shows this is easier than using stock photos or, worst of all, widgets that I don't understand either!) and the first day it was like I'd asked him to fly to the moon, the second day (because it was getting long and boring) he grumped but agreed to it and the third day (when we'd found one of the things we needed to photograph) he asked how many photos today.

When I get them printed out it will be the same thing - he'll throw them across the floor the first time we show them to him, then he'll look at them but pretend he hasn't, then he'll tell us WE haven't looked at them.

@drspouse I’ll ask again, have you tried anti-anxiety medication for your DS’s anxiety?

PEGS, which you’ve just told WhompingWillows you’ll check out, was suggested to you back in April by someone else on this thread. You said then you’d spoken to the nice man at PEGS who’d given you lots of pointers about finding a restraint course - did nothing come of that?

I’m a bit bewildered tbh that you seem more focused on talking about how much he helps around the house and now what you’re doing about his hygiene routine than on what you’re doing to sort out the escalating violence against you and your DS getting arrested for it.

You have a younger child in the house who he’s hurting and who you have a duty to protect. If, to use one of your examples, he pulls her hair when he finds out that the shop is shut, then move her away from him before telling him the shop is shut, or anything else he may not like.

As a PP suggested, feed the children separately as he’s aggressive/physical with his sister at the dining table.

These are pragmatic, common sense strategies that you don’t need organisations or evidence based research to tell you. But you need to prioritise keeping your DD safe, as well as of course yourself.

@drspouse

Just to add, if you have not already, please, if you are in England, ask your adoption agency to refer you to the National Centre for Adoption and Fostering at the South London Maudsley Hospital. This national CAMHS centre offers EVIDENCE-BASED assessments of our children (so not your PASW guessing everything = attachment because adoption and CSC guessing everything = poor parenting because safeguarding and child protection). The cost of the initial assessment will be funded by the ASF. You will then know what you are dealing with and you can negotiate appropriate therapies accordingly. So not your adoption agency offering you ten sessions of play/drama/art/useless therapies because that’s all they can offer because they have signed preferred supplier contracts with big providers.

Also, in opposition to some posters here, I would call the police every time your AS is violent. You have a duty to safeguard your AD who is witnessing these attacks on you. I have personally found the police to be the most sympathetic and empathetic of the professional services - even when they were arresting me on a false allegation of assault. The police do not want to criminalise our children but they do want to offer early prevention work that stops them entering the criminal justice system. From a self-preservation point of view, it is helpful to have a log of police visits to your home for as and when the first allegation is made against you.

I have a similar situation.
12 year old DD has been attacking since the age of 7. She's left countless bruises, scratches from her nails, even a black eye when she punched me in the face so hard that my glasses shot across the room.
The GP and I highly suspect that she's autistic but the only way to get a referral in my area is via school and she's now regularly refusing to attend so they can't do the observations needed.
I’m a lone parent. So have no support at all here. It's a gut wrenching feeling to carry every day. Walking on eggshells.
I hope you get the help you need OP

OP, If you are open to it, find a suitable church nearby.
Many of them have programs / classes for children with SEN. There will be more support available than through anywhere else. And people to cry with, pray with.

You might be surprised at the impact.

Edit: just seen you go to church. Could you maybe find one with such programs?

@drspouse have you accessed help from charities like thse?

https://hopeforfamilies.org.uk/parenting
This one has a specific session for helping families manage ADHD related anger issues by the looks of it.

And I have heard excellent things about this charity who also offer support to families like yours:

https://www.careforthefamily.org.uk/

Thanks, I have heard of Care for the Family but wasn't really aware of what they did.

@WhompingWillows its the siblings who are often forgotten in all of this.

@ThisOldThang i posted this on the Legal matters board last week and got vilified by some posters despite the "it takes a village" rhetoric that is often spouted on here.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/legal_matters/5095352-how-can-local-coffee-shop-navigate-this-without-falling-foul-of-equality-act?page=1

The problem with the 'I de-escalate in my job' responses is that the guidance is aimed at teachers, etc.

If a child is violent in school, they can de-escalate by giving in. The safety of the staff is the primary goal, followed by the safety of the other children. It doesn't matter if this results in worse and worse behaviour, because the end game will be permanent exclusion of the child to restore a safe environment.

What is the end game for a family? Adoption?

@WhompingWillows its the siblings who are often forgotten in all of this.

@JenniferBooth yes it can be, which is why I suggested to the OP she do what she can to remove her DD from being next to her DS at triggering times (including feeding them separately as suggested by a PP). So as to protect the DD who the OP has a duty of care to, because the DS has been pulling his sister’s hair when triggered.

WhompingWillows then suggested the OP call the police every time her DS is violent. The OP has already called them at least once, and it seems the hospital did too; both times she was hurt. But she can’t reasonably call the police every time the DS pulls his sister’s hair, so she needs other strategies.

@ThisOldThang

I’m already an adopter (twice over) as is the OP.

Okay, so what's the end game - failed adoption?

Possibly/probably. As there is no real, meaningful support from Children’s Social Care. My adopted daughter of 16 made a false allegation of assault against me and I can’t guarantee that she won’t do the same again. In the meantime, my adopted daughter of eight and I are physically and verbally abused on a regular basis. Following my arrest, my teen went to live with my elderly mum for six weeks (after she was manipulated by social workers) and then, as a result of managing the extreme behaviours, was diagnosed with stress-induced psychosis. My mum has the crisis team visiting every other day and she is starting to go missing. We have had to put together a missing persons profile for her.

My LA agreed a S20 (voluntary accommodation) back in March but they have conceded that they will be unlikely to find a suitable foster placement that would be able to meet her needs. So she is still living with me and still assaulting me. I have tried my absolute best for 15.5 years but I think I deserve to have some quality of life and happiness now. More importantly, my younger daughter deserves to have a childhood without violence and without being told told to ‘fuck off, you little cunt’ on a daily basis.

That sounds terrible.

You need to prioritise your younger daughter.

Can you write to the council and tell them that the 16 year old can no longer live with you and will be homeless at the end of the week?

@Chucklit I just wanted to acknowledge your post - I'm sorry you're going through what you are, it's a lonely-feeling place to be in

The local authority have already accepted that she needs to be housed but you can't magic up a suitable placement by saying 'well she's homeless now, your problem'
Social care will never intentionally place in a hostel because it's very risky. But now that she's 16 and presumably at the end of year 11 housing could place her in a hostel. @WhompingWillows i don't know if you're aware of that. The options for a homeless 16 year old out of year 11 are somewhat better than for an aggressive 15 year old in her GCSE year as she couldn't be placed in a hostel and no foster placement will take her. Residential care might have been an option if you could have got them to agree but it's probably too late.
if you are ok with her being placed in a hostel (and no judgement if you are! That wasn't a loaded statement) you can refuse to have her back the next time she's arrested for assaulting you or her sister. Emergency housing is available, though it's short term and shit. But once you've got her placed somewhere, anywhere, she's more likely to get into a slightly more decent provision.

Hostels surely aren't suitable for a registered blind young person with other disabilities though @PineappleTime ?

What the young woman needs is a residential setting, eg assisted living, with 2:1 care as she's violent (I know of several young people in this sort of set-up). That is of course very hard to achieve, but I would have thought that the DD's disabilities would put her towards the top of the list.

What I meant is, would housing really put a registered blind 16 year old in a 'standard' hostel with no additional care?

I don't know whether whompingwillow's DD is blind as I haven't followed all the posts on the thread but no you are right I doubt a hostel would be suitable in terms of accessibility. I'm not sure why a suitable residential placement hasn't been sought. I have been in that situation with a YP before when we did a nationwide search and had no interest that we were able to proceed with but that's very unusual. Whompingwillow refers to a lack of suitable foster placement but residential care is different and set up to care for children with higher needs.

@PineappleTime

My AD1 is also suffering from a rare autoimmune disease - and takes a chemo drug weekly - that has meant that she has missed eight weeks of school in Y10 and many, many days of school in Y11. She should have been taking her GCSEs this time round but she refused and everyone (Child Protection plan) agreed that she could resit Y11. There is no way AD1 would last five minutes in supported lodgings or a hostel. She is too vulnerable and is extremely executively dysfunctional. All the professionals acknowledge this. Also, she is a very academically able girl and is at a selective grammar school so everyone wants to see her do well. I will try to do my best to grind through and see her to the end of her education as I am fully aware that the cavalry is not coming. It’s fucking hard though. Especially with the worry of the possibility of a future false allegation.

Yes, my DD is registered blind. She is now 16 and she lost the majority of her sight when she was 11 due to her exposure to heroin, methadone, cocaine and cannabis (plus the alcohol) in utero. Apparently, according to her consultant ophthalmologist, it’s methadone that causes the most damage. DD’s optic nerves have been severely damaged. She has a little functional vision in one eye but none in the other; she also has multiple eye conditions which mean that she has no depth perception or peripheral vision in the ‘good’ eye, plus she has a condition which affects her processing speed as the messaging between her brain and her eye is compromised.

@PineappleTime

Just to answer your question, CSC is reluctant - as am I - to move DD1 out of area into a residential placement as she will be moving (back) into Y11 in September to sit 10 GCSEs. She is predicted grade seven and above in her exams. She has an ambition to study Anthropology at university so she can become a museum curator.

The fact that we can't get daytime respite and there's no overnight respite at all makes me extremely concerned about Section 20 and the like. I am also aware we'd have no input into his care, education etc.
Because he was adopted from overseas people have even suggested "sending him back". WFT?

We'd love weekly boarding, but where? There is no obligation to schools to take him - we are in an even worse position than in an area with overstretched mainstream schools - they can be obligated to take extra children, there must be a place for every child legally - yeah right, in fantasy land for us!

@drspouse but as you surely must know, there is an obligation for schools - maintained and s41 anyway - to take children with an EHCP unless they can prove they can’t meet needs. And a lot of LAs fund placements for kids with EHCPs at non-s41 independent schools (mainstream or special) because the LA can’t find a cheaper option that meets needs, or that option is cheaper than the LA’s choice.

Your son is currently at a SEMH school, which hopefully aligns with his EHCP. If it is more or less meeting his needs and he’s not violent there then the LA would probably be reluctant to change it.