Parent and child spaces should be for those with children 5 and under

[seize]

Parent-child parking spaces at supermarkets should be reserved primarily for those with children aged 5 and under, aside from older children with special needs (although a blue badge might be more appropriate where they meet the criteria, in these cases).

I was alone with my 4 month old today, the trolleys with the baby seats are kept next to these spaces. The spaces which have the easiest access to the trolleys had all been taken with the last taken by someone just before me, I reversed into a space around the corner and the driver was shaking their head at me, presumedly because their space only had extra room on one side and my space came up to them (see picture). I was surprised to then see them get out with a child of about 13. I saw multiple other people using these spaces with children looking like teenagers. I was able to get a space which still had fairly easy access to the trolleys, albeit by needing to walk on the road and inbetween the other cars, multiple people had parked in the spaces with the easiest access with much older children. I was lucky to get a space at all, had I not I would have had to walk across the busy carpark holding my baby.

YANBU- Just because someone has a child under 16 doesn’t mean they should take up these spaces, they should save them for people who need them the most.

YABU- first come first served, who cares if someone with a baby is having to traipse across a busy car park holding a baby to get to the baby trolleys.

Problem is there are so many issues at play. When I was much younger/a little kid - 1970s - we never even had car seats. Just got plopped onto the back seat. No seatbelt, nothing, just rolling around like a billiard ball! The spaces were OK sized, the cars were generally small. (Looked normal at the time, but look tiny looking back.) Always easy to get in and out.

Then my brother came along a decade later, (in the 1980s,) and he had a very basic child's car seat. Again, small-ish car, no issues getting in and out. Stopped using a car seat at around 4. Then used seatbelts. (Law from 1987.)

There were no child and parent spaces. (Not that I recall.)

My DC came along mid-late 1990s, and still the car wasn't massive (we always had a car around 10 years old, so would have had a 1980s car.) We used child zones - they were quite new-ish then, and some places were only just starting to have them. We got in and out OK in child zones, AND normal ones (as I said, small-ish car.) We stopped using baby seats when they were about 5 or 6. I am pretty sure there was not a law that said older children (7-8+) had to be in car seats then.

Fast forward 22-23-ish years, and the cars are now MASSIVE. Every other woman and her dog has a giant ass 4WD, she can barely see over the steering wheel, I see many women struggling to manoeuvre in these cars (and park!) and she has limited view behind her (can't see things low down.)

I don't mean to just pick on women sorry, but I see way more women driving these big ass 4WD than men, and some of them do seem to struggle a bit.

I remember an experiment on the TV some 5 years ago, where 24 three to four year olds stood directly behind a large 4WD car, (in 3 rows of 8,) and the driver could only see EIGHT of them; the back row. So the vision out of them is limited too.

So yeah, they are so clucking big that they can't use normal parking spaces now because they can't get the door open properly, let alone get kids out! Even many 'normal' cars now are bulky, because this is the way they are made.

I think so many people have the big 4WD spacious beasts, because they are peddled to families, as amazing 'family cars' where you can pack up half your house to go away for the day/weekend/week etc.

Oh, and the child seats that they have to sit in now til they're TWELVE (and often taller than the fecking mother,) are so big, that a normal/small sized car is a struggle too.

We have been sold this shit, big bulky daft-sized cars, and huge fecking car seats, but still have the stupid wanky tiny car spaces. (And also new build homes still seem to have a garage that would only fit a smart car, or a fiat 500 in!) So these cars have been peddled to people, but the garages and car sparking spaces don't suit!

So yeah, people do need these child and baby spaces unfortunately, as the normal ones are laughably tiny, and many peoples cars (especially those with babies/young children) are HUGE. Heck I occasionally struggle to get out of the car (when there are cars parked either side,) in a normal space with no babies, and my car is a small-ish saloon!

There does not need to be a limit of 5 to the child in the zones though @seize as children have to be in a car seat now til they are 12!. Although a 12 y.o. does not need to be in a child's car seat when they are over 4 ft 5. My 2 DC were as tall as me at 12. (I am 5 ft 3.) I think they were 4 ft 5 at about 8 or 9! I reckon most children of 12 would be over 4 ft 5.

When your child hits 4 ft 5, no matter what their age, they can sit like an adult ... (In the seat with a seatbelt on.) Unless the child has SN of course. The parents using child zones are not 'lazy fuckers' even if the child is 10 or 11, they are quite entitled to use them. (I mean if the 10-11 y.o. is 6 foot -well maybe not then!) 😁

Child Car Seat Laws In The UK - Which?

It's good I'm not phased about what people think then.

YABU. People with children have become so entitled these days that they will actually drive home if they can’t find a parent and child parking space.

Parent and child spaces only exist because they are a way for a supermarket to attract custom. You are not entitled to them whatever age your child is and they are NOT in the same category as disabled spaces which are a legal right.

I say this as someone who has 4 children.

You're both foolish. One of these days you'll challenge somebody who will not take kindly to your unasked for views. You're traceable, however much you think you're not and if you have your children with you then you're taking risks on their behalf also.

Report in store if it bothers you that much.

As a disabled person and Blue Badge holders, I do not need random self appointed parking attendants advocating for me by accosting a person. If you truly care, please report it and hopefully they’ll get fined. They won’t. They just want to be the big I am. I really don’t want anyone to get in a punch up either over a parking space. It’s not worth the risk. Don’t starts fights with strangers with your small children in tow!

Personally I think a parent with multiple children aged 5-10 years old would need the space more than you. You are carrying one 4 month old, so perfectly able to carry them safely across a carpark. Someone with multiple young children all walking would be less able to keep them safe crossing a busy carpark.

I have never been able to park in one of those spaces and my daughter is now 5. I am adept at using normal spaces and have even got my daughter out from the other side. Sigh and move on.

@Causewerethespecialtwo I would never say it in real life. But if you can not get a ND child to safely walk beside you from at least 7 or 8 years old, I think it is a parenting issue.

You are being quite unreasonable. You can easily carry the 4 month old.

Think yourself lucky really - I know you say that this age limit only applies to kids without disabilities but you really can't always tell.

My daughter is 6 and is autistic, the eloping kind. Doesn't speak, will just see something she wants and bolts. Will not respond to instructions. I fear her getting lost as people will not be able to help her.

We frequently look like a Benny Hill sketch trying to catch her at the park etc. Lord knows what the neighbours think of my Steve Irwin impression of wrestling a crocodile, either.

Thankfully, we do have a Blue Badge but often find disabled spaces full and the P&C spaces too so we then have to tag team her or carry her across the car park. That's just life, I'm afraid. Can't always get what you want or even need.

However, I'm not totally convinced that moving the P&C spaces will deter people. You'll still have people in big wanky cars wanting them so as to not have their precious dinged.

I often find all the p&c spaces full, I can only shop at weekends really because I work full time.

Asda always has loads of disabled spaces free, sainsburys doesn’t. Morrisons has a few of each, but the spaces in general are pretty large and the car park is laid out all around the store so it is easy for pretty much anyone to manage in a standard space (my mum is a blue badge holder and rarely even uses the disabled spaces at Morrisons)

It very much depends.

I used to just find any space at the end of a row for that reason. DS soon got to heavy for the trolley seats and I wasn't carrying him in the car seat so that worked

And until you have an older child, you won't understand why parents of older children still use them

You're getting to the point of being quite rude now @seize because a lot of us just do not agree with you. Even you have said in one of your posts that you do not want to walk across the car park to get a trolley.

And if you're really so incensed by this, go when dh is home so you can go alone, or, ya know, use one of the delivery services

Thank you for your concern about my parenting. I was a Nanny for 20 years and I have been a parent for 10 years, so I am perfectly capable of good parenting thank you. Yes 99.9% of the time children are very capable of walking sensibly alongside their parents across a carpark. My point it that on the 0.1% of times when accidents happen - it is more likely to happen with a parent walking along with several older children, rather than a parent carrying one 4 month old. All sensible children with very capable parents occasionally have a trip or a fall, whereas a 4 month old being carried does not.

One thing that gripes me and is against the terms of the blue badge is that the disabled person sits in the car whilst at least one non disabled person leaves the car.

They should only park in the disabled bays if they are leaving the car or being picked up (for example from a hospital appt). If the disabled person isn’t going to leave the car, park in a normal space.

I know which people I would rather know and I'll give you a clue, it's not your type.

Yes, Other options are available like having shopping delivered

Who's laughing?

Is anyone entitled to a parking space? Drivers are so entitled.

Yes, absolutely, that would be one option. I would highly recommend it for those who find it challenging to manage their kids in a car park.

I'm more concerned with people who have no children at all taking the spots, but anyone who says you are BU is missing the point. Parent and child spaces are there to make life easier for parents with young children. We've got a 3 door car and my daughter is RF, it's really not easy to get her out of her seat without sufficient sized parking space, especially considering the abysmal parking abilities of the drivers with 4x4 tanks in our area. And yes, to get the children from the car to the supermarket with minimal wandering around the carpark necessary. The entitled ones are the people parking in spaces that are not meant for them. Before having a baby I would never have dreamed of taking a parent and child spot and we never park there when our daughter is not with us.

In a regular space ,a car door can open wide enough to get an adult in and out of the car. How on earth did people copwe before baby parking

I plan to keep using them until my daughter can strap herself in. At the moment she's 4 and is in a 5-point harness so the space is helpful for me to bend down and strap her in. It isn't easy to do that when you're squashed between big cars. Hurt my back trying to do that once.

Like others have said, it's far more annoying when people use them that have no blue badge or children in their car.

I would highly recommend it for anyone with children, period, but I don't see the need to look down on others who struggle with their kids,just because you don't

@Allfur no - nobody is 'entitled' to a parking space. That's the whole point! If you go shopping at Christmas time and the car park is full, what do you do? Start moaning that some people could really have walked? These parent and child spaces are not a right and have no legal basis whatsoever.

They coped fine. The advent of such spaces has caused a generation of parents who think that having small children is on a par with having a disability. It's pretty pathetic.