To feel angry my narcissist sister has isolated me?

[Questions124]

I’m the youngest of three daughters and all my life my eldest sister has tortured me. I was the weakest of the siblings, I know sisters fight but my parents never got involved. She is 12 years older than me. I remember going into school as a 6 year old with a black eye and spilt lip as my 18 year old sister had an anger outburst and took out on me. I was always prepped before hand by my mum to say I fell of my bike etc. school never picked up on anything. I was severely beaten and abused by her but she could do no wrong, it must have been “something I said to upset her” so it was always my fault. The middle sister had a small amount of this too but never to the extent I had as she would fight back. I remember being terrified one time when I was very small as she kept shouting “I’m going to fucking kill you you little bitch”. I was always terrified but my family even to this day make me feel It was normal.

anyways that’s just a small snippet of the past, maybe I’ll write more another time but back to the present moment. Her daughter, so my niece, has taken over where her mum left off and makes my life hell. We get invited to no family functions as she forbids it. She’s made whole family stop talking to me. I have 2 young kids who are left out of everything. Before anyone says “do you really want your kids to be part of this family” my answer is yes I do, they miss out on my middle sisters events and parties too as my sister is too scared to go against the family, my kids are always asking about their cousins. DH is only child so it’s only my side.

I’m so angry at her and her daughter. I fantasise sometimes they both would die. My family overall if these two weren’t on there be quite nice. When it’s just my parents and middle sister we have so much fun

Am I bu to feel lonely and isolated? I feel so alone. I wish my family were better than this. How can one psycho (well 2 now) cause this much upset. Her daughter is 25 years old. I hate them both so much. I’m in my 40’s and just can’t take anymore.

YANBU to feel isolated. They sound like utter scum and hopefully your sister and her daughter will die in a ditch somewhere.

But it does sound like the entire family are abusers or enablers.

You are better off without all of them.

I’m sorry that’s a painful read, I can’t imagine how it must feel to have lived that experience.

Clearly your sister has big issues and you are better off having no contact at all with her. You mention that when you see the rest of the family it’s fun. Can you instigate this happening at intervals?

Perhaps over time the dynamic of all family gatherings being ruled by her can become less strong.

Do you ever see your middle sister alone? Maybe you could talk to her about how you feel without discussing how much you hate your older sister ( I’d try to avoid her having to take sides).

Your parents are a bit different since they have enabled this abuse for decades.

If you want to be in the lives of your parents and other sister, stop thinking of ever going to big family get togethers but arrange to meet just them separately.

They all sound awful, and I'm not sure it would be good for your children to have too much contact with them. However, I understand wanting to be around your nice sister and parents....

What if you actually stood up to your mad sister? What would happen if you said, "Not this again, Geraldine, give it a rest for once in your life"? I can actually make an educated guess at what might happen, because one of my sisters has EUPD, but the trick is not to make her response into your problem. While she's ranting, you look up kittens on your phone, or eat another jaffa cake or something.

You really don’t want your kids around this dynamic, your family will end up trying to charm your kids away from you as they become teens. You need to have events and invite your sister. If she says no you might just have to play the waiting game and wait for other family members to break away. Also your parents were enablers, meaning they witnessed the abuse and chose to ignore it.

Can you arrange stuff for just you and your middle sister and kids? Don't invite the nasty ones.

I am not sure I would be including my parents if they enabled this rubbish in the first place.

What happens if you make arrangements to see the people you want to see separately?

My parents ignored the abuse I suffered at the hands of my 3 siblings. I see none of them now parents are dead. I think therapy would be a good thing for you, OP.

Thank you all. I haven’t actually spoken to my parents for 3 months. I started talking therapies and a lot came out. I initially had the therapy for another reason (sexual abuse by my cousin when I was in primary school, I think around 6 or 7 years old). Through talking therapies a lot of my childhood came out. So I stopped talking to my mum as she basically told me to just get over it (both the sister abuse and my cousin abuse). I just couldn’t imagine saying this to my kids.

I told my family about it around 18 years ago so it’s not a new revelation. I told them as my niece was getting older and I didn’t want same happening to her. I’ve been in therapy as I normalised everything but looking at my kids how small they are and how small I was just broke something in me and I just feel I can’t get fixed again. Therapy is not working it’s actually making me feel worse.

Create your own relationships with your family that don't involve your parents or older sister.

Meet up with middle sister for coffee and don't advertise this on social media or updating your parents that you met up which gives a chance for older sister to muscle in.

Not everything has to go through a 'family gathering'

Enablers are abusers too and you should be clear about this. Your parents cannot be "nice" because they stood back and let this happen to you. You were a child in their care. You were being abused by another child of theirs, not somebody bigger and stronger and more powerful than them who they couldn't stop. They could have stopped her - they chose not to. What's worse is that they got you (a child) to lie for them. Because of this, if your older sister and her daughter were to disappear, you could not become the happy family you, quite rightly, long for. Thank your lucky stars that you have it in your power to protect your children in a way that you were not protected and do just that.

So sorry for your past troubles

If you're not talking to your parents, I guess that leaves only the middle sister. I am also wondering if you can just arrange to meet her separately.

Your parents allowed an adult to physically and emotionally abuse you as a child, and blamed you (the innocent child). Your parents and sibling allow two adults now to emotionally abuse you and they say and do nothing. Your parents are not nice. I know that is hard to hear. It isn't your fault, there is nothing you did to deserve it, it is not who you are, you are worth far more than this.

YANBU to feel lonely and isolated. You are being treated awfully by your family.

The real question is what do you do about it? Your sister and niece will not change and will continue to emotionally abuse you given the chance. Why would they change when everyone acts like their behaviour is acceptable and there are no consequences? Your parents will not change in finding it acceptable and facilitating it. What will you do when your parents want to see your children alone? When they have a proven record of letting an adult assault a 6 year old? Your other sister will not change in finding it easier to let you down than to challenge abusers (I have more sympathy for her as like you she has been shaped by this dynamic).

In your shoes I would move towards no contact with your parents and see your other sister entirely independently of them. I would also decline to speak about your older sister or hear about it. But it's up to you where your boundaries lie and what you feel would most benefit your wellbeing.

It sounds like a lot of really painful stuff has come up in therapy. 3 months is a very short time to be processing decades of trauma. Feeling worse initially is normal but please don't stop therapy because of that. It sounds like it's being really helpful. Please keep going. It will take time but it sounds like therapy is really helping even if its painful right now.

Yes you have every right to feel upset and isolated by your sister and to a wider extent by your family. Your parents not only didn't protect you from your sister (and cousin), they told you to lie to the school about your injuries. That's horrific! I think taking some space from them sounds really sensible right now.

Your middle sister sounds very trapped in the dynamics. I think realistically the best for you right now is to arrange things with her and her family, and take your older sister and parents out of the equation.

Good luck. I'm sorry you've been so let down by your family consistently both as a child and an adult.

Op I'm sorry for what you went through and I do think that you need to also realise that you have a very toxic family. You shouldn't be forcing your children into a relationship with them just because you feel you don't have much family. You seem to blame your sister BUT refuse to acknowledge that it is your parents here who are the vile and toxic root of the problem. Do you think you sister would have been allowed to be the way she is if your parents did the right thing. If your child told you they were sexually abused would you tell them to get over it? Why wouldn't you do that? Because you are a good mother.
You seem to think of your sister and niece were not around your problems would be fixed? Your parents sound despicable. They condoned abuse. And you want your kids to be around these people ??

This is a seriously dysfunctional and toxic family OP, and its not your fault, but it's so very hurtful.

My narc "mother" said something so hateful to me that I refused to see her any more. She has turned her whole family against me, except for 1 person.
A healthy family doesn't behave like this. Your mother has allowed your sister to behave badly towards you for so long, this is deeply entrenched dysfunction and abuse, and sadly they will not change.

I've had over 2 years therapy which has helped a lot, also the Insight Exposing Narcissism podcasts are incredible, if you look there are some about sisters amongst the 100+ podcasts. The authors also have a book coming out soon called You're Not The Problem.

You need to protect yourself and your own family from these people, they will just perpetuate the abuse so the more distance you have from them the better. I'm sorry this has been happening to you, it's devastating.

As others have said meet up.with middle sister and her family separately. Talk to middle sister about what happened and how it makes you feel and ongoing situation.

Non contact with the abusers. Keep with the therapy.

Good luck.

I have a toxic family like this, also SA as a child by a distant relative which my mother was angry with me about (because it would cause problems for her - abuser wasn't confronted as a result though abuse had stopped).

So I'm not in contact now because I put boundaries in so they walked.

It is hard OP and you are relatively early days in therapy but it will get better. These people will never change and are so dysfunctional they need a whipping boy.

There is life and light after, I promise. You've done nothing wrong. You've got to be a gentle parent to yourself now. Many people find themselves in this dynamic, sadly.

Ultimately you can only build your own family and friends now.

Why people behave like this, I don't know but they are to be pitied...

You can't change them but you can change your attitude to them.
You really don't need those awful people in your life or your children's lives. They add nothing good to your lives.
Keep up the therapy.
Keep up contact with your middle sister. Hopefully she will grow a pair and call them out on their appalling behaviour.

@BonzoGates im sorry you went through this.

thank you everyone for your lovely comments and advice x

The abuse you've suffered is terrible but you seem to be looking at your family with rose tinted glasses and that playing happy family will somehow fix something for you.

I don't think it will.

Your sister and niece sound vile, your parents and sister sound like wimps who are never going to stand up for you.

But if you want to build a relationship with your sister, maybe meet her alone without the kids so that you can have a proper chat about the situation. If she makes excuses, then I think it's fair to say, she's not on your side.

Good luck working this out and keep up with the therapy.

This is what talking therapies are about. It gets worst before it gets better. It WILL get better.
Please keep at it because you need it. It HAS to come out, it will get better.

it is exhausting though so in between sessions and especially after do take time for yourself: a walk with music or an audible, a massage, a swim, a coffee on your own so you can gather yourself.

take care and good luck.

This is so hard. For things to change, everyone in the family needs to understand that there is a problem, and that they each need to change their thinking and behaviour.

The chances are, that won’t happen. People dig in. They do what they’ve always done. They justify themselves by blaming others. Sometimes something happens to change the dynamic… a new baby, a bereavement, for example. But unless the individuals do the work, the toxicity just adjusts to a new level.

It’s so tempting to think that we can change things on our own, by having those conversations. By modelling the behaviour we want to see in others. By being somehow ‘better’. We can’t.

For now, notice the bad behaviour. Don’t respond to it. Just notice it. It will help you to detach from those feelings of obligation.

It won’t help your feelings of disappointment and loneliness and grief. But you can help yourself here by investing in other networks, friends or projects or interests, and creating a strong community around you.

And invest in yourself. Show yourself you care about you. Show your children that the weird shit that your family chucks at you and your family is just weird shit that doesn’t reflect on you or your kids, and that you don’t tolerate.

Good luck.

As others have said, invite your middle sister and her kids to your place. Forget about big family gatherings, do you really want your kids near these people?

Have you ever called her out on her behaviour?