Mixed feelings about WASPI victory

[Fauxflowersnoflowers]

Early 40s here, so this doesn't as such directly affect me, but I've been intrigued by the story about the WASPI campaign and done a bit of reading around it and I'm still confused.

The changes apparently were in the public sphere since as early as 1995 and could have been known about. Many women were aware and did take financial steps to address the changes. The current case seems to centre around whether they should have been personally informed, not was the change fair.

WASPI just said on Women's Hour that they don't object to the equalisation of the pension age, but then callers were objecting to having to work longer and not getting a good retirement, so the two arguments seem to contradiction each other

Also, it seems misunderstood that a compensation payment would be a full reinbursement of the "lost" pension, from my reading it's more likely to be a fixed amount to recognise the fact they should have received a letter. Although again, it appears many did, just not everyone, so who gets the compensation? All of them or just some?

I suppose the other question is how do we pay this? Public services are already stretched badly, childcare costs are crippling and there is a bit of a worry for me that the funds to pay this are going to come out of other areas that will just make the loves of younger women harder and push their pension ages even further back, maybe into their 70s.

Feel really conflicted about it. On one hand kudos to the women for getting this far, but in the other it feels like a really clear example of the importance of properly understanding your own finances and educating yourself about your pension planning.

I agree, the second change didn't give some women any time to prepare, I think mainly 1953/54 born women. I don't see the issue with the 1994 decision but the women who had little notice of the second change do have a case as far as I can see.

You are very confident in what i do and do not believe for someone that has never had a conversation with me before!
the point I agree with compensation for is that this gov expedited the changes without proper notice, so even if women had done their financial planning, they then were not given long enough to adapt to the changes.

Do you believe Is the NHS a benefit then?!? Because we re paying into that!
there is a contract we have with the gov, we pay our taxes and NI because we expect certain protections off the back of this. These women have PAID their tax, they have contributed to society in doing so and they and we fully expect to receive a pension out of it. It is NOT a benefit it IS a right.
And let’s not forget in NOT paying these women their pensions they have saved money, even with the compensation paid, it won’t be the same amount the women would have received!

That is exactly the point. My MIL got her pension several years before my DM did even though they are only a year apart in age.

NI didn't give equal benefits in the first place, I paid the same rate of NI as my husband. His payment provided for a widow's pension for me if he died, my payments didn't give me that so I paid for insurance so that he would recieve an additional income if I died. So yes I was supposed to be able to retire earlier, but he got additional benefits that I didn't. It is a very complicated issue.

There is an assumption here that DWP sent letters out I can assure you I never received any. I was aware that the pension age was increasing and therefore I would need to keep working. I don't think they made a song and dance about it though to not stir everyone up.

Claim the Government never told them that pension age was now 65/6. But the Government never, at any time, ‘told’ them it was 60; so why assume that it was ?

No the govt did tell us the pension age for women was increasing from 60 to 65, years of warning and a gradual change which was then speeded up with little warning.

The NHS is a service. That's what the 'S' stands for.

The state pension is a benefit - that's a fact, not a matter of opinion.

The contributions you made were to pay for those receiving state pension at the time.

Nobody has a right to a state pension.

I got caught out like your Mum. I made retirement plans based on what we knew at the time, only to discover that even though I'd made the requisite number of NI payments, I would have to wait an extra 6 years for a state pension. We had the additional problem that few organizations would employ women (or men for that matter) over the age of 60.

Are you sure that's right? If you MIL is two years older than your mum, she wouldn't be six years ahead in terms of getting her state pension. Your MIL would have had to have been born before 6 April 1950 to retire at 60.

I’m of the WASPI generation.
My back is ruined from nursing.
I was fortunate to retire with my dh because he has a decent work pension. My work pension is tiny because I could only work part time in a low paid job for the last 20 years due to said back injury.

If I get any compensation, which I doubt, it will go straight to my dgc nursery fees because believe it or not some of us boomers do love our dc and want to help them. Unlike many of the pp’s on here who seem to hate their parents.

The state pension is taxable but isn't taxed at source.

With the big increases it has seen the past couple of years and frozen tax free allowances, the new full rate of state pension will soon overtake the tax free allowance.

Exactly. It wasn't a gradual increase for some of us, but a very nasty shock.

Well I object to the assumption that because I’ve got a vagina I should knock work on the head early so I can be a skivvy for everyone else. It’s cultural misogyny.

WASPI payouts
Post Office compensation
Contaminated blood
Windrush

Peoole pretend that it’s some magic government pot of gold that pays for these debacles. It’s not. It’s the taxpayer who pays. People who had no part to play in the mess. While corrupt and incompetent government ministers and civil servants get away with their fat pensions and gold plated pay offs.

Out governments and civil servants are truly some of the worst, brain dead algae type creatures.

And to think that these MPs were filibustering in parliament last week discussing ferrets to prevent a debate on the wrongs of chemically castrating children. Which by the way, will be another scandal that the taxpayer mugs will end up paying for.

If it's so unfair that you had to work a bit longer, what about all the younger nurses who have to work even longer than you? Their husband's are also retiring even later.

She didn't get it years before if only a year older.

Yes I agree with addressing the structural issues but structural issues for women have existed for a long time and impact all women across the age range. I'm not a WASPI woman and won't benefit from this but as a 50+ year old, I lost the chance to build up a private pension due to having children and being forced out of the workforce - usual issues of no childcare and then no schooling for two of my #SEND kids. I've never been able to catch up since becoming a mother and carer and will end up relying on the state pension. I haven't been able to work out how much I will lose from the government moving the goalposts as I've been too busy caring and that's the other issue - its not the lack of will or intelligence not to financially plan but the sheer exhaustion of being a carer with health issues which means its difficult to prioritise your own needs. As for the WASPI women, well done for them fighting their cause because its important that as women we continue to fight against any inequality or poor treatment. I don't begrudge them compensation just because I won't benefit and I think if I was to criticise, it would be against the government for screwing up again.

God, am shocked by wild assumptions, wilful ignorance and misunderstanding about a whole generation of women.
The ombudsman has found in this group of women’s favour. All the stuff that we are used to now did not exist then. The point is the short time for adjustment in 2011 and the fact that the government didn’t tell those affected by letter, blitz of information as they did for the 1995 change. Unfortunately you can’t legislate whether your auntie’s neighbour’s mother spends it on a cruise but you can be sure that some women who desperate need the money, who ended up being sidelined or sacked cos they were mistakenly thought to be on the verge of retirement by their dinosaur male bosses or who told their children that they’d do the childminding when they retired so go ahead and have a baby now and don’t worry about me as I’ll be on my pension are the ones who have been stuffed.
I am honestly shocked by the lack of intergenerational sisterhood on this thread. I am expecting to retire at 67 but if there is a change to raise the age, I’d certainly expect to be informed properly by the government via letter and have a decade to plan

My aunt is also affected. She was one who had to sell her house.

My other Aunt, her elder sister was one of the women who fought for equal pay at Dagenham. They both spent their lives fighting for women's equal rights in the workplace.
When I read some of the threads on here it really is clear that there is either a lack of knowledge - or lack of caring - about what that generation of women did to ensure that workplaces were a fairer place for your generation.
ANd yet instead of thanking them, you begrudge them a tiny bit of compensation because they were shafted by the Tories. Yes, they knew the change was coming, but 2 years was not enough time to make up the shortfall in what they were going to receive.

If you don't want to lose the state pension, then get up off your arses and fight for it. They did. And hopefully your daughters will show more respect for you than you do for the generation who got you more equal pay and maternity rights.

It’s defined as a benefit because it’s rooted in the social security framework as a statutory scheme.

Therefore as long as the statute remains in place state pension will be paid based upon the framework in place.
It would take an act of parliament to change the legislation for state pension not to be paid to those who fulfil the rules required for receipt.
Therefore your insistence that it’s not a right is fairly pedantic.

Couldn't agree more @lanadelgrey

"I am honestly shocked by the lack of intergenerational sisterhood on this thread."
Sadly I'm not - MN is as ageist as fuck.

The ageism on this thread is truly depressing .

You are assuming that anyone born in the 1950s agrees with the WASPI. I was born in the 1950s and I don’t agree with them at all.