To think service charges should be banned?

[Precipice]

I think it totally unacceptable for restaurants to add extra charges onto the bill and put the onus on the customer to have these charges removed.

To me, this is no different than if I went to Lidl or Waterstones and had my shopping totalled up as 20.99 and then the shop added an extra 2.09 automatically and forced me to apply to them to remove it; or if the item price said 12.99, but the till was deliberately set up to charge me 15.99.

I see this more and more. I think this should be made illegal under consumer protection.

YABU - it's fine for any industry to add on whatever extra charge they want as long as they eventually remove it for customers who raise it with them

YANBU - customers should only be charged according to listed price for the item/service chosen

I'm personally more than happy that they have put the suggested tip on top of the total, as it saves me calculating. 12.5% I believe is the norm. If service is great then I tip a bit more. If it is utterly awful then I simply do not pay the tip. It is a suggestion. I've actually very rarely chosen not to tip, I take it as part of the cost. Being a waiter is hard work, much harder than lots of other jobs with a similar wage. If the food tastes bad it's not the waiter's fault either.

Only for a large party the cost of delivering the meal with decent service increases because they'd need extra staff to do so. Why should anyone else subside that?

I don't agree with adding on service charges in general, but I also don't think that a large party, that incurs an extra cost to deliver, should not pay the extra that it costs to deliver the service. It's not subsidising wait staffs wages in that case, it's paying for what you're getting.

That's a huge tip. And don't even start me on the stupid charity donations places are adding to bills now. Just let me pay for my meal and leave a tip without feeling like an utter tightwad when I have to ask to manually remove a donation to a charity I've never heard of

We went to Six by Nico - they added on a 18% service charge and a charity donation without asking

This "charity donation" thing is spreading horribly in America - it's even started in the UK - and since like the service charges/tips we'll probably never know where the money really ends up it can be just another way to gouge money from the timid

Fortunately there's a useful response: "I already support my chosen charities so I'd prefer it taken off please"

It's different in the USA etc as waiting staff are not paid a minimum wage.

I don’t understand this at all, why businesses in the US have no legal obligation to pay their staff a minimum wage, must clearly make a profit and instead of paying their staff correctly expect their customers to top up staff wages, it’s an insane concept.

Actually they do now have a minimum wage for tipped staff, though it varies by state:

https://clockify.me/learn/business-management/tipped-wages/

It's become such an unfair norm lately. Staff in restaurants are paid similarly to supermarket/childcare/hotel staff and they don't get tips. Tips should be for great service

Agreed. I asked for the service charge to be removed recently, after frankly appalling service. They were gobsmacked 😂
No problem at all tipping for good service.

I always ask for it to be removed and then tip if I feel one is warranted

I hate it. It does put me off returning to some places where the amount charged can't be jutified by the service.

"Both times the waiter serving us was obliged to bring their manager over to our table who repeatedly questioned us about why we weren't paying the service charge and if anything was wrong!"

This exactly what happens when I've asked to remove the service charge. It's very unfair and a lot of people don't know that is optional.