To feel like I’m walking on eggshells the whole time with 12 year old ASD daughter 😢

[Confusedallthetime0]

I feel I’ve gone from being a pretty confident person and mother to a shell.

Nothing seems good enough and the only time she seems remotely happy is when she’s spending money but even that is very short lived.

No matter how many courses I’ve been on, how many support groups I join, life just feels so difficult as I have to watch everything I say, she is highly critical and tells me daily that I shouldn’t have had children if I don’t know how to be a parent ( this is usually because she doesn’t know what she wants to do or eat and then gets really frustrated when I offer the wrong ideas )

She has taken to telling me how fat I am ( Size 14 so not slim but equally not obese as she keeps telling me ) and how embarrassing I am generally

My self esteem is so low now and I want to be a positive happy mum again

ASD isn’t an excuse for being rude to you, that’s normal teenager rudeness and needs to be made clear it’s unacceptable

So what happens if you tell her she is being rude and take away a privilege (as you would do with a NT child)? Presumably meltdown. But what form does this take?

Is she rude and offensive towards other people, or is it just you?

Before I say what I'm going to say, I have ADHD, my dad has asphergers, my sister is autistic and both my children have suspected ADHD/Autism

It sounds like shes just being rude and nasty more than this being an ASD issue. Theres no way she doesnt know what shes saying/doing is hurtful.

What do you do and say when she says these things to you?

Btw wasn’t suggesting you’re using it as an excuse, you’re obviously a brilliant mum who wants to support your daughter but you shouldn’t put up with being spoken to like that

My 2 DS both autistic, 1 also adhd and touretts. 15 and 18, I also have 2 older DD. I wouldn't accept this behaviour from anyone and would make it clear and just keep repeating, if you can't say something nice don't say nothing.
Also stop asking what she wants to do or for dinner instead say, chicken pasta bake or spag bowl for dinner, narrow the choices down, if that fails just say chicken pasta bake for dinner. My DS won't eat wet or coloured food, but I know what they eat so I just cook that. Its also a hard age and she will only get better if you start pulling her up on it. What's she like at school? Any other children?

I'm so sorry you are going through this; if she's being so rude I wouldn't be holding back.
Are you her safe space and she is fine with others?

Can I chime in and say I understand - my 13yo reduces me to tears sometimes and picks apart all my failings as a parent - he is definitely lacking empathy. Yes I can tell him it’s not acceptable to talk to me like that but it doesn’t have much impact. He has very little filter between thoughts and words and thinks if he is telling the truth then he can’t see the problem. Not much to advise except getting support for you as a person, not just parenting support (which I’ve also had way more than enough of).

As I often say to folk...autistic people can be assholes, too. In particular here, your DD is not immune to the usual teenage "personality hole" where they think they regard everybody else with condescension and a roll of their eyes.

My immediate question, though, would be...do you know what the intent behind those statements is? By that, I mean...is she actively trying to be mean, or does she think she's making a useful/factual statement?

It might be worth asking her, during a relatively calm moment, why she seems to be trying to destroy your self-worth. Empathy is a thing autistic people feel, it's often just a question of addressing it in the right context. The point is not to get an answer out of her, but rather to put a couple of thoughts in her mind that may not have occurred to her before - that you're actually vulnerable to this kind of verbal assault, and that her treatment of you is having long-term effects beyond the momentary conversations in which she does so.

I think you need to be equally direct and explain that being critical and insulting is rude and will not be tolerated. She needs consistent, meaningful consequences for bad behaviour, such as cancelled plans (like grounding) or removal of devices for significant periods of time, etc.
You also have to let her know that you are her mum. You love her without question and nothing will stop that, but you do not need her approval or her opinions about decisions you are making. She is a child and you are an adult, and thus - the world isn’t a democracy for her yet.

I have made it very clear over and over again how upsetting what she says can be but honestly whether I get cross or upset, whether I don’t react at all - it makes no difference.
She just continues to be really critical, mainly towards me but she can be similar with her dad.

2 older girls - nothing like this at all.
One has ADHD/ASD but they present very differently so I don’t have any experience with this

I have a 13 yo with ASD. I would say that what you are describing has nothing to do with your daughter's autism and is more about teenage behaviour and her pushing the boundaries.

There needs to be clarity that being frustrated, overwhelmed, angry is ok and you can support her to work through that but personal attacks and nastiness nastiness is not and will have consequences.

Does she have any responsibilities/ chores that she does to earn the money she likes to spend?

Sweetheart honestly, don't confuse her disrespectful attitude and rudeness towards you with her additional needs. They are two different things. Her additional needs cannot be helped to a degree, but being rude, disrespectful and downright abusive towards you can be controlled. That may be where your focus needs to be as boundaries are very clearly being crossed here. You do not deserve to be spoken to like this by anyone, and certainly not by a 12 year old child. I know it won't be straightforward but you need to toughen up on this pronto. Stop allowing her to think that it's ok to speak to you like dirt. It is not ok.

Out of interest what does her dad do when she talks to him this way? I think it's pointless trying to explain his it makes you feel as she's just not able to absorb what you are saying. Make your actions more decisive instead and insist that her dad supports you with it. Privileges need to be removed every time you are spoken to like dirt by her. When her mouth starts having consequences it might have more effect.

No advice but hugs and solidarity here. I know there are lots of people with ASD who do not have these issues, but that doesn’t mean it can’t be a facet of how ASD presents for some people (‘equalizing’ behaviour: ‘I feel shit and anxious so I’m going to make sure you feel shit and anxious as well, because that way it will be fair’). I also absolutely get how it still wears you down no matter how much you know it’s not about you, and no matter how you respond or how much empathy and declarative language you use, how you draw your boundaries, etc etc. It is just fucking unpleasant being criticised and belittled all the time.

I’m here to listen if you need to vent.

The reason I think it’s to do with her ASD rather than approaching teenage years and pushing boundaries is that she’s always been similar.

She was critical of peers from a very very young age and no matter what consequences there are, nothing changes.

Her dad will take away her pocket money if she comments about anyone in the house in a rude way ( heavily around weight ) but she then just says she hates him and this is why.

I tend to try and talk to her but she will just repeat that meant what she said or she wouldn’t have said it in the first place.
If I cry, she says I am attention seeking and need therapy.

Her empathy score within her ASD assessment was very very low.

This is exactly exactly it.
It is just shit - if this was a relationship I would be running for the hills screaming control!
But I can’t do that when it’s my daughter almost bullying me 😞

My DS has been like this since he could speak. (His diagnosis is ASD with PDA profile - could this be part of the picture for your DD as well, OP?)

I will not engage with you while you are being unkind. When you’re ready to talk nicely, let me know.

Walk away.

Repeat every single time.

She is old enough to make herself some cereal/sandwich etc. if she’s that hungry.

It’s really hard I also have a child with ASD who can be super abrupt/snappy - usually because he is frustrated and can’t express himself. I don’t berate him because he can’t help it, but I won’t stand around and be spoken to in a way I don’t like because of it.

With the nasty comments. Exactly the same. Walk away.

I also agree with providing limited choices of “safe” foods or meals to try and eliminate clashing.

You can train her out of being rude by negative consequences every time she does it.

Her dad has the right idea.

If her response is that it's true then don't bother talking about feelings, just make sure that if she does it there is a consequence.

It probably won't stop but it will lessen,

In addition - have to agree with the other posters this is mostly teenager not ASD.

Something my DH (ASD/PDA himself) is able to do that I find very difficult is just not make suggestions.

So if DS doesn’t know what he wants to do/wear/eat, DH just kind of wanders off and figures it’s not his problem. (Which is his unique privilege since he is effectively domestically inert and I’m the one in charge of school runs, cooking, shopping - in short everything that involves a decision, a deadline, and getting buy-in from DS).

But DH’s response at least doesn’t escalate the situation, whereas any time I suggest anything at all to DC it draws a violently rageful response. So I only try to intervene with decisions if it is urgent and time sensitive and I am willing to endure a meltdown.

But my God it is hard. You have my utmost sympathies. And I do think this is not just adolescence.

I also feel like such an outlier in SEND parenting communities where most people’s children have sensory issues and some social communication stuff but don’t struggle enormously with frustration tolerance / impulsivity / emotional regulation. This then gets ‘othered’ out of what anyone wants to acknowledge as part of the ASC constellation (along with learning difficulties - but that’s a rant for a different day)

As a mum of an autistic/ADHD 12 year old I wouldn't tolerate this. You are not her punching bag. Yes I understand she is probably struggling due to her own needs but that doesn't make it ok to destroy you mentally. My son struggles a lot and will make hurtful comments. If speaking to him isn't enough to make him realise how hurtful these comments are he is warned if it happens again his mobile, laptop etc will be confiscated for 48 hours. If he does it again these items are removed and he is told to think about how he would feel if these things were said to him. It's a vital lesson for him to learn not to speak to people like that. You need to set your boundaries on this and do not shift from this. Your not her human verbal punching bag so please don't let her treat you like this. You deserve better than this and your daughter needs to learn to respect you.

Ah OP I could have written this about ADHD DS. For what it's worth, he's now 15 and out the other side, but (and I say this as his mother who would do anything for him) he was a rude, insufferable arsehole from 12-14. Nothing triggered this. Nothing stopped it. It was a horrible phase that he simply appeared to go through as part of puberty.

Was it just his personality? Was it exacerbated with SEN? Don't know.

We had blazing rows, he was horrendous. We had to "fight" back because if we didn't, he got worse. Honestly those two years were fighting and not a lot else. He would be indignant at the mere suggestion he couldn't speak to people that way, and we all "needed therapy/were shit parents/morons/idiots who shouldn't have had children/to blame for everything". Got to the point he would smash things in defiance.

He's literally just stopped of his own accord. I wish I could tell you what to do, we tried everything. Kindness, long talks, discipline, no discipline, shouting, sanctions, rewards, routine, no routine, structure, no structure. His consultant had no more ideas and essentially said buckle up and wait for it to pass. And it did.

I wish I knew then, how different it would become, because at the time, I can remember thinking, I can't do this anymore, he's going to end up either beaten up or in prison if he launches into the world behaving like this as an adult.

Sending you strength, you're not alone. It may sort itself out quicker for you xx

I think you need to sit down with her and agree some ground rules, and appropriate consequence, when they're broken. E.g, losing her screen time (set a maximum and then reduce by 30mins for each rule break). Just because she has ASD doesn't mean she doesn't mean you can't have boundaries and hold them.

I very much agree with other posters who say that she's doing this because her self esteem is rock bottom and she's really unhappy. That doesn't make it ok.

In the long term, I think you need to look at finding sources of self esteem for her other than buying things. Does she have hobbies? Friends? How is school?

What happens if you just don't engage with the rudeness at all? Like, take yourself into another room?

I also think you need to find sources of pleasure and self esteem outside of parenting. I know it's hard to take time for yourself especially out of the house, but supporting your DD is a long term thing and you need to be able to manage that.