AIBU as a Type 1 Diabetic, to be baffled the seemingly sudden influx of non diabetics using CGM's...?

[OSAP]

If your pancreas works, you don't need one.

Blood glucose isn't exclusively influenced by the food you eat so 'personalised nutrition plans' 'metabolic trackers' etc etc are a, usually expensive, gimmick.

Nobody seemed too fussed about their 'blood glucose' when it involved finger pricks, but the Freestyle Libre now seems to have become a must have accessory for the 'worried well' who now seem to need to know what their blood sugar is doing, all while not really understanding what most of it means.

@banananas1999 I've said on numerous occasions I can understand someone worried about T2 using CGMs and that education is no bad thing. But equally people genuinely worried about T2 may find it more useful to have a HBA1C.

@irishapple any rudeness is in a direct response to you minimising the experiences of diabetes. Let's not pretend you've not said offensive and rude things yourself.

Besides, I thought you were genuinely interested in understanding how your T1 patients may feel. This thread is full of experiences of T1s and parents of T1s and diabetics on insulin. And you've just come on and basically told us that we are all wrong to feel the way we do. But yeah keep telling yourself I'm the one that's rude.

@banananas1999 I think the point is not that people want to be healthier, that in itself is great.

The point is that using a CGM is just spending money unnecessarily. You don't get more healthy, or healthier more quickly, just by wearing one of these things and watching the graph go up and down. All this talk of 'spikes' and 'crashes' is a dramatic way of describing normal bodily reactions and I think proves that many people don't really grasp what these readings mean.

There seem to be more companies who are marketing them as a wondrous insight that will be hugely beneficial but, actually, it won't at all. I can't remember which one (it might have been Lingo) and it was claiming to help you also sleep better as well as the more typical weight loss. You don't need a CGM for that!

I haven't been rude - if I've offended anyone I apologise.

@irishapple I don't think you've been rude at all.

However I am a bit worried that you say you're a medic who was given one by a rep but seem to have very limited understanding of the basics of blood sugar. I apologise if it's not a field you're familiar with, I am assuming so due to being given a Libre to use.

@OSAP what don't I understand exactly?

This is a general discussion forum. I'm not in work.

That you didn't make the connection between what you were eating for breakfast followed by how you felt later.

Like I explained - it was what would be considered relatively healthy and not overly sugary. So no, I didn't automatically make the connection. Plus like I said, I'm busy, a mum of 3, work full time and possibly stuck in a rut and not prioritising myself. That has absolutely nothing to do with my clinical understanding of blood glucose.

I was an accidental CGM in that I signed up to Zoe without realising it involved wearing one. In my case it turned out to be life changing. I’d had GD, done finger pricking throughout two pregnancies, had HBA1Cs every year as NICE recommends, and ten years on my level remained at the higher end of normal. But I remained scared, desperate to lose weight (I struggle hugely) and half convinced that the only reason my HBA1C wasn’t prediabetic was my long term low sugar lowish carb eating. When I found out about the CGM I decided to eat whatever I fancied for the fortnight just to see how my body reacted. And guess what? My blood sugar responses were totally normal. It was a massive relief and has led me to relax and eat more wholegrains and less meat. But I did find some of the comments on Zoe groups really uninformed and was also quite concerned about people sharing screenshots of what appeared to be really high glucose levels without any feedback from Zoe about medical intervention, just talk about ‘poor sugar control’.

I’m sure, just like heart rate monitors on wearables, these things will be driving increased GP attendance, possibly not from the right people! And I had no idea there was a shortage of devices, so do regret taking one off someone in greater need.

@irishapple Ok. Thank you for replying.

@Toospotty That's awful on the Zoe front!

The shortage situation has come up several times. I am not 'allowed' to have more than 4 at a time (so two months supply if they don't fall off, malfunction, and whatever else they are prone to do) but I don't know if that's down to budget or availability. I know Zoe did another of their ad's talking about how it does NOT affect supply but I am not entirely convinced they are trustworthy!

https://stockanalysis.com/stocks/abt/

look at the net worth of Abbott - net worth of $205.83 billion as of March 4, 2024

the supply issues could be a localised NHS problem rather than an manufacturing shortage. A company worth 205 billion dollars is going to invest in supplying to keep up with demand. Would be interesting to know if the libre is affected by materials or component shortages or this is a NHS procurement issue.

If people want to spend pn money on them why not, its great way of finding out how different foods affect the bloodsugars- rather that than spending money on vapes,alcohol,cigs or tattoos?

its great that people are becoming health concious and i am sure some peoples diabetes or pre diabetes will be caught thanks to them or perhaps delayed that insulin wont be needed and meds like metformin will do

it also gives GPs good overview,my husband boight himself dexcom and he was diagnosed with pre diabetes thanks to that,his hbac1 was borderline prediabetes but fasting levels were too high

Most GPs know squat about diabetes, and most Type 1s would say you have to become your own expert because everyone's diabetes reacts differently, to food, to exercise, to alcohol, to stress, or just for no obvious reason whatsoever. I have seen that just within my own family.

And you have to be a special kind of twat to start talking about 'spikes' and 'crashes' to diabetics. If you are not diabetic they are no such thing, they are a normal bodily process as it reacts to an intake of food and your body will have you back in normal range within the 2-hour mark, if not sooner. All you are going to learn from a Libre is that this is what your body is doing and that some foods, and food combinations, will cause your body to react quicker or slower than others. Do people really not know that already?

@banananas1999 this thread is primarily about Type 1, as evidenced by @OSAP 's thread title. Your second paragraph only relates to Type 2, just to clarify.

This post seems to be about t1s (yes t1 sucks)complaining that other people shouldnt use glucose sensors,where some people might improve their diet thanks to them, postposne prediabetes or diabetes or manage to reduce medications,it can only be benefit

only in the uk where over half the population is obese or mordbidly obese people complain that people dare to spend their own money on a product that will lead them on a healthier path

@banananas1999 but people who are t1 need these medical items.
People who are using them as easy way to lose weight don't. By the 2nd group buying them it can stop the 1st group getting access to them in times of low supply.

I'm not aware of any shortages in supply yet, so I don't have any problem with non-diabetics buying them for themselves. As @banananas1999 says, people taking more responsibility for their health is a good thing.

The issue for me is that it trivialises what the tech is for. Diabetes is a chronic, lifelong (potentially life-threatening) medical condition(s) which involves constant monitoring of blood sugars and making dozens of decisions about food and lifestyle every day. It's relentless and the nature of it being in your mind every second also has ramifications for mental health, particularly in teenagers. It is generally considered a disability under the 2010 Equality Act.

When someone on a Forum or in real life comes along and says something along the lines of 'Aren't Libres wonderful. I used to have Frosties and toast with jam for breakfast and now I have porridge and a banana and my blood sugars don't spike', it's quite irritating because a) they're not 'spiking', they are going up in a normal fashion and your pancreas will regulate them back to the normal range, b) you don't actually have to take invasive action to correct your blood sugars as your body will do this for you, c) surely everyone knows that anyway? I mean, you may not know precisely what number you go up to but if your body corrects it anyway, it really doesn't matter and d) you're medicalising something which doesn't need to be medicalised. In diabetics, it does need to be medicalised.

When people also think this process gives them an insight into life with diabetes, it becomes more than just irritating. Hopefully the non-diabetics can grasp why that might be the case.

Tbf the companies that manufacture them shouldn't be selling them to everyone if supplies are going to run low
Not sure ow much the Libre cost ,s but my sons Diabetic nurse told us his three month supply of Dexcom,six ,cost £800 so I'm not sure how people are affording them just to keep on eye on non existing blood sugar issues.

The Libre costs £52 which lasts 2 weeks.

@banananas1999 Seriously, you say "yes T1 sucks" in such a fucking nonchalant way, while having failed to read any of the actual concerns from diabetics on this post. The biggest of which is that Zoe is trivialising type 1 diabetes to be an inconvenience that "sucks".

And @irishapple I hope you have a better bedside manner for your diabetic patients than telling them about your blood glucose 'spikes and 'crashes' like you've done here. FYI it tends to get diabetic's backs up when you use that kind of language to describe perfectly normal blood glucose reactions.

@Fleurty I would never discuss my blood glucose with a patient. You are all so defensive on this thread and not open to hearing others opinions, rather you cling on to every "mistake" someone might make when talking about their experiences. No one on here is trying to minimise diabetes. I have a very close family member with the disease and it's slowly destroying their body.

I have also not discussed spikes. I don't have "spikes". If I used the word crash in an offensive way I apologise, but come on - no one is perfect and it's clear I wasn't intending to offend.

Unfortunately most diabetics spend a lot of headspace dealing with people who are not trying to offend us. I myself have posted in this thread about how Zoe has increased the amount of offensive and insensitive comments I regularly receive.

This thread is about how Zoe is making us, as people living with all types of diabetes feel. As someone who has no clue about living with diabetes (and no, a diabetic relative doesn't count) please stop telling us our feelings are invalid just because you don't agree it is how we should feel.

To be fair to @irishapple, regardless of whether you agree or not, she has clearly tried to be diplomatic while explaining her experience.

Not true, in fact. This is from your post at 13.22pm yesterday: Personally, I was really interested to see how my normal breakfast causes my blood sugar to spike and then crash within an hour or two

As has been explained to you by several PPs, you aren't actually experiencing either. What you are experiencing is the natural raising and lowering of blood sugars, which your non-diabetic body is dealing with in a perfectly normal way. Slightly perturbing that a medical professional doesn't appear to understand this.

@thing47 ok I stand corrected - I said spike but I wasn't meaning to cause any offence and was perhaps a bit fickle with my words. Blood glucose isn't supposed to go from 10 to 3.8 in the space of an hour or so though. It's supposed to be more gradual than that - and is usually caused by producing too much insulin after eating. Symptoms include dizziness, feeling shaky and nausea. Nothing life threatening and not indicative of any disease state. But it's real and it was affecting me like I've already described. If I used terminology that offended you I am sorry but please, you cannot assume everyone is out to minimise diabetics and use words with the direct intention to offend. When I said spike, I meant rise (in a normal fashion) after eating. Just because spike has a different and more serious meaning to you, doesn't mean the word is off limits to others.

You also shouldn't make reference to anyone's suitablity to do their job - I could take such offence at some of the things you've said but I understand you're angry. I'm a generalist, not a specialist, and I haven't said anything that's medically incorrect - albeit you're not happy with my terminology.

I would just say that with the libre, as it’s trying to predict bg, when it’s changing rapidly in such circumstances you’ve mentioned it can be inaccurate. It might be that when you saw 10 a finger prick would show 7 and when you saw 3.8 it would be 4.5. For me that’s the worst thing about people using libre - a lack of understanding as you can’t get to know it without using alongside finger prick and using for months on end. It’s good for identifying patterns though. That’s why many people prefer dexcom or hack libre and use a third party app (like I do) so you can calibrate it. I think people will panic unnecessarily seeing numbers that could potentially be wrong.