To suggest they ban this child from the SEN session

[Heartofglass83]

DD3 attends a weekly SEN gymnastics session which she loves. It’s got a big inflatable assault course / slide which is obviously really popular. The average age of the kids is probably about 5/6. Occasionally there’s an older child but they would normally have two parents walking round holding their hands etc.

the last few weeks there’s been a boy probably about 12 or 13 with quite visable learning difficulties who is very excitable and climbs to the top of the slide and stops children from going down the slide the supervisor has a few times had to ask his parent/carer to get him down as he jumps about so much the whole inflatable knocks all the other kids down. The parent / carer sits away on their phone the whole time.

DD went into the assault course and I normally follow her down and as she climbs up the ladder I walk back down to the bottom of the slide. As I was walking the boy ran up the slide and sat at the top. DD said “excuse me please” and he grabbed her by the pigtails and yanked them really hard before dragging her by the hair to throw her down the slide. I bellowed at the adults who were with him (who were all slouched away on their phones) and one jumped up the slide to get him off her.
DD has spent the last few hours really shocked and upset. I’m really angry because this is one of her favourite spaces where she can be herself.

i want to flag this to management - am I being unreasonable to say they need to give a warning and then ban this child from attending the session? I don’t blame the child in anyway, I blame the complete lack of supervision and care from the adults in charge of him. He is too big, and too excitable to be playing with small children without an adult constantly being with him. I dread to think of what could have happened as he is already quite a big lad.

YANBU at all. You've acknowledged that it isn't the child's fault but equally it's not safe for other children. Shame on those who should be supervising him!

Also I hope your DD is ok.

Sounds really dangerous. Hope your DD is ok and I think you’re being more than reasonable.

If he can’t be suitably supervised then as hard as it is for him he shouldn’t be at the sessions.

if there are a few older children accessing them then maybe having the session split for younger and older children would be an option.

I would speak to management and ask that they make it very clear all attendees must be closely supervised at all times.

This needs flagging. The idea of sessions for older and younger children has merit too

I said YANBU because obviously that cannot happen again. I don't think he should be banned though, as if he is within the age bracket and he has SEN (which he clearly does), then he has every right to be there. The stipulation should be that he needs to be closely supervised by his parent or guardian at all times.

I hope your DD is ok.

YANBU at all, doesn’t sound one these sessions are the right environment for this child.

I think they should probably remind adults at check in about needing to comparably supervise but I get the impression some of the adults are agency support staff who probably don’t give that much of a shit.

I would raise this with management. As a SEN session he has the right to access it as he fits the criteria. There is possible merit in an older and younger session depending on the amount of attendees.

At the heart of it, it is a supervision and safety issue. I think management need to have a discussion with the parents/ carers of this child about supervision and if they are not supervising closely then unfortunately they will be asked to leave. I'm surprised that it's not in the T's and C's about adequate supervision.

If he is being brought by carers, it is likely his parents (who will be paying for the session and for the carers) are unaware. If they are indeed paying for carers to attend with him, then they will be interested to know they are not supervising appropriately. Unfortunately carers are a mixed bunch. There are some fantastic ones and some very poor ones. I actually reported a safeguarding incident at my local leisure centre the other year as a group of 4 carers were bringing a couple of clients with very significant needs (non verbal, needed a hoist to get in the pool) swimming, but then giving them a pool noodle in the shallow end and basically abandoning them to swim lengths. One of the disabled young people they brought with very significant needs (1:2) went under the water and the lifeguard had to help them. The carers were chatting in the deep end of the pool. I was told there was to be an investigation.

If they are the parents attending, I can understand the need for some downtime where they are not always on. With the dire state of respite availability and suitable school places, this may be the only time they are not always on. However, as the child needs much higher supervision and support than just allowing him to take over inflatables, this is probably not the place for their downtime. Every child has the right to be safe.

I think banning him is wrong but management and his parents need do ensure it’s a safe environment for all.

I’d be formally asking management to ensure that older dc is properly supervised and explain exactly what happened to your dd - in writing

I agree with @Sirzy , it’s not safe to have this activity for such a wide age range. Children above primary age are typically so much taller and stronger than 5/6 year olds. It could result in some serious injuries.

I would love it if more places did do sessions aimed at older children. Locally at least there seems to be a gap between people offering general sessions for children with SEN - which are understandably dominated by younger children and sessions for adults with SEN. Ds is 14 so although generally placid I wouldn’t risk taking him to a session full of little ones (and he dislikes children!) but there isn’t anything sadly.

Sounds like the age range is too big, they should do sessions for older children but most places don't
Unfortunately it sounds like he's getting to old for the session . Lots of places have height restrictions and unfortunately by the time most dc are 11 it's no longer suitable for them to use

Just to play devil's advocate if I was the older child's parent and they banned them I would be rasing hell in terms of discrimination. It is a general sen session with no age range. They cannot say x child can come but y child can't especially if the behaviour is directly related to their disability.

If they now impose an age range I'd be asking what reasonable adjustments the venue could make in order for my child to attend and I'd be suggesting the existing sen session.

This doesn't mean I agree with the lack of supervision of the older child but as it Is an sen session your child should also be supervised. If as you say she was and you couldn't stop the incident from happening how would the older child's carer/parent be able to?

This makes my blood boil ! Your poor DD and that poor lad ! If he has people with him who are paid to look after him their failing in there job and he’s going to be deprived of an activity because they are to lazy to just do there job !! You must flag , and keep flagging till the people responsible for his care are looking after him properly. I hope your DD shakes the incident off and can go and enjoy herself x

@Baileyscream I appreciate what you’re saying, but if a 12/13 -year-old goes down the slide and lands on a small child, for example, they could seriously injure them. That’s the main reason why adults often aren’t allowed on equipment with children, we can literally kill them with our weight!

I don’t see what adjustments could be made to prevent such injuries unless older children have separate time on the equipment, I.e., a separate session.

The OP needs to raise this with the staff and they can get some heath and safety advice. It could affect the venue’s insurance as well if they’re not following guidance.

There is no age range which tbh is maybe the issue. Like others said - height and age limits exist for a reason.
that being said, as in my OP there are other older children there but they are normally supervised by two parents who are constantly managing behaviour. This child has zero management.
i was supervising my child - that’s why I stood at the bottom of the slide after following her the whole way round to make sure she climbs up the stairs ok. So my child was supervised. That’s why I was able to step in. My child has pulled another girls ponytail before but I was able to quickly step in and deal with it. This lads carers do NOT watch him in the slightest. That’s where the risk is. They should have been with him at the slide and getting him off it like they’ve been asked to several times when he just sits at the top. They should be ready to grab like how they did today after I yelled at them.

I was just going to suggest this.

Ah, I didn’t realize that other older children were also using the equipment.

Personally, I still think that the age/height restrictions angle should be considered. If any of the older children accidentally fall onto a smaller child, they could hurt them. It’s just not safe to have such a wide age range, imo.

I know you were supervising. I'm just trying to show a different side ad what may come.

As a parent of a now teenager with complex needs I've been in similar (my son isn't violent in anyway) situations. One was very similar in that it was an open age range sen session. The outcome was that the younger child if they wanted to could attend non sen sessions with a closed age range while the sen session remained open. Whether the older child's parent persue this is another issue.

Play centres do allow adults on equipment with their children to supervise them so the argument of weight is more an argument of the child not having the understanding of the situation and what could happen (this I'm guessing would be attributed to their disability).

I'd be careful how you treat as the situation could backfire. I'd be tempted to raise it as a safeguarding issue with the centre rather than ask for them to ban the child (of the parents/guardians have it in then they'll fight it in terms of discrimination). The centre should have a record of who attended. The LA could be notified.

I now there are spelling mistakes I'm juggling mentioned teenage child atm and I'm sure you can decipher.

I agree with suggesting sessions for older and younger children or asking the organisers to remind parents/caters about their responsibility to supervise. Regardless of needs children cannot be harming other children, so something needs to happen to prevent that. Separate age seems sensible given , regardless of intent, a larger excites child could hurt a smaller child.

Before acceding to any of your demands I would, as management, be demanding that your got off your derriere and supervised your violent child. It is discriminatory to allow one child to be the universal bully, whatever the disability.