To think DS might be dangerously obsessed with studying?

[pinotmore]

I am getting a little worried about this and wonder if I should do something about it and if so, what?

He is in Y12 doing 3 essay-based subjects and got excellent results last year for his GCSEs. He's always been very academically able but also very driven, competitive and hardworking. He has decided he wants to apply to Oxbridge and, imo, is becoming over-invested in this. He goes to a decent but unremarkable comp which sends 1 or 2 students each year and he's being egged on by teachers saying things like, 'If anyone will get in you will,' and 'you're the best candidate we've had for years.' I know they mean well, but I wish this would stop.

He has decided he needs to do 40 hours additional study each week on top of his taught lessons, and is aiming for that, which I think is far too much. He stays at school until 5ish then walks home and is on the sofa with an app on his phone that times him, making notes/writing essays/reading pretty much all evening. He is in the room with me and does seem to be able to multi-task and talk to me quite a bit (he's always been chatty) and takes lots of mini-breaks to listen to a song or talk etc. I go to bed at 10ish and he goes up at about 11.30, often waking me up talking aloud to himself about one of his topics. I feel he's getting himself hyped up and not winding down before bed, but he does seem to sleep ok and is up at 7ish (including weekends) and seems fine in the mornings.

He has a large group of friends - no particular close friend - and sees them at school and socially on a Friday. So last night he was out with them 6-12 but then no further social plans for the weekend, which is typical for him. When on study leave/in the summer he socialised a lot, so I do think this is partly down to the time of year. He doesn't do online socialising but is very interactive with me and, when ds2 is around, with him. We were all up by 9ish and been chatting/listening to music, but now he's got the laptop out and will be on it for most of the day.

What has prompted me to post is that he plays cricket for our local team and has done since being about 6. It can be a source of frustration to him with not batting/bowling much, but he does love being part of the team and usually gets the 'captain's award' at the end of the season for his great attitude/commitment/team-playing etc. But it's long days, sometimes both days of the weekend, with him feeling, I know, a bit disappointed with how it goes a lot of the time. Before anyone says it, he's well aware that fielding is crucial and he does a great job at that. I'm a lp with a stressful full-time job and I know nothing about cricket, so I haven't been able to support him in this, which makes me feel guilty. He has just told me that he doesn't want to do it this year and doesn't intend to play at all. He says it's because he doesn't have time, and I admit it is a hugely time-consuming sport and would eat into his study time, but part of me thinks this would be a good thing. Then I think, would it, if he's not even completely enjoying the cricket?

He doesn't have other hobbies as such, though he has loads of interests and, as I've said, isn't shut in his room all the time, but is indoors on his laptop. I don't really know what I'm asking - obviously I can't make him do cricket and I also can't really control how much he studies, but does it sound like I should worry?I'd love to hear others' perspectives.

I’d encourage practical life skills too - driving lessons, him cooking a night a week. A pt job at sixth form does them a world of good in terms of developing skills - managing time, speaking to people etc.

sounds fine to me, but then I also cared about the same things your son does, and then went on to Oxbridge..

1 hour independent for every hour taught is nothing when doing A Levels and on a reduced timetable (due to less subjects).

he absolutely should be reading around the subject, podcasts etc.

what you could do is try and get some variety in his week by occasionally finding an activity with him that complements his subject and provides a social 1-2-1 aspect. Eg museums, an historical film, etc.

Sounds like me at his age. It’s fantastic. Fwiw I was later diagnosed -ADHD - it’s not always disruptive it’s sometimes a super power. Hyperfocus “ lots of mini breaks, listening to music whilst he works (is it classical or heavy metal by any chance) like socialising but can’t do it too much because it’s draining!

My mum used to always try and get me to go out as and didn’t understand my studying, I still get wound up about it 30 years later. Support him - I 100% do!

Not read through the full threat but I’m guessing history, English and sociology/psychology/Philosophy?

He needs fresh air and exercise so I’d talk to him about how he’s going to get that consistently if he doesn’t play cricket this year. He needs to schedule in outdoor time for his own well-being.

He sounds fine.

hes at an age/stage where you can be intense about things. And have the energy/stamina to do it.

just support him. Maybe encourage him to take time each day for a walk/run, although he maybe getting exercise/fresh air on his daily commute.

We send a number of students to Oxbridge and as a teacher yourself you're well aware of the 1 hour taught = 1 hour independent study (our Oxbridge do more, of course, but not 40 hours!) I would be worried, as a previous poster says, that he's placing too much emphasis on his Oxbridge application. He may not get a place: how will he feel? Have you raised your concerns with the school?

Is he anxious or stressed with it? Or is he thriving and pushing?

There is a real positive element to being this focused and as others have said being relentlessly focused at A level isn't necessarily a bad thing for Yr 12 and 13. However I would be having a conversation with him about what will he do/feel if he doesn't get through and how will he ease off himself after the exams over the summer. It is really hard to go from 100mph on heavy work/stuff to nothing, so get him to focus on what happens over the school holidays, this summer and over the summer before he goes to university and plan for after that. And also tell him that university applications/interviews will be looking for students that manage to combine the academics with the outside stuff as well. It is competitive in Oxbridge but the students that stand out are the ones that have interesting stories to tell too.

The vast majority of successful people work really hard. But it does need a balance and he needs to look after himself.

Fair play to him though. I am properly impressed.

I was like that as a teen.

I loved the subjects I was studying and always had my nose in a book.

I did extra a levels at evening classes because I just wanted to know more, and they helped me understand the world.

I really don't think you should be trying to stop him.

I went to Cambridge and studied economics and while the workload is high for people who are interested in what they are studying it's just such an opportunity to immerse yourself in a subject.

Through my life I've continued learning and I still do this with new subjects. I have a maths degree as well now which I did for fun and I'm now learning Arabic, also for fun.

Some people are like this.

I have very little interest in drinking, socialising, and most sports.

This is the level he needs to be at for Oxbridge applications I think. The danger for me is, even then, it's still a numbers game so he might not get in and the disappointment can be crushing. Id focus on getting him enthusiastic about his second choice great university, taking him for visits etc so he can see that oxbridge isn't the be all and end all for clever people such as himself (it really isnt)

Have you spoken about what will happen if he doesn't get into Oxbridge? He's clearly going to get into a top university but he needs to be prepared for that not being Oxbridge and being ok with that.
He sounds amazing, though!

I am definitely trying to get him interested in other universities and we will do some open days of those he has said he'd like to go to. He does have a shortlist as he has done some research. I am very well aware that there are many other exceptional young people out there and I really don't want him to see himself as a failure if he doesn't get there.

Hi Op,
If your son opts out of cricket this year I wonder if he would consider doing something that is a much smaller commitment to take it's place. Is there a local Park Run? - That would blow the cobwebs off.

I'd be worried about burnout and being overly fixated on Oxbridge. He may get in but he may not. My DB got in and I didn't. I was absolutely gutted at the time. Make sure he visits other top unis. Find out which the best ones are in his subject area and get some visits in.

I agree with this and others saying the same. It’s good you’re encouraging him to look beyond Oxbridge as well.

A friend of mine who interviews at Oxford has said to me more than once that they know they say no to many candidates shortlisted for interview each year who would have done well and been very capable. This can be devastating for some who have focussed on Oxbridge, handed in good work, done well in the tests, got an interview and then waited for weeks only to be told no, especially as the other competitive universities may not have made offers at that point, so it can be very discombobulating. It’s important to develop some attractive alternatives.

My worry would be the lack of sport, getting into the habit of playing sport will help him deal with stress now and in later life…..does he play any sport now?

Would he get involved in park runs…..running could be very beneficial to him and may help him avoid burnout

I don't why you would even want to interfere

Just let him do his thing

I loathed all sport as a teenager, didn't do any. I didn't socialise much, never dated, saw my friends mostly at at school. Read voraciously, studied, did a bit of am dram and a couple of conservation volunteer holidays. Went to about three parties in two years. I was quite happy and normal. Everything changed once i hit the year after school, which was also normal.

Does he have a Saturday job or similar? That was a good thing for me and worth thinking about.

That doesn’t sound excessive to me. Also went to Oxford.

He seems to be highly ambitious and motivated.

The main question is, is he being "pushed"?

If he enjoys what he is doing and can manage it, let him be.

But if he is causing a lot of stress for the family and himself, then you need to have a serious discussion with him.

You can only reach the top this way, but there is always a high risk of breaking down on the way.

Actually a lot of universities do. My school used to get about 1/4 to 1/3 of the a-level students into oxbridge every year, and the one thing drummed into us from age 11 was "everyone who is applying will be predicted top grades - you need to be doing a variety of extra-curricular stuff to stand out".

You can burn out even if you enjoyed what you were doing. What he is doing sounds unhealthy and unsustainable.

Trouble is when you start down that path you don't feel like you're going to burn yourself out because it feels good - at the start. Especially at his age where they think they know everything.

He's just going to overload his brain. Mini breaks for a song are not rest breaks. 40 hours per week on top of school is far too much.

If he doesn't want to do cricket that's fine, but he needs to have days and evenings where he does things that aren't mentally taxing and aren't related to his studies. Otherwise he's just draining himself without any recovery or replenishment.

@TunnocksOrDeath I thought Oxbridge was more interested in the super curricular rather than the extra curricular? I have wondered if this is a recent emphasis due to widening access, given that the extra curricular may be less possible for some (don’t know).

@pinotmore I don’t know if you have come across this Oxford politics tutor from Jesus College Oxford? He does some great videos about the Oxbridge process. He has a very sensible approach and was himself rejected from Cambridge and went on to have a great time at Bristol University. He has various videos about what they’re looking for and myth busting etc.

I used to sit in on Admissions when I was an Oxford JRF in the early 2000s and I can assure you no one had the remotest interest in your hobbies. Which have zero impact on whether you’re very, very good at your subject and have the right kind of mind to benefit from the style of teaching Oxford.

He sounds very similar to my DS - now at Cambridge studying engineering. He loved his A level subjects and studying ..there was a presentation from a Cambridge admissions tutor at his school when he was in Y11 who said that they only care about your passion for the subject, and your supercurricular interests, not extra curricular ones (esp for STEM) and I think he took it to heart.

(He did see friends, swum and went to the gym but he spent most of his free time (happily) studying; which is what he does at C now - the workload and pressure is way more intense than A levels!!)

It sounds like my son at the same age who has gone on to have a very successful career and a happy marriage and normal life with friends and hobbies. He was always focussed and ambitious and at school studied like that because he knew that was the way to get him hopefully where he wanted to go.
He did exercise and have hobbies eg went to the gym, went cycling and had a girlfriend, but studying came first, he definitely wouldn't have spent a weekend playing cricket for example, he did sports that could be done for an hour not hours.
Some kind of exercise is important, even a walk for half an hour, just keep an eye on him and get him to talk about how he's feeling. If he's not much of a talker I used to find a car journey helpful as if you sit side by side you can talk without eye contact which can help teens say things they'd rather not look you in the eye and say.
A certain amount of feeling stressed is normal, it's what happens in university and will happen if he works in the type of job an intelligent and ambitious person is likely to choose, but make sure he's got the mental tools to deal with that. Sometimes I think these days people are led to believe that any amount of stress in life is wrong so they end up not being able to deal with it as a normal part of life.
He sounds like he is focussed, ambitious and intelligent, all traits which will enable him to go far in life.