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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

National Trust visit spoilt by overzealous staff or AIBU?

415 replies

Sunshineismyfavourite · 20/02/2024 21:16

Visited a beautiful NT country house today. Huge 17th century house with Capability Brown landscaped parkland. The house has lots of art by Van Dyck - one of my favourite artists and I was really looking forward to spending a couple of hours with DH wandering around in the beautiful spaces enjoying the peace and quiet. However, every time I stopped to look at a painting one of the staff would come up to me and start talking. This happened several times in every room we wandered into. I totally get the enthusiasm and expertise of the staff but I wasn't really interested in hearing about the Civil War etc., I just wanted to enjoy the paintings in peace. We do visit NT properties occasionally but have never found this to be a problem before.
The staff just seemed to be unable to read my body language as I was trying to walk away or indicate that I didn't want to talk or listen to them by not responding or engaging with them. Short of telling them to shut up it was impossible.
It was a very quiet day with not many visitors so they were probably bored but it was way too much for us.
AIBU by being a miserable bugger (I know I'm quite unsociable at times) or should I be allowed to wander round in peace? Perhaps they should give out 'don't talk to me' badges with the tickets if you want to be left in peace!

OP posts:
calicogoose · 21/02/2024 16:53

I was grateful for the intervention of a volunteer at a National Trust property in Oxfordshire. We saw a painting ( not at all good ) of an eighteenth century family connected with the property. I was touched to see a black child amongst the white children and thought they must be a family member or adopted into the family. I mentioned it to a volunteer and she explained the child represented slave plantations in the West Indies. I was shocked and asked why it was on display or why there was no clear explanation and warning to the symbolism in the horrible painting. The NT manager was so sneery about my concerns. It put me right off the National Trust.

MuseumAssistant · 21/02/2024 17:04

UniqueReader · 21/02/2024 00:25

No it's not a silly over reaction. Giving constructive criticism directly to the venue is absolutely reasonable if you are not happy with part of you experience but that was clearly not the type of comment I was objecting too...

Ok, when I said it was an overreaction, I was assuming your mother didn't fit the description of the sort of volunteers people are complaining about.

If you think she does, then yes, feeding back to the venue is the best thing to do.

They can't retrain volunteers if they don't realise there's a problem.

WhatnowMrs · 21/02/2024 17:13

Maybe they’re trying to covertly checking us out in case we’re Just Stop Oil protesters or some such about to launch an assault on something?

YouOKHun · 21/02/2024 17:20

@calicogoose If the NT had to put a trigger warning on everything with an iffy provenance they’d be in trouble. If they had to pack those things away there’d be nothing to see in certain houses (unfortunately).

Justpontificating · 21/02/2024 17:35

cookingwithabigail · 21/02/2024 15:47

Yes we did have an EH membership when the kids were younger. They're adults now. They used to buy the little wooden swords in the gift shop then charge around fighting everything 😂

You’ve brought back some fond memories there ! 😀

ICantbelieveitMeldrew · 21/02/2024 17:46

Best NT volunteer ever . We had a great conversation.

National Trust visit spoilt by overzealous staff or AIBU?
National Trust visit spoilt by overzealous staff or AIBU?
rainbegone · 21/02/2024 17:50

Wbeezer · 20/02/2024 21:21

I had this happen recently, I ended up leaving polite DH to listen while I scurried off. It's my job to read all the labels and then tell DH all the interesting facts I've discovered, if someone else does it it spoils my fun!

This is my job too! Grin

mydamnfootstuckinthedoor · 21/02/2024 17:56

"Ah yes indeed, I am an art historian and this particular artist is my specialist field ... "

BaroqueInterlude · 21/02/2024 17:59

mydamnfootstuckinthedoor · 21/02/2024 17:56

"Ah yes indeed, I am an art historian and this particular artist is my specialist field ... "

Fine if you are and he is, but you risk an awkward moment if you're lying and the guide enthusiastically asks you what your favourite works are from the artist's 'yellow period' 😁

fleurneige · 21/02/2024 18:20

I am 58 and have a passion for history, and I enjoy NT Houses so much, I intend to volunteer when the time comes. Or do you think retired people should go straight into a care home and stop living.

Yes, I do hope I would read people's reactions and know how to leave them alone. And would expect to politely tell me that they would rather be left to visit without expert information, rather than be passive aggressive or just unpleasant.

Justpontificating · 21/02/2024 18:51

fleurneige · 21/02/2024 18:20

I am 58 and have a passion for history, and I enjoy NT Houses so much, I intend to volunteer when the time comes. Or do you think retired people should go straight into a care home and stop living.

Yes, I do hope I would read people's reactions and know how to leave them alone. And would expect to politely tell me that they would rather be left to visit without expert information, rather than be passive aggressive or just unpleasant.

Some time ago a MN suggested a building and level of care, money available etc to something akin to a workhouse for the retired 😳🤯

Caffeineislife · 21/02/2024 19:38

It's obvious from this thread that there are a variety of thoughts on volunteers. As someone said up thread there are all sorts of ways to engage visitors.

However, there is an audience (quite a sizeable and vocal one at that) for what many on this thread find overbearing. Just after Covid many of our volunteers were shielding and nervous about coming back to volunteer (especially inside), so the room stewards/ guides were somewhat stripped back. The comment cards and emails were full of disappointment and wishes for the volunteers back. Whilst some of MN would rather not have the level of interaction there is a vocal group who love it. Certain bus tour groups love the interaction. Plenty of visitors also respond well to it and it is often fed back as hugely positive in the comment cards which is what management use to inform training and volunteer use.

On the idea of a badge scheme, I can assure you even if such a system was brought in some of the most overbearing will ignore it anyway.

No matter how much training we give, volunteers are unpaid and volunteer their time. We can train and guide but if they wish to ignore it, they will and there is little we can really do. No-one wants to say they cannot volunteer there anymore due to them been overbearing or a bit of a bore. I've been part of the training group when we acquired a military museum as part of our group. It had previously been independent and run entirely by volunteers (all old servicemen in the armed forces). The comment cards were not kind, our department was asked to investigate and help them with their tours. We first went to see what was going on. Well, tours were advertised as 40 minutes long and as an overview of certain exhibitions (aircraft, tank, a couple of notable service people related to the site, a couple of notable medals), the reality was... The shortest tour I went on for over an hour and had great detail about the engine, cockpit layout, paintwork, the preservation process and history of every aircraft. A massive tangent about some medals that were not on the advertised tour that took about 30 minutes and then saw me, looked at his watch and finished the tour. The longest tour I went on was nearly 3 hours. Again, huge detail about every aircraft, long winded tangents about everything. It became very grandpa Simpson for a time as we heard all about his war story. There was a couple of veterans in the tour group and a good hour was spend reminiscing together. Fantastic men who did incredible things for our country but tour guides they were not. I spoke to the tour groups afterwards, there were mixed reviews. The 2 veterans had a wonderful time and absolutely loved the tour. Several loved the stories. Some really loved the knowledge and the ability to answer every question. Others found it too long and a bore fest. We went daily for a month and the feedback was so mixed. The most vocal group absolutely loved it. The less vocal ones hated it and vowed never to come back. They were lovely men, who just really wanted to share their passion and tell their stories. No matter how much rejigging, guiding them and making suggestions we made, the tours were still nearly 3 hours long as it only took a question from the group or someone in the tour group to be a veteran and the tangents began.

Same was for when they were not guiding. They stood near exhibitions and were supposed to answer any questions and interact with visitors. Again, their passion and love for their subject took over, it was very much a pouncing situation. They just loved to share their stories and were very passionate that the history was not lost. No amount of some people just want to take it in/ let people come to you could deter them.

SarahAndQuack · 21/02/2024 19:48

BaroqueInterlude · 21/02/2024 17:59

Fine if you are and he is, but you risk an awkward moment if you're lying and the guide enthusiastically asks you what your favourite works are from the artist's 'yellow period' 😁

I will tell you it doesn't make a blind bit of difference anyway.

I'm a medievalist; I know quite a bit about history. Every now and again I have been irritated enough to say I'm a medievalist, or that I teach history. Almost invariably volunteers simply steam on with their explanation.

TuxedoCatsRule · 21/02/2024 19:59

I have been enjoying this thread and don’t know whether to side with Team OP or the poor enthusiastic-but-restrained volunteers or the jaded volunteer trainers!

A recent visit to a non NT house recently showcased the full gamut mentioned in the thread - the woman on the desk said in a voice laden with meaning that she had “lots of volunteers in today, at least one in every room!” First room there was a visitor being held prisoner by a keen volunteer so we enjoyed that room quietly. Next room we were pursued from end to end by a keen chap but it meant we couldn’t show each other anything interesting without him joining in or asking poor DS questions.

next room was a brilliant man who said “I can tell you stuff or I can leave you to browse” and we said “just browsing thanks!”

following room a woman who was also brilliant and said I just have to show you this one thing (very cool, we would not have seen it otherwise)

then a woman who knew absolutely nothing and kept saying that my husband would know because he was a man and finally a very young girl who loitered like a ghost and added atmosphere if nothing else. It was quite the range and I felt sorry for the volunteer manager really.

Herdinggoats · 21/02/2024 20:02

“next room was a brilliant man who said “I can tell you stuff or I can leave you to browse” and we said “just browsing thanks!” “

this man sounds absolutely perfect!

Sunshineismyfavourite · 21/02/2024 20:47

SabrinaThwaite · 21/02/2024 02:01

I’m thinking Petworth … I’ve been collared there by room guides and it can be a bugger to get away.

You guessed!

OP posts:
Sunshineismyfavourite · 21/02/2024 20:52

GoodOldEmmaNess · 21/02/2024 06:08

"Whining about it on here"? That's a very rude response to someone simply 'using their words' on MN to raise an issue that she thinks (rightly) that others may have experienced too.

I'm surprised at the number of posters who claim not to understand that it is socially difficult to interrupt a volunteer and indicate that you don't welcome their little talk.
Most people find it hard to say anything like "Sorry, but I'd rather enjoy the room in peace" and will spend a lot of time and mental energy giving a polite ear and sending micro-signals of wanting to be left alone before they can bring themselves to say something that could be heard as hurtful.
I'm sure that the OP would, like most of us, be able to use those words eventually, but her point is that it isn't just one or two socially inept (or poorly trained) volunteers that are pushing to that point, It is happening routinely, so that you find yourself pushed towards socially awkward brusqueness again and again.
Completely reasonable to find that a problem and to enquire about others' experiences. The thread indicates that the NT probably should be pitching their volunteer training differently.

Thank you for this!
It is this exactly.

OP posts:
Sunshineismyfavourite · 21/02/2024 20:55

Herdinggoats · 21/02/2024 06:31

Thing is I am quite capable of using my words, it doesn’t mean I don’t find it a pain in the arse to keep repeating myself every time I go into a new room

Thank you!
If I'd used my words (I bloody hate that phrase at the best of times!) I would have used them on repeat. Why should I have to do that? Read the room people!

OP posts:
SweetBirdsong · 21/02/2024 21:00

@fleurneige · Today 18:20

I am 58 and have a passion for history, and I enjoy NT Houses so much, I intend to volunteer when the time comes.

Or do you think retired people should go straight into a care home and stop living.

I am pretty sure nobody has actually said this. Confused

What a bizarre post! Has somebody suggested this to you or something? Sounds like you're projecting a bit.

Sunshineismyfavourite · 21/02/2024 21:02

RestlessMillennial · 21/02/2024 14:20

I completely identify with the OP in this. I also prefer to just take things in at my own pace, just admire things silently. My favourite aspects of NT properties are the decor and the peace of the grounds. There is plenty of information in the brochure or on the displays for me to read. Forced interaction stresses me out, if I want a guided tour I'll apply for one! My idea of actual heaven is a empty stately home! So I can pretend I'm in Bronte novel 😂I once went to a non- NT stately home on a weekday in the mid winter and it was totally empty except for me and my partner. There were no volunteers, only a grumpy man selling entry and there was no cafe or shop. It was incredible

An empty stately home! Now that would be the dream!

OP posts:
Mochudubh · 21/02/2024 21:08

I treasure a memory of outraging a steward at a historic building in the East Midlands. I mentioned the ongoing strong links with the site and Scotland. I think both David I and William the Lion had owned property in the area and the current family had Scottish roots. In addition the nearby town had a much later influx of Scots. She was horrified and demanded to know what I meant. I explained that I was studying David I and had been researching the links. She huffed and puffed and tried to deny that there was any relation to Scotland, I think she'd have chucked us out if she could.

I'm also reminded of the guide in (I think) Cragside who, on learning we were Scottish regaled us on how Anti- English Scottish people were to her student son. He was studying in Edinburgh, I can't imagine how much of a dick he must have been to encounter anti-English sentiment in Edinburgh of all places.

NoOrdinaryMorning · 21/02/2024 21:13

M67 · 20/02/2024 22:02

They will be volunteers, not staff.

Just use your words 'Thanks, that's really interesting. We're just going to have a look round by ourselves now. Bye.' They can't win. Some people want every single detail, some people want to be left alone and some people want them to be children's entertainers (and some want them to treat kids with adults) Just be direct and polite, they will deal with plenty of visitors so they won't mind.

Will you all give up with this new "use your words" patronising gibberish

NoOrdinaryMorning · 21/02/2024 21:15

UniqueReader · 20/02/2024 23:46

Think I'll tell my lovely mum who gives up her time to VOLUNTEER as a NT room guide not to bother given the comments on here. Clearly people don't appreciate it and just see the volunteers as 'old with nothing better to do'. I'll remind her to not speak to anyone unless shes spoken too in future. Another option is to make them all paid posts and triple your membership / entrance fee...

You are the only person who has said "old with nothing better to do"

Also, why on earth would you want to upset your own mother like that?

NoOrdinaryMorning · 21/02/2024 21:17

@Abeona Half term was two weeks ago!

AlannaOfTrebond · 21/02/2024 21:18

Sunshineismyfavourite · 21/02/2024 21:02

An empty stately home! Now that would be the dream!

One of my favourite things about volunteering for the NT was locking up at the end of the day. Sometimes there would only be a couple of us in the building and it was wonderful to walk through all the rooms alone in silence!

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