Even more cyclists now breaking the law

[DistingusedSocialCommentator]

Most drivers and pedestrians will be aware of this as many have seen or been victims of a cycle rider.

Watching Talktv this morning there was a lady who had lost her mother due to an e-scooter rider on the pavement. The show had a lawyer on talking about what I agree with, IE cyclists are very hard to identify if they get away from an accident.

E-scooters we all know are against the law unless provided for by your local council in central London. Several times over the years, me and the family have had close calls with them on pavements and parks as they zoom down, you cant hear them and they often dress in all black clothing.

Push bike riders are travelling faster and faster as many more have those battery packs on them

With the introduction of 20mph zones in vast areas of London, even more, push bike riders are now breaking the law, EG travelling well over 20mph in a 20mph and passing slower cars travelling at 20mph We are all aware how some push bike riders have ignored the rules for years, EG jump red lights, ignore pedestrians on crossings, cause accidents and walk of or rise off and now, much more able to break the speed limits off 20mph with almost 100% impunity and some that at red lights get o the pavement and cross a red light that way or some just ride on pavements

For the record, note, Its some cyclists not all but we have all seen them more so as going to work, or dropping off children at schools the speed of some of these riders

The Talktv debate also talked about those who kill people while riding a push bike/scooter, I think they said the maximum prison sentence was two years (I may be wrong) but the laws needed vast improvements.

This had been talked about a lot before but nothing happened.

AIBU proposes that all cyclists have number plates/easily identifiable markings, all have insurance, all have a bell and lights, and all wear a helmet and hi-vis jacket (This would in my judgment make many more riders more responsible for their actions and our roads/pavements safer for all)

The police need to be more proactive on e-scooter riders. However, as cyclists are almost impossible to identify, my proposal as above will aid the police and hopefully, modify the dangerous behaviours of those cyclists that are now regularly breaking the law, EG, travelling at more than the speed allowed, jumping red lights, putting pedestrians at risk on crossings and pavements.

Nope, it's not cycling if you need a battery to assist you, the point of cycling is that the human is the engine, you get there under your own steam.
Battery = cheating

All well and good if you live in a reletivley flat area of the country. If you live in the Pennines like me and can assure you most people who are not fit do not cycle or give up very fast because of the never ending hills.

You obvioulsly are oblivious to the fact it takes time to build up stamina and fitness, if you live on hills you are struggling from the get go. If you have never lives in areas like this and are not in peak fitness you would not know.

Possibly. But the economics would be against them very strongly.

If I could stop running a car because self-driving ones could be summoned up easily I’d do it straightaway. So much cheaper!

I don’t have a garage or a driveway, but the release of useful land generally would also be immense.

The interesting thing about self-driving cars is that those behind them - including Google - are themselves massive and have a lot of clout. It’s not a one-sided situation.

To an extent. It would reduce the number of parked cars, yes as the cars could be used for someone else instead of being parked up for 22 hours of the day. But would actually increase the number of cars driving on roads, as the driverless car almost certainly won't be outside your house or workplace when you want it (unlike your parked car), so will have to drive from where it is stored to come and get you, and then after your journey, drive to a suitable storage/parking facility to wait for the next job. So in theory, we'd need less "On street" parking and few car parks, but at the same time, we'd need new storage/parking/charging places where the cars go to wait and charge between jobs, thus more mileage!

It's what we already have with taxis, as likewise, they're seldom parked near where they're needed, so wait at ranks or taxi offices and then have to drive to where they're wanting, do the journey, then drive back to a waiting/parking point, i.e. rank or taxi office.

Another point is that most people need to travel at particular times of day, i.e. rush hour, school start/finish, etc., so you need a huge number driverless cars to be ready for the peaks, which will still be sat empty for most of the rest of the day, off peak, hours.

Not to mention, more demand from non drivers, i.e. those who don't currently have a driving licence nor car who'll suddenly find themselves able to hail a driverless car to get them out and about rather than waiting for buses or not taking the journey at all. That could add millions of journeys on the roads.

And of course, rainy days. All those people who normally walk or cycle to walk/school in good weather would suddenly want to be able to order a driverless car when it's torrential rain, so there'd need to be enough cars available to cope with demand.

I don't think it's the "cunning plan" to reduce congestion that some people think it will be.

Cyclists aren’t breaking the law by going over 20 mph because the limit does not apply to bicycles

It's only cheating if you're using it to gain an unfair advantage i.e. in a race. You can use whatever you want to go down the shops with a clear conscience.

Err?? Surely they'd just convert to manufacture self driving cars instead? Someone has to manufacture all the driverless cars that will be needed. It makes no sense to close down existing factories and make the staff redundant only to build new factories and recruit new staff elsewhere. IF, and it's a big IF, driverless cars ever became mainstream, most of the current car manufacturers would be involved in the design and manufacture.

Thank you for explaining 🤠👍
I gave up driving and car ownership about 15 years ago, I despair at the way that cars dominate the urban landscape, massive hulking things strewn everywhere. As a short person it's very difficult even crossing the road these days because I can't see over the bloody things.
I sincerely hope that the future you are describing comes to pass 🙏🏻

I drive and I cycle. My kids cycle. Alternative to cars are part of the solutions, not the problem.

Pavement: it is illegal for adults, usually tolerated for children as the roads are so unsafe. Re: adults riding on pavements: Sadly the policing is not funded by our government. Sadly again, roads are sometimes so unsafe for bikes. I don't condone riding on pavement but there needs to be a constructive approach.

Insurance: we are insured. We have special insurance but I believe most cyclists are insured (UK) via their home contents insurance.

Helmets: pro, but do be aware research has shown drivers drive closer to cyclists wearing helmets than those who don't (google is your friend). I still wear mind as I worry about impact of head of pavement most.

Number plates etc is I think more about pushing cycling out as more ££/complex as a more of transport.

Yes pavement cycling is bad. The solution may lay in good lanes for everyone, pedestrians, cyclists and cars (don't start me on potholes too).

My understanding is that the calculations show that relatively few cars can serve a lot of people. Zoning cars, coordinating and diverting them and having plenty of stop and charging areas (which would still be a tiny fraction of car parking now) could all be done.

It may be that total mileage wouldn’t go down, but it would be massively more miles per car. Which would be good.

They are a total menace in Glasgow, mostly Deliveroo/Just Eat riders. They are not cyclists although they have pedals. They are riding jailbroken e-bikes which are really motorbikes. On and off the pavement, no licence, no test, no lights, no insurance. Usually dressed all in black, snood up over their face.

You are totally correct ☝️😊
If anything the battery cyclists is are putting themselves at a disadvantage since they are not getting the full fitness benefits of cycling.

Not to mention, more demand from non drivers, i.e. those who don't currently have a driving licence nor car who'll suddenly find themselves able to hail a driverless car to get them out and about rather than waiting for buses or not taking the journey at all. That could add millions of journeys on the roads.

I don’t see why this is an issue at all. Those people would have walked or got the bus, wouldn’t they? If there was no more need for buses that would be a good thing, wouldn’t it?

I’ve never thought about the intricacies of ownership, but presumably there could be public service self-driving cars as well as commercial operations.

I assume you also don't have gears on your bike, that's cheating too

Innit, fixed track gear or nothing

it's funny that OP mentions cyclists and then launches on a rant about illegal motor vehicles

So do I.

It's amazing how much space vehicle drivers give them.

I think everyone just stares at them in awe.

@WhatsTheUseOfWorrying you make some thoughtful points, but ultimately a lot of those issues come down to personal convenience, which we could all adjust for a better solution.

I live semi rurally, and have happily taken a suitcase on and bus then train then aeroplane to go on holiday.

My elderly aunt and uncle in their 70s live in the middle of nowhere, and regularly use e-bikes to pop to the shops or see friends.

We have been conditioned to believe everyone owning a car is essential but it's not, it's convenient but wasteful.

As others have pointed out, with less individual car ownership we would see space for driverless services. I am imagining what it would look like with no cars parked on our road, it would be so open and free!

😱
Well I guess it could be argued 🤷🏼‍♀️
But surely the battery = cheating argument is stronger?

I’m the self-driving car advocate!

Until then, I do think we’re chasing phantoms by thinking we can reproduce the benefits of cars, without cars.

It’s also overlooked too much that cars have liberated the world. Women especially in many ways. Going back to the 19th century is not an attractive prospect.

(Though I do like Tesco, Ocada, Sainsbury’s etc deliveries as a modern update on the Edwardian shopkeeper’s van.)

We have been conditioned to believe everyone owning a car is essential but it's not, it's convenient but wasteful👏🏻

I am imagining what it would look like with no cars parked on our road, it would be so open and free!
Wouldn't it be great if all cars were identical little pods, not individually owned but part of a kind of public transport network.
That would put a stop to the monster trucks arms race.
Cyclists and pedestrians would be much safer without the massive metal monsters strewn all over the streets.

So having lost the argument on making Doctors have a no strike "agreement" imposed on them, you now turn your attention to cyclists, whilst at the same time confusing E-Scooters with Cyclists, two entirely different groups of "road user"

Are you bored?

Remind me again of how having compulsory insurance, MOT, Number plates and training, has prevented 2m motorists not bothering with insurance or reducing the number of hit n runs we get?

It hasn't.

Meanwhile 1800 people are killed each year on the roads by car drivers, including around 300 children.

How would you place a large number plate on a bicycle? on a childs bike? that wouldn't be a danger to either themselves or anyone involved in an accident?
you of course know why front number plates were made illegal for motorbikes don't you? probably not.

If we all did more walking more cycling and less driving we'd all be fitter, more healthy and place less strain on the NHS, which links to your other views.

Your ageism/disabilism is showing.

My elderly dad loves his e-bike because it means he can still get out with his cycle club and keep up with younger riders on normal bikes on the same routes he used to be able to do without assistance.

HTH.

My dad gets a bit irritated if I speak against electric bikes, how old was your dad when he switched to an electric bike?

If we all did more walking more cycling and less driving we'd all be fitter, more healthy and place less strain on the NHS👏🏻

So having lost the argument on making Doctors have a no strike "agreement" imposed on them,

Damn, I missed that. I won’t raise the subject here. But what a great one to debate.