Even more cyclists now breaking the law

[DistingusedSocialCommentator]

Most drivers and pedestrians will be aware of this as many have seen or been victims of a cycle rider.

Watching Talktv this morning there was a lady who had lost her mother due to an e-scooter rider on the pavement. The show had a lawyer on talking about what I agree with, IE cyclists are very hard to identify if they get away from an accident.

E-scooters we all know are against the law unless provided for by your local council in central London. Several times over the years, me and the family have had close calls with them on pavements and parks as they zoom down, you cant hear them and they often dress in all black clothing.

Push bike riders are travelling faster and faster as many more have those battery packs on them

With the introduction of 20mph zones in vast areas of London, even more, push bike riders are now breaking the law, EG travelling well over 20mph in a 20mph and passing slower cars travelling at 20mph We are all aware how some push bike riders have ignored the rules for years, EG jump red lights, ignore pedestrians on crossings, cause accidents and walk of or rise off and now, much more able to break the speed limits off 20mph with almost 100% impunity and some that at red lights get o the pavement and cross a red light that way or some just ride on pavements

For the record, note, Its some cyclists not all but we have all seen them more so as going to work, or dropping off children at schools the speed of some of these riders

The Talktv debate also talked about those who kill people while riding a push bike/scooter, I think they said the maximum prison sentence was two years (I may be wrong) but the laws needed vast improvements.

This had been talked about a lot before but nothing happened.

AIBU proposes that all cyclists have number plates/easily identifiable markings, all have insurance, all have a bell and lights, and all wear a helmet and hi-vis jacket (This would in my judgment make many more riders more responsible for their actions and our roads/pavements safer for all)

The police need to be more proactive on e-scooter riders. However, as cyclists are almost impossible to identify, my proposal as above will aid the police and hopefully, modify the dangerous behaviours of those cyclists that are now regularly breaking the law, EG, travelling at more than the speed allowed, jumping red lights, putting pedestrians at risk on crossings and pavements.

You obviously live somewhere quite flat!

There are so many good solutions to these issues, and none of them are reg plates for cyclists.

• a drastic reduction in the number of fossil fuel cars on the road, paired with a big increase in public transport expenditure (which could be paid for with an increase in tax on fossil fuel vehicles, and a huge decrease in cost of highways maintenance due to less cars)
• with less cars on the road and less congestion, cycle paths could in theory become redundant, and we could at the very least remove the blended cycle/pedestrian paths which cause confusion.
• e bikes and scooters should only be on the road, and cyclists ideally would not need pavements for safety with a big reduction in car traffic
• with an increase in cycling, some kind of beefed up cycling proficiency would be needed, which would provide a great reskilling opportunity for out of work driving instructors
• there would be a drastic reduction in road deaths associated with cars, and a drastic reduction in pollution in cities, leading to better health outcomes for all overall, and less pollution related health issues and deaths.
• as many will point out, special dispensation would be needed for disabled or working drivers, who could see a reduction in tax or incentives to switch to electric vehicles.

Have I missed anything?

Well there's this government data https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/reported-road-casualties-great-britain-road-user-risk-2021/reported-road-casualties-great-britain-road-user-risk-2021-data.

That summarises "The more vulnerable road users (motorcyclists, pedal cyclists and pedestrians) together accounted for half (50%) of fatalities and had the highest user casualty rates" and "Per passenger mile, HGVs had the highest rate of other road user fatalities, followed by motorcyclists, whereas pedal cyclists and pedestrians presented lower risks of fatality to other road users in collisions"

If you look at chart 5 it breaks it down Other road users killed by vehicle or road user in collision (where known) per billion passenger miles, Great Britain 2021
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When I was a keen young and fit cyclist I could just about hit 20mph on my road bike on the flat, although I could not maintain that. So you are dead wrong if you think (unassisted) cyclists are regularly cruising past you at over 20mph.

It's pretty hilly where I live, and going up here is the best bit 😄

Why only reduce fossil powered cars - why not reduce them all - otherwise you're just shifting the problem surely. Not sure why the concentration on fossil fuels?

So it's HGVs and Motorcycles that cause more deaths per mile!

Cars and Pedal Cycles are actually pretty close in terms of deaths per mile.

So it's not car drivers who are the problem really, is it, whereas lots of posters on this thread are blaming car drivers! Pedal cyclists are almost as bad as car drivers. But it's HGVs and motor cyclists who are the biggest cause of deaths.

The only good thing about electric bikes is that my ordinary bike is less likely to be stolen because the battery bikes are quite expensive and possibly noe more popular than proper bikes.
But seriously I can't imagine why anyone needs a battery on a bike🤷🏼‍♀️
Cycling is such a low intensity activity (unless you're going uphill) that your heart rate is barely above that of a brisk walk.

These proposals for insurance, registration etc all break down as soon as you consider little Annabelle on her fairy cycle, young Lee on his BMX at the skatepark, Josh doing wheelies in the car park, retired Marjory puffing to the local library. And who would police it all? ANPR for bikes flagging that it’s supposedly a red mountain bike registered to Dave, but it looks more like an orange dirt bike ridden by Sarah? Cue a police chase!

I was in Richmond once having a nice peaceful morning walking to my office and some idiot shouted at me to move . They shouldn’t have been cycling on the pavement at all so at the least they could have said excuse me politely. I was so taken aback can’t remember if I said something back at the time.

All fair points.

But the difficulty with banishing large numbers of cars is that cycling can’t fill the gap. I can’t cycle home from the supermarket with six bags of shopping (and a delivery would need a lorry). I can’t take my parents out on a bicycle. I can’t put suitcases on a bicycle. I can’t take rubbish to the dump on a bicycle. I can’t pick up mine and others’ children on a bicycle. And so on.

And there is of course a natural physical restriction for many of us: lots of people aren’t young and fit enough to cycle.

Plus, it rains a lot in the UK!

Public transport has a built in limitation. It can never be adequate or economic everywhere.

Environmentally, self-driving (and therefore very safe) electric cars would be the best answer.

Saltandpepper, yeah it's crazy out there, I was once crossing the road at a zebra crossing when a car drove into me, putting me in hospital. We could swap anecdotes all day

I live in a very hilly city. With an ebike I can happily get to work without being a sweaty mess. I wouldn't do the same trip on a non-ebike.

I can also much further on an ebike than I would on a normal bike.

I'm not a small woman, I would simply have to get off and push my bike up the kind of hills we have.

My bike needs to be pedalled to go, even with battery assist, so it's not like I'm cruising along. I have it on the lowest setting most of the time but whack it up on the steepest hills.

Ebikes enable people to cycle who aren't at peak fitness, are really good for older people who might struggle with hills, allow people to go further etc. Surely anything that takes cars off the road is a good thing?

What's the use, you could get your shopping delivered thereby eliminating that car trip. Car sharing is the answer, why does everyone need their own car that is mostly parked doing nothing

They’re both bad and wrong. One doesn’t cancel out the other.

More ebikes, so more people can cycle

That’s why self-driving cars - that aren’t owned by individuals - would be so fantastic. Just a few could serve an area and unclog the roads massively. You’d call them up by app.

If they were electric, all the better.

There a fantastic book about this, Autonomy.

I get what you're saying but to be pedantic -

shopping - cargo bike or trailer could carry a week's worth of shopping. But supermarkets are built for cars, a less car-centric society would probably involve shopping for smaller amounts more regularly and more locally

elderly parents - in a cycle-friendly society they could be cycling too, and would have done so all their lives and maintained fitness and flexibility by doing it, or could enjoy using a tricycle on footpaths

rubbish to dump - again a cargo bike or trailer could do some, or you could call the council to collect large items (or find someone to take them on where appropriate)

youth and fitness - cycling keeps you fit. Active transport helps people stay fit. Part of the problem now is that to cycle you need to have your wits about you and be able to deal with cycling in traffic. Segregated cycle paths are much better for less confident cyclists

rain - countries like Denmark, Sweden, Germany etc have lots of rainfall and higher rates of cycling. You just invest in decent waterproofs.

these threads always come round to the same conclusion - cyclists sharing space with pedestrians and motor traffic is not good. The thing is, some people then conclude cyclists should be eradicated from the roads, others think space should be taken from cars to make safer cycle routes.

I see old people cycling round my area

You obviously dont live in a hilly remote area like most parts of the Peak district, Pennines and much of Yorkshire, Lancashire.

Life is dam hard without out a car, narrow country lanes and entitled lycra clad cyclists is not a good combination. Even my DH who drives his tractor pulls over as soon as he is able and lets cars past if there is a que behind him. Cyclists not a chance.

Good for them.

99% of the cyclists I see are young. On a weekend it’s virtually all men in Lycra cycling in packs.

Ebikes enable people to cycle who aren't at peak fitness
Well they're not cycling if they're using a battery are they and how are they going to get to peak fitness if they rely on a battery?
You have to tolerate a bit of discomfort and put in some effort if you want your cardiovascular system to be in good condition!
I'm approaching 60 and my mind is blown that people far younger than me need a battery on their bicycle.

We have an electric cargo bike for transporting children and could easily fit a big food shop in it, too.

Also have a regular cargo bike with just one child seat for dropping/collecting child at preschool on way to/from work.

With the extra weight of children and other stuff, and the distances required to get to work, electric assist definitely makes cycling more appealing and it means we don't arrive at work a sweaty mess.

Ive cycled much more since getting the e bikes. They are the future!

You clearly don't understand how e bikes work.
Yes it's still cycling, you still propel the pedals with your feet.
It's called electric assist because the electric motor makes it easier, it doesn't do all the work.

I agree but the vast profits of the car manufacturers would plummet, they will fight tooth and nail, lobby as hard as they can to stop this from happening.