To ask what makes you middle class?

[Wantobeareader]

I am not from the UK so not very familiar with these class definitions (which personally I cannot stand) but I am curious to understand what people mean with MC. I thought it was a term referred to the fairly wealthy but apparently lots of people and incomes seem to fall into that categories.
So, how would you define Middle Class? Feel free to type a description of a typical MC person you can think of :)

Student living doesn’t count.

It’s your opinion that you don’t jump the class system. It’s others’ opinion that you do. And by the BBC questionnaire, you would.

Who says, who makes these silly rules.

Easy to spot on MN, find them on the Baby Names forum. All those getting extremely anxious and uptight about the class connotations (according to them) of UK naming practices.

Hinterland

All of those but not yet home owner (currently looking) but I’m working class. I’d say I class it on my upbringing and I came from a working class labour voting family. My income / interests may be more aligned to middle class now but I’d never consider myself middle class.

Because no student is living their best nutritional life. Doesn’t mean they won’t be bemoaning the 17 ingredients in the Ottolenghi recipe book 15 years later.

Sorry it was a bit tongue in cheek as whenever a shoes on/off thread comes up on MN someone always brings class into it, so I thought I'd flip it and bring shoes into a class thread 😬

Voting Labour doesn’t make you working class - particularly post Blair. Mondeo man was definitely working class as is the Red Wall the Tories won (and will shortly lose)

There are clearly two definitions at play in Britain. Most economists and nowadays politicians will simply group it according to salary. Eg, household income of 50k+ might put you in a middle class grouping of some sort.

But traditionally and culturally, class is defined by the area you grew up in / parents job. This is because for many centuries Britain had virtually zero social mobility, so it wasn’t necessary to ask someone’s salary to determine their social position - you could just look at their clothes and listen to their how they spoke/accent.

And of course even today - again because Britain is still a relatively class conscious society with poorish social mobility compared to its napeughbiirs (though a 100 times better than say WW1), many people who grew up in a strongly working class area with strongly working class parents (both emoloyed in tiring/mundane manual jobs) will never consider themselves middle class, even as they make their millions. Because their formative cultural experiences and family life were so profoundly different to that of others in the country who were better off.

This is I guess however becoming slightly less apparent with each passing decade though, as social mobility very (very) slowly increases and the financial differences between manual work and a typical office job shrink or are now even going into reverse in many cases.

@CatamaranViper

@pokebowls
Does an apprenticeship class as advanced education? I'm assuming you will say no. But then how does a plumber earning £90k fit your description. Answer. It doesn't. Your description is outdated and big linger works.

"my" descriptions were taken from the dictionary. Hth.

No not really as you didn't answer the questions. Try again please

You probably need to ask that question of the OED.

Oh so now being middle class is about nutrition. People on here are saying it’s about what your parents are and the lifestyle you experience growing up.

I despair 😔

It’s clearly very opinion based.

You're missing the point. I shared a dictionary definition. I can't answer on behalf of a dictionary I'm afraid. It's the definition of the words as defined by the dictionary.

You think eating beans and ramen noodles out of packets is nutritionally complete? Or were you just trying to be clever with your little gotcha?

Exactly it reminds me of all the z listers “celebrities” who have delusions of grandeur.

Ill bet most are upper working class/lower middle class and only one divorce or redundancy away from being on hard times.

Mumsnet is a right hoot.

Class is about how you grew up. That’s what imbues you with the taste and behaviours you have as an adult. This is why we can all see David Beckham and Rod Stewart are working class. Their kids however will not be!

These threads always attract an influx of posters saying “well I ride to hounds, read The Sun, am a famous sculptor, smoke fags and live in a Ford Escort, so what does that make me then????!!!” Well, apart from self obsessed, nobody knows or cares. We are individuals, no one is a cipher. But if we met you, then yes, we could tell your class. It’s not something that you can write down! It’s just something we can tell from meeting you.

How is beautiful a class identifier?

“Rough as toast, swears like a trooper, vulgar and dirty” would make that person... What class?

I am not from here either but for me it would have to be not only what they have/do, but what they don't do:

1. Well educated (min degree educated)
2. Good salary
3. Live below their means, in my opinion, MC people won't have a flashy car and house but counting the days to payday, for example.
4. Invest on their kids future (either via private education or setting up a trust)

5.Does not have to wait around for retirement age to retire. 6.Good mannered, gracious and grateful, can get along with people from different circles. 7.Charitable 8.Do not have a flashy lifestyle, do not keep up with the Joneses.

1. Can hold an intelligent conversation but do not fancy themselves "intellectuals"

10. Does not gossip

I have no idea why the format on my list went crazy when posted 🤣

So what makes you working class?

Retirement is a good proxy for class. If you are still working and have to in your 60s then the comfort of middle class life has passed you by

Well it’s obviously not nutritious is it.

All I’m saying is these rules on what constitutes as middle class seem to contradict each other. People’s opinions on mumsnet on the matter seem very subjective rather than objective.

I would definitely believe that most conversations in the UK are coded conversations about class!

They're not codes, we all know the rules. And we're just more open about it than other countries. For example, I watched 'Legally Blond' last night with my DDs, the snobbery at Harvard about Elle was all class and old money vs new money. But I doubt you'd find a single American who would admit that.