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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think controlling partners don't always realise...

75 replies

Confused1012024 · 18/02/2024 01:04

Name change for this one.

Do you think that partners who are controlling do so internationally, or do they just genuinely belive that their way is the only right way of doing things and if you do it differently you are wrong/stupid?

Their withdrawal of affection isn't an intentional punishment, just a natural consequence of not doing things how they like it done.

I'm sure we all have things that annoy us that our partners do but at what point does the want to get them to do it right/ their way become controlling?

I hope that makes sense, I'm a bit confused at the moment...

OP posts:
STARCATCHER22 · 18/02/2024 01:09

What exactly is it that you are confused about?

Whether someone punishes you intentionally with silent treatment/withdrawing affection or gives you the silent treatment “as a natural consequence of not doing things how they like it done” to me feels like the same thing. I am a grown adult in a relationship with a grown adult. I don’t expect to be ever be given the silent treatment/have affection withdrawn because I’ve done something they don’t like. It’s immature at best.

If I’m honest, your post reads a bit like you’re the controlling one and you are trying to justify your behaviour.

MississippiAF · 18/02/2024 01:09

Are you the controller?

Lollypop701 · 18/02/2024 01:20

I do not have the right to tell my partner how to dress, how to act, who they choose as friends , how to feel about anything . I don’t have to agree with their choices. But I need to respect they are valid.

I don’t get to manipulate them by sulking, ignoring, verbally abusing or physically abusing them because they don’t agree with me. Ever

Express my opinion, Arguing because we differ, discussing how we each feel is fine. If the differences are too much and we can’t find a path I can leave.

that’s it

fabio12 · 18/02/2024 01:33

I think they soon recognise how angry they get if you don't do what they want, so yes, I suspect they know perfectly well.

ThisGoldHedgehog · 18/02/2024 01:33

I don’t think it matters. Either way, it’s toxic abusive behaviour and shouldn’t be tolerated.

What are you confused about?

Mumtime2 · 18/02/2024 01:40

Google Manipulation or ask those around you what they see or think.
Gut feeling.
Always being told No you are wrong.
It's a breath of fresh air to walk away from this behaviour.
It maybe also the way your partner is taking the treatment of control, anger then becomes very negative towards you.
The abuser might be oblivious if they have certain personality types.

BoohooWoohoo · 18/02/2024 01:47

Many controlling people are able to be more restrained with people outside their primary relationship. For example the abuser who is seen as a pillar of the community because they are helpful and kind to everyone else.

SleepPrettyDarling · 18/02/2024 01:52

If they are self-aware enough to behave differently around other people, they are entirely in control of how they behave to intimate partners. They just don’t want you to know that. They may call it loyalty, or ‘I expected better from you’, but it is absolutely a choice.

echt · 18/02/2024 02:21

Their motivation might be their fucked-up childhood or the phase of the moon but the beginning and end of it is how they that behave that matters, that's what needs to change, no matter what its cause.

The change might be the controlled one moving out of course.

WandaWonder · 18/02/2024 02:26

Well either partner can be controlling but they are well aware what they doing, sure they not choose to believe it or justify it 'I do it because I care' or however they want to dress it up

But they know

xxxjanxxx · 18/02/2024 02:47

Controversially, I think that controllers aren't always aware that they are controlling. They're behaving the way that they have learned to behave in order to survive - which is most probably through what they have lived through and learned in childhood.

Having said that, it's not a reason to excuse such behaviour and they should be made aware that their behaviour isn't acceptable - how will they ever know if it's not pointed out to them??

WellWhaddayaKnow · 18/02/2024 02:58

SleepPrettyDarling · 18/02/2024 01:52

If they are self-aware enough to behave differently around other people, they are entirely in control of how they behave to intimate partners. They just don’t want you to know that. They may call it loyalty, or ‘I expected better from you’, but it is absolutely a choice.

I think intimate relationships throw up entirely different emotions and dynamics for people tbf.

That’s not to condone bad behaviour. It’s a not ok to be controlling or abusive.

peanutbutterkid · 18/02/2024 04:54

A lot of controlling people don't realise they are super intolerant. They just think the other person is hopeless so needs controlling in order to not do everything wrong. A lot of MN posters come across as exactly this kind of controlling person about their partners. "Men are so useless that's why I have to do everything and always tell him he did it wrong & cajole him to do it MY WAY instead" is a common refrain here. Or "This is my cleaning & household management routine and beware the person in my household who doesn't conform with it"

Right down to petty shit like "AIBU to resent the feck out of my partner for leaving drawers open!?" threads.

Shoxfordian · 18/02/2024 06:17

Why are you confused? It doesn't matter why someone is controlling to you, they're still being abusive

WandaWonder · 18/02/2024 06:32

peanutbutterkid · 18/02/2024 04:54

A lot of controlling people don't realise they are super intolerant. They just think the other person is hopeless so needs controlling in order to not do everything wrong. A lot of MN posters come across as exactly this kind of controlling person about their partners. "Men are so useless that's why I have to do everything and always tell him he did it wrong & cajole him to do it MY WAY instead" is a common refrain here. Or "This is my cleaning & household management routine and beware the person in my household who doesn't conform with it"

Right down to petty shit like "AIBU to resent the feck out of my partner for leaving drawers open!?" threads.

Yes exactly, women do it and 'it's being organised micromanaging, I have anxiety if it is not done my way, I care'

A man does it 'you need to get out now he is controlling you there are so many red flags'

Confused1012024 · 18/02/2024 08:47

STARCATCHER22 · 18/02/2024 01:09

What exactly is it that you are confused about?

Whether someone punishes you intentionally with silent treatment/withdrawing affection or gives you the silent treatment “as a natural consequence of not doing things how they like it done” to me feels like the same thing. I am a grown adult in a relationship with a grown adult. I don’t expect to be ever be given the silent treatment/have affection withdrawn because I’ve done something they don’t like. It’s immature at best.

If I’m honest, your post reads a bit like you’re the controlling one and you are trying to justify your behaviour.

No it's not me. I was trying to get an unbiased opinion and understand another perspective.

My confusion is to whether my partners behaviour is controlling intentionally which is not acceptable or just personality, which is still difficult to deal with sometimes but not malicious.

I've said to him that I feel he is controlling sometimes and he totally denied it and said he can't help how he feels and it would be fake of him to act totally normal and be affectionate if he is annoyed at me. It just seems to happen quite a lot.

OP posts:
Confused1012024 · 18/02/2024 08:49

peanutbutterkid · 18/02/2024 04:54

A lot of controlling people don't realise they are super intolerant. They just think the other person is hopeless so needs controlling in order to not do everything wrong. A lot of MN posters come across as exactly this kind of controlling person about their partners. "Men are so useless that's why I have to do everything and always tell him he did it wrong & cajole him to do it MY WAY instead" is a common refrain here. Or "This is my cleaning & household management routine and beware the person in my household who doesn't conform with it"

Right down to petty shit like "AIBU to resent the feck out of my partner for leaving drawers open!?" threads.

I think this is what I am trying to establish. Is it control or just intolerance to things being done a different way and genuinely believing there isn't another way.

OP posts:
MississippiAF · 18/02/2024 08:52

My ex was very controlling. I finally left him after 10+ years on the third attempt. Everyone was delighted.

He has absolutely no understanding that he was controlling. He thinks he’s normal, but then his parents were the same.

It isn’t an excuse; people should be able to look around and take feedback.

Herdinggoats · 18/02/2024 08:55

He’s denied being controlling. Controlling people never admit it. If he is behaving in a particular way expecting you to change your what you are doing then it is controlling.

BertieBotts · 18/02/2024 09:09

There is actually some good research on abuse, (which includes controlling behaviour) and the root of it is that the abuser, whether we are talking a romantic relationship or an employer or a parent or a child, believes themselves to be entitled to servitude from the victim.

A good analogy is this. A great many people have pet dogs. They love their dog and care for it. They take it to the vet to keep it healthy. They provide it with food, shelter, exercise and companionship.

They might think "I'm a good dog owner, I would never hit my dog!" "I can't stand those awful dog owners who leave their dogs outsode overnight." They consider the dog a member of their family. They choose the food that the dog prefers, they buy a bed that it finds comfortable. They DO, genuinely, love their dog.

But at the same time, it's a dog. When they have visitors who don't like dogs, they shut it in another room so that it doesn't bother them. When they go on holiday, they might put it into kennels or with a family member. When it has to stay overnight at the vets, it stays in a small cage. When they go out for a restaurant meal, the dog gets its own ordinary kibble or tinned food. They expect it to obey commands. They keep it on a lead in public places. There are certain foods and rooms in the house which are off-limits. They do all of these things and they are still a good dog owner. These decisions are totally appropriate because a dog is not a human.

The abusive/controlling person thinks much the same way about their romantic partner. They love them, they appreciate them, they take good care of them - so they think. (I'll switch to he for abuser, she for victim now because they is too confusing)

But if the victim starts to get out of line, it's totally appropriate to pull her back into line somehow. That might be subtle like letting her know that she has upset him, or hurt his feelings. Subtle manipulation to get her to feel she has to "make it up" to him. If she is demanding too much then she has to be brought back down to her proper place. She is not really an equal. She is beneath him, her role is to adore and serve him and she can only expect certain things from him. When she starts to expect too much, he needs to let her know.

The abuser might not be consciously aware that he is placing her in this role. Indeed, in male violence/control towards women it is generally a kind of unconscious view about how all men and all women relate, with women being on a lesser rung - they often have a hierarchical view of how men relate to each other, too, with more physically domineering, or otherwise powerful men higher on the ladder, but women are right at the bottom with lesser men. It just seems so obvious and innate to them that they probably wouldn't articulate it - but you'll notice little signs like they never look to women for their opinion/don't take their opinion seriously on serious matters. Jokes that play down women's intelligence. In his mind it's "just the way things are" and movements like feminism are unfair because this is women wanting to climb the power ladder without the proper merit. They will sometimes respect certain women who do play to the rules of what they see as the male power game, but the majority are down there at the bottom, and women (especially "their" woman) refusing to play to the rules of that game and accept their position are being uppity and entitled.

In fact, it is the abuser who is entitled. It is very difficult to change this because in order to change this they have to overhaul their entire view of how society works and how people interact and it is not a comfortable thing to give up their relatively high position on that ladder. Abusers who do perpetrator programmes to learn how to be not-abusive commonly have the question "But if I'm not allowed to hit my wife, how do I get her to do what I want?" They do not fundamentally grasp that they do not have that right - that their wife has the right to choose what she wants to do. That a partnership is about communication but each person equally in control.

So in terms of whether they know what they are doing and choose it - yes and no. They are choosing it in the way that you would choose to correct an unwanted behaviour from your dog (or your child, though we recognise a child is learning). They are not consciously choosing what they see as their rightful position in the relationship. But for me once I understood this I could not be in the relationship any more, because I understood that I was not an equal in his eyes and would never be. He was seeing something totally different to what I was seeing and we would never be on the same page.

JollyJanuary · 18/02/2024 09:15

Are you asking if your being controlled unintentionally (okay) or being controlled intentionally (not okay)? Either way the outcome is that you're being controlled which is unacceptable whatever the reason.

baileybrosbuildingandloan · 18/02/2024 09:15

They know.

Comtesse · 18/02/2024 09:21

I don’t think it really matters if it’s on purpose or not, it’s still awful.

If I stand on your toe it doesn’t really matter if it was deliberate or an accident - it’s painful either way.

Allfur · 18/02/2024 09:21

It's not always black and white - is someone controlling if they want their partner to do their share of child care, not go out drinking every night etc. Anyone putting any kind of restrictions on another's behaviour can be seen as controlling

Ithinkitstimeforbed · 18/02/2024 09:26

I don’t know if people genuinely know. A friend I met through work wouldn’t let her boyfriend go to the gym because of other women, when they went on holiday it had to be to a villa because she didn’t want him looking at other women in bikinis. He was only allowed boys nights out but had to text her throughout the night regularly, she checked his phone sporadically to make sure he wasn’t texting people he shouldn’t etc. We were friendly at the time and another friend and I told her that if it was the other way round and her bf was saying this to her, we’d be telling her it’s a red flag. She said she’s just so anxious, she didn’t mean it maliciously but it’s a way to control her anxiety and if he loves her he’ll respect that. She knew it was a way of managing of her anxiety but was so upset we said she was controlling. She couldn’t see it was inappropriate. We lost touch when I left the job but 5 years later they’re still together and I do wonder how he is.

that IMO is different to be intolerance. Everyone does things their own way which may differ to a partner’s, but there’s compromise in a relationship.

What type of behaviour are you trying to establish? Is it like, no you can’t go out with X? Or like no you cleaned/cooked etc. something wrong?