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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

NRP should pay for costs of contact, during contact - AIBU?

38 replies

PurpleSaucepan · 05/02/2024 16:52

2 parents - no longer together
Kids live with mum, and occasionally see dad, when dad wants to - usually in school holidays.

Mum has more money generally than dad. Not massively more, but enough to get by. Mum does not claim maintenance and pays for everything for dc. Dad occasionally gives money for specific things, like school trips. Mum does not ask for this but accepts when it is offered.

When dad does see dc he usually asks mum for money for travel, food or activities while dc are with him.

Mum does not believe that she should have to contribute to his costs while he has the children. Every time he mucks her about, saying if she doesn't give money he can't have dc after all (having told the dc about the plans and they have got excited about it). He usually ends up taking them anyway, but not until he has got mum thoroughly upset, often for weeks beforehand.

WIBU to tell mum to just not engage, say he can have dc on dates requested but she's not contributing and then not discussing it any more?

He guilt trips her, says he can't afford food and heating when dc aren't there because of the costs of having them. Says he's so generous because he contributes to some things here and there and so she should pay for xyz. Kids tell him mum has bought for eg. a new household item, and dad then says she can afford all these luxuries so she should pay xyz.

I expect it's obvious by now, but they split due to abuse - all sorts including financial.

OP posts:
InAnotherLifetimeMaybe · 05/02/2024 16:56

I'd say keep well out of it!

CatOnAMushroom · 05/02/2024 16:58

Mum should claim maintenance. Dad's costs are his responsibility

DocOck · 05/02/2024 17:00

Mum needs to claim maintenance through CSA, and no she does not need to be paying any costs on Dad's contact time. Also get a proper contact order in place, he doesn't get to pick and choose when he sees the kids!

Original poster
PurpleSaucepan · 05/02/2024 17:02

They have a contact order but dad doesn't stick to it. Can't make him have them if he won't.

I won't keep out of it because sure it's a very close friend, thanks. Are friends not allowed to ask and take advice from each other?

OP posts:
Windydaysandwetnights · 05/02/2024 17:03

Wow what a df... My mate once had to collect her dd from school as she wasn't well. Ex came and offered to have her at his house as me and mate were supposed to be going shopping... He stood loitering in the hallway.... Until mate gave him a tin of soup from her cupboard for his dd's lunch. If I hadn't had prem ds with me we would have stayed in with her dd...

Bluenotgreen · 05/02/2024 17:05

He is a very cheeky fucker.

My main concern is why is she depriving her children of the money their father should be paying on a regular basis? Can she go through CMS?

DocOck · 05/02/2024 17:06

They have a contact order but dad doesn't stick to it. Can't make him have them if he won't.

That's the whole point of a court order, you can. Otherwise he's in breach and could be fined etc.

Sausagesinthesky · 05/02/2024 17:07

Claim maintenance for goodness sake!

Original poster
PurpleSaucepan · 05/02/2024 17:14

You can't enforce a court order to make a parent see their dc when they don't want to. That's not how it works. She has been told this by solicitors while they were going through the court process - the aim was to get a settled schedule that he would stick to and not mess her around, she was warned that if it didn't work there was no redress on the parent not seeing them / only one a parent withholding them.

OP posts:
Sprogonthetyne · 05/02/2024 17:15

Depending on their age could she not tell the kids that they might be seeing dad until just before, so no excitement and no potential for disappointment. Tell him a time/date that they will be available, make it clear there will be no financial incentive andleave it up to him if he shows up or not.

Stressfordays · 05/02/2024 17:17

It's his loss if he doesn't see the kids. She should claim maintenance and just not tell the kids when contact will happen as it causes disappointment. As long as the kids are available for contact time, that's her part done. She shouldn't be giving him money!

Lonecatwithkitten · 05/02/2024 17:18

DocOck · 05/02/2024 17:06

They have a contact order but dad doesn't stick to it. Can't make him have them if he won't.

That's the whole point of a court order, you can. Otherwise he's in breach and could be fined etc.

Sadly this is not the case. Court orders force RP to make the children available they do not force the NRP to take the children.

DocOck · 05/02/2024 17:18

No, that's true but if they're not abiding by the court order, you can go back to court and have the contact removed.

DocOck · 05/02/2024 17:19

Sorry yes @Lonecatwithkitten I've just acknowledged that - but you can go back and ask for the contact order to be changed because he's not sticking to it.

Unexpectedlysinglemum · 05/02/2024 17:22

She needs to be very clear that she won't pay for activities when he has them and he needs to plan activities he can afford.

She also needs to claim with CMA - even if she is too proud to get 'help' herself (which she shouldn't be - this extra cash could go into a babysitter or spa day fund for her, or on dates to meet a better man!) she could stick all the payments into a savings account for her children's future.

Cherrysoup · 05/02/2024 17:25

Another person asking why she doesn’t claim maintenance?

donquixotedelamancha · 05/02/2024 17:31

YABU:

  1. You should claim child support. It is your kids money, not yours. Put it in a bank account for when they are older.
  1. Stop entertaining this shit. Just ignore every request for money. If he is upsetting the kids give him a clear ultimatum and stop contact if he doesn't behave. There is no moral right to see your kids if you are a cunt to them. Put their needs first- he won't go to court.
Original poster
PurpleSaucepan · 05/02/2024 17:32

She did claim maintenance and he never paid it, they never followed it up when she repeatedly reported it, he gave her such a hard time over it and told he he could afford to see dc if she claimed it so she stopped.

He speaks to dc on phone (older ones have own phones), so she can't stop him telling them he will see them and do xyz, before telling her he won't unless she pays towards it.

OP posts:
Atethehalloweenchocs · 05/02/2024 19:09

No, of course she should not be paying. I would only communicate by text and only factual about dates, pick up and drop off times. Nothing else. Ever.

Herdinggoats · 05/02/2024 19:14

If the older ones are old enough to have phones then they are old enough to understand that dad doesn’t contribute financially at all towards them and whilst mum is happy to pay for everything herself she absolutely can’t be sending him money for days out that she would rather have with them.

pikkumyy77 · 05/02/2024 19:18

PurpleSaucepan · 05/02/2024 17:32

She did claim maintenance and he never paid it, they never followed it up when she repeatedly reported it, he gave her such a hard time over it and told he he could afford to see dc if she claimed it so she stopped.

He speaks to dc on phone (older ones have own phones), so she can't stop him telling them he will see them and do xyz, before telling her he won't unless she pays towards it.

Well he is a liar? I mean I think that should be obvious. She should keep filing and claiming maintenance and if he defaults on contact she should accept that he is teaching the children a valuable life lesson which is always to take people at their deeds, not their words.

arethereanyleftatall · 05/02/2024 19:20

He is utter utter scum.

Trying to control her still through abuse of her and their dc.

Utter scum.

I wouldn't be doing ANYTHING to help that fucker out. My kids would be better off not having a relationship as abusive as that, so I would be doing nothing to facilitate the meets.

Of course he should be paying everything when he's with them. Of course he should be paying child maintenance. Sometimes, I really wish arseholes like this could be given forced vasectomies. I know they can't.

BloodyAdultDC · 05/02/2024 19:22

DocOck · 05/02/2024 17:06

They have a contact order but dad doesn't stick to it. Can't make him have them if he won't.

That's the whole point of a court order, you can. Otherwise he's in breach and could be fined etc.

No court in the land can force a parent to have contact with a child. Who the fuck would enforce a reluctant adult supervising a child?

OP your friend needs to apply for CMS and disengage from all other contacts unless it's directly involving the dc.

It's a huge step to take (I've been there) but that first step will have a big effect on the 'power' of the relationship.

Original poster
PurpleSaucepan · 05/02/2024 19:33

He doesn't work, so cms is only £1 a day. Tbf, he probably does pay more than that during the year at random points, so she feels like it's not worth the headache of claiming and pissing him off.

I think he's still in her head to some extent, it's sad. I think it's part of the power thing - he wants to be in control, so when she claimed he wouldn't pay anything, but since she stopped claiming, he will give money - but only when he feels like it. He will make her life a misery in the weeks running up to a contact, demanding money and saying he can't afford to see the dc, she is so much better off than him etc etc, and then he'll give her some cash in front of the dc. It's all some kind of twisted power game, but the dc get drawn in (not by her) and they get very upset.

She feels like maybe she should just pay him what he asks when he sees them, to avoid the aggro, but I reckon she should stop communicating about money at all.

OP posts:
arethereanyleftatall · 05/02/2024 19:44

I think she's fallen in to the line of thinking that kids need a relationship with their father at whatever the cost is to their mother. That doesn't apply when the father is an abusive bully. They're better off without him.