Not sharing reasonable adjustment paperwork

[Raffleyourdoughnut]

TL;DR new colleagues wants copies of my personal paperwork so she can use it to get her own reasonable adjustments despite not having an medical issues or disabilities. I have not given anything to her. Apparently I have let her (and all womanhood) down.

I work full time and have a variety of medical conditions. I have had reasonable adjustments in place for over 15 years. These adjustments have always included the flexibility to work from home.

Pre covid we worked 5 days a week in a council office 15-20 minutes. The office we now work in is at least a 30 minutes drive away. Due to roadworks and traffic it has often taken up to 1hour 15 minutes to get home at times. Early last year we initially started back working in the office 1 day a week. Currently we are to work in office 2 set days a week. In a few months time we will be working 3 set days a week in office.

My current reasonable adjustment agreement limits my number of days in office to a maximum of one. This was both suggested by and agreed to by senior management. Whilst I have never publicly announced the specifics of my reasonable adjustments, its something people may well be aware of.

A woman from another LA planning team has joined my team and I have been training them up on how we process planning applications. She has recently been asking about why I am only coming into the office 1 day a week and I must have said like it was due to my reasonable adjustment. Last week during a teams call she asked me some questions about how to get a reasonable adjustment without actually having any medical issues or a disability and specifically asked for a copy of my personal paperwork including my completed application form, doctors letters, any other evidence etc so she can model her application on mine. I said no. I would not be giving her anything. However I did suggest she speaks with management about applying for one and I sent her the link to the council policy guidance on reasonable adjustments.

I had expected that to be the end of the matter however today during our virtual service meeting she asked for my personal information again. This time I was more annoyed with her asking, given it was in front of everyone (there was about 25 people on the call) so I again said no and I told to her that, this was the second time she had asked and my answer won't change. One of other women on the call ( who is not in my direct team) butted in that we should be helping others especially those with less experience. I agreed we should but I'm not giving my personal medication information away to someone I just met. One of our managers on the call stepped in and told first colleague to set up a call time so they can speak to her privately about it.

Since this meeting I've had 4 other women (who are not in my specific team) call or message me via teams to say I was unreasonable to say no to her request and to essentially tell her off in front of everyone especially the 2 managers on the call. Apparently everyone thinks the same especially as women should always be helping other women, no matter what.

I've been too busy today to have a chance to speak to my actual teammates about what happened. I don't think I was unreasonable but it would be good to get other opinions. Should I speak with management about my conversation with colleagues last week?

What the hell is wrong with these people? Your medical conditions are nobody's business. You owe this woman nothing! Stick to your guns.

I only met her a few weeks ago so haven't had a full read on her yet. The reason I asked is, I really don't like the women who came to me about me not helping other women.

Either she is not understanding what goes into a RA application, when I asked whether she has a disability her response was, she had children.... Or it's another backdoor 'are you really disabled ? You don't look it' thing. I've had plenty of those over the past 20 year of working. Interesting it's usually women that make them.

Since my post I've emailed both managers (we have a weird setup at the moment with two managers covering our team) outlining who said what to whom just encase.

@turkeymuffin unfortunately I work with quite a few people including those messaged and called me who think 'The Disabled' are either brave courageous wee lambs that look disabled and that cannot possibly contribute to society or are folk that are at it so we/they can get all 'The Benefits' that the 'Real People' pay for.

Just to reiterate what others have already said.

YANBU.

Your private medical information is just that - private. You are under no obligation to share it and frankly given her attitude I would be skeptical that if you did she wouldn't share it with others to "help" them.

As to those who've expressed that you should have helped, well they too are out of order. I wonder how they would feel about out sharing their personal information?

The person suggesting you should help other women no matter what (and the person asking believing being a mother was qualification enough) very much smacks of the attitudes of those who hog the disabled parking bays/bus seats/toilets because they have absolutely no care or understanding about the impact of disability and how it impacts peoples whole lives. They only see the "perks" and this is especially true when a disability is less visibly apparent.

I work with someone in a similar situation who's faced similar comments in the part (not in our current workplace which is really supportive). It's really, really shitty. Some people have no concept that she (and you) would trade their "perks" in a heartbeat for their disability to be cured/improved,

You've done the right thing in emailing your manager.

This person and those who've messaged you need to be spoken to by management and HR.

Pressuring you to release this information is harassment and due to the motivation it's discriminatory.

If you don't get a good response from mgt raise it to HR.

The good news is you work for an LA if you are in planning and they tend to be pretty good on taking a firm line against discrimination.

Sorry this happened to you but please don't feel bad.

Refusing to help someone "forge/fudge"
an RA application is the right thing to do (and arguably if you did would make you liable for a disciplinary for knowingly assisting a fraudulent application).

To add to the excellent post by BreadInCaptivity, in your shoes I'd talk to ACAS and your union rep.

I’m so sorry, OP. You’re doing the right thing. I have an invisible disability and I’m so sick to death of other people acting as if I’m taking the piss when they find out about it (and it’s very rare they find out about it as it’s unlikely to ever impact them!) because ‘you don’t look disabled’ or ‘you’re too smart to be disabled.’

You would think we are in the dark ages sometimes, not 2024.

Im glad you messaged your managerop. Sadly just because they're women doesn't mean they possess empathy, kindness or understanding. Some do, some don't. You were just landed with what sounds like an ignorant fool.

I would actually raise a complaint against her for requesting personal information and continuing to harass you about it in front of other people. Cheeky bitch.

Flipping heck. I work in a planning team and we generally work 2/3 days in the office but some much less if at all. This has come about when they have (undisclosed) adjustments and have worked as planners for the LPA for donkeys years and don’t need to get the feel for the local process and nuances. All agreed privately. No sharing of personal information, and quite right too!

New starters work at least 2 if not 3 days a week from the office until they’re up to speed, and generally beyond (like most of us who don’t need adjustments).

Much more sensible for training and learning.

anyway - you are absolutely under no obligation whatsoever to disclose your private information to them to assist in coming up with a case. Each case is personal and it’s up to them to make their case to management.

Yes say this OP because this is harassment. I can’t believe they think it’s acceptable to intervene and gang up on you like this. I wonder if they’ve been talking about you and decided to join forces to pressure you? They must know this is wrong, I struggle to believe they could be so clueless.

If she wants you to help her fill in a RA application she could’ve just asked that, after you declined to show her yours the first time - but she has no need to keep demanding to see yours and your supporting information.

And given her attitude and her motivation behind it ie. Making a bogus claim - I wouldn’t even suggest you help her fill hers in.

They all need a warning to drop this immediately.

Just seen this update - If her “disability” is she has children, I suspect she may be getting confused with making a Flexible working request which everyone is entitled to make.

Or it is, as you suggest, a way of them to “verify “your disability and perhaps the others are in on it too which is why they intervened. Perhaps they even put her up to it if you’re saying you already dislike them .

That’s good you’ve emailed your manager though. It needs to be documented.

YANBU. But I do wonder if at least the other woman if not this weird woman have confused flexible working and reasonable adjustments requests. As generally flexible working you write an argument for how you will cover it and that it won't be a detriment to the business. Like other people have said with reasonable adjustments or will be specific to your adjustments and needs. It's totally bizarre either way and I'd definitely be making it formal

YAANBU!

I have reasonable adjustments in place, and have told my manager off for discussing specifics with people who didn't need to know. The thought of sharing my PRIVATE AND PERSONAL vulnerable medical information with colleagues who do not need to know horrifies me!

Yanbu

What they all said ^

Horrendous behaviour on the part of this woman and some of you colleagues

I would be raising it with management

as to those that have contacted you I would go back to them and ask them if they would be happy if you asked them to provide all copies of their medical history, and if so could they give you permission so you can approach their doctors

bet they change their mind

Tell anyone questioning you that you will consider releasing your personal medical information once they do. They can post their private info on the notice board at work.

Outrageous that you should be pressured into sharing personal information.

Of course you could photocopy it, redact the shit out of it with a big black pen so it basically only says 'and' 'the' and ' of' , copy again and give her that.....

I agree that you are the precise opposite of unreasonable!

Definitely make a formal complaint to your manager and try to see if you can speak to them, face to face, as well. The woman is outrageous. As everyone has pointed out, your medical history is none of your damned business.

She sounds as though she could be trying a scam.

Two ways I would deal with this type of issue.

"This is not the topic of the meeting but happy to pick up offline"

"We have discussed already this and you have my answer, things will not change raised in a different forum. Shall we get back to the agenda?"

Just an update. I spoke with my managers today and they are not happy with both me being asked for my paperwork and with the other women's teams messages. I had sent them screenshots of the teams messages.

They have spoken to colleague and apparently she didn't know what a RA was, that it relate to disabilities, despite her having years of LA employment. My managers advised that she won't be raising anything to do with this with me again ever.

I thought that was the end of it however I got an email from colleague saying she was sorry I made myself upset 🤔and she didn't expect me to speak to management about it. Apparently she didn't know what she was asking for was an issue especially 'as I don't look disabled' and that she didn't think I was disabled as I work because 'disabled people don't work' 🙄

This email has been forwarded to management and HR.

😳😳😳😳😳😳

My mind is boggling at how someone can be so ignorant!!

Way to double down. Well done for sending those emails on. Someone is going to find themselves in disability awareness training pronto.

It was a shitty non apology, too.

Glad you sent the latest email
on some people really are unpleasant

Wow. Good for you for forwarding it. I can’t believe how ignorant this woman is! (Only I can, sadly.)