New manager want me in the office. I wfh-help!

[Stressedgiraffe]

We've changed management structure so my new manager wants me in the office. Ideally once a week but might settle for every month.
I've been there over 2 years. I wfh permanently but my contract says HQ.
I live 5 hours away always have done. They knew where I lived when I started. I go into the office about every 3/4 months for a few days .
Could I push for a change in location in my contract or do you think I'm screwed?

Have you missed the updates about the job being advertised as remote, and OP having email trails when she started confirming she'd only be in a few times a year?

The only thing either party had done wrong until this point was the inaccurate contract. The employer shouldn't have presented OP with a contract that didn't accurately describe how they'd advertised the role and wanted it to be conducted, and OP shouldn't have signed it. But there was a fair bit of that around a couple of years ago, with the pandemic leaving everything in the air.

The anti-employee sentiment on Mumsnet always surprises and depresses me.

Disagree with you entirely.

Most contracts contain more than a single sentence about location, including remote contracta, and they have additional clauses about travel, even if only expenses. I have actually never seen a contract categorically state that an employee will NEVER be asked to travel to a non home location for any husiness purpose. I'm not sure why an employer would choose to write that. Has anyone ever seen that written, out of interest?

What times are those? The times where people think that their child care needs to be catered to by employers when they sign a contract for a company on the other side of the country?

People that are banging on about her contract spectacularly miss the point.

If the job was advertised as completely wfh and that was communicated to her by her managers, this is what counts.

It doesn't matter if they haven't bothered to update the wording in the standard contract.

As another poster explained on this thread, sometimes companies don't update the wording to "wfh" in their contracts, because they would have to pay more insurance.

@roses321

Op hasn't mentioned childcare as an issue so you're just making things up now.

Ditto - i've managed a large team across 3 countries and I am pretty cool with people working at home in my team now - it should be allowed.

That isn't the argument though is it? The argument is the fact that they business is asking for her to go in. As are many businesses because simply put home working isn't good for everyone in every scenario.

@surreygirl1987 ”I can’t work from home so no one should be able to work from home”.

What incredibly strange logic!

This is like me complaining to say I dream of a job where the clients typically clear off home at 3.30pm, and are completely absent for 12 weeks of the year (when I mostly don't have to be in the office at all).
You've chosen a career that means you have to be in work in person.
The OP doesn't have that sort of job; their job can obviously be done perfectly well from home (as they've been doing it for two years).
You could change career if you'd like to WFH. No one's forcing you to be a teacher - just as I could change career to be a teacher if I wanted 12 weeks each year without "clients".
Seeing as you don't work from home and work in a career that doesn't lend itself to working from home it's quite strange that you're commenting on this so much.
All of this is quite aside from the contractual issue at hand: whether OP can renegotiate, whether they can be made to come in, and the effect of custom and practice on office attendance.

This is crazy. My husband is military 22 years so far. His job means there are only 3 locations he can work from. All are 7 hours minimum from us. He has to pay for his own travel, food and accommodation.

Sounds like the employment contract needs to be rectified to reflect what you were offered by way of employment terms

Their definition of ‘occasionally in the office’ could be twice a week tbh. I think you’ve got yourself into a difficult position here.

What does that have to do with OPs employment situation?

Talk to HR about getting your contract changed to 100% WFH

If that doesn't work, talk to ACAS

If that's no good, talk to an employment lawyer

Ignore people saying it's on you/you should go into the office - there's no demonstrable business need.

Seeing as you don't work from home and work in a career that doesn't lend itself to working from home it's quite strange that you're commenting on this so much.

People can get very odd about remote working, whilst completely ignoring other beneficial aspects of people's terms and conditions like pensions, wages and holidays. Hence there are posters doing the poor me routine with reference to jobs that have some benefits that are way better than others get. Public sector pensions, for example. Total lack of self-awareness.

And it's not like hybrid jobs are exactly thin on the ground at the moment. Anyone who desperately wants to work remotely, particularly if they've already shown enough ability to do ok in one career, could very likely get a hybrid/wfh role if they wanted it.

But the job applied for was remote and she has worked remotely for 2 years. How is that entitled?

Me too. Especially when lack of flexibility and long commutes often disadvantages women the most - especially when they have children or caring responsibilities.

“Mothers, not exclusively, but in particular, may have already gained a great deal from this shift. Some economists have suggested remote work factored into the all time high in labour force participation among women of prime working age. The jump for mothers of young children has been particularly high, and among those who have a bachelor’s degree, it’s even higher.”

Article NY Times link:

https://archive.ph/1kVHD

Honestly I think work from home is not going to be the future in the way people thought it would. Quite a few people I know are looking to move on in their careers at the moment and everywhere wants new employees in the office most of the time. In a few years spending most days in the office will be normal again, I know lots of people don't like to hear that but its just the truth. The CEO's i.e. your bosses just don't like wfm culture.

Hard disagree.

A lot of companies can offer smaller wages, save on office space and are happy to not be paying overheads in the office (hence hot desking). Even big movers like Meta (Facebook) and banks have given up London office space.

I think, if you've had this arrangement for a long time then it's implied that this is how you work. I'd get advice on this as I don't think they can make you come in if you've always worked from home, even though your contract says HQ.

@IdleAnimations Not what I am seeing across a range of business sizes, I think people need to start being realistic about this when looking for jobs and planning their futures, where to live and so on. Lots of companies are giving up office space and losing staff as AI becomes a workable alternative so a wfh opportunity might not be a great as it seems two or three years down the line. There will always be some wfh oppertunities but it won't be the norm or possible for most people and people can easily delude themselves on the reality of a situation if its what they really want and they should be careful of that.

Surely a few days every 3-4 months is the same as one day per month? Why does it have to be spaced out?

We shall agree to disagree. AI and machine learning are more likely to replace the in office jobs than they are going to replace the hybrid workers who predominantly work in specialisms that need human interaction and logic. Most people I know work in multi nationals and are working with people across the globe from wherever, not having a chat with Dave at the kettle then returning to their assigned desk.

A small number of current senior workers already in their niche who stubbornly remain at home may well be ok and able to stay at home however they impoverish the workforce of the future by doing so. But as long as they are ok that is all that matters to them I suppose.