Do you think labour will actually implement 20% vat on school fees?

[labpit]

We have two in Year 7 and year 10 and I am not sure what we will do if this happens. It is a certainty do you think?

To the vast majority of private school customers it IS peanuts!!

I’d see what the surveys come back with.

If private schools were not fussed about potential leavers they would not fork out for affordability surveys

I wouldn’t go with mn confidence over that.

Most private school parents already pay handsomely into the system for those in the state system to be educated.

I think no one will be happy until every high earner flees Britain's amidst this nonsense

And as businesses they will do what’s necessary to ensure their offering remains viable. The school we used had a drama teacher. A music teacher. A dance teacher. Multiple specialist sports teachers. They could easily cut staffing costs if needed. They have expanded the site massively so they could stop doing that and reduce their reserves. They could hire out the gym , pool, halls, theatre to locals. They could have a sliding scale of fees based on income. They will adapt if people can’t pay to ensure they remain viable.

We ALL pay into the tax system for services that benefit us ALL. Check your privilege whilst I fetch my very very tiny violin.

And smaller schools may not manage and will close. That’s useful

You sound as if a bit extra won’t hurt so feel free to put it in the system.

It’s always easy to offer up other people’s money. As we see on mn frequently.

Why? If you think private educational establishments should have to pay VAT why not them all?

I think you are looking at it wrong. We are a high earning childless couple, we pay taxes like anyone else and don’t see that we are paying for other people’s children to get an education.

We pay taxes over our own lifetime to cover the services we receive, we just happen to have pay and receive unevenly. We didn’t pay anything for the first 22 years of our lives even though we used up tax payer funds quite a lot then through our state educations, and later on we probably will use the NHS more than we have in the past because we are older but again we will pay less tax then.

Even if I thought the way you do, 90% of people in the UK do not go to private school, do you really want 90% of the population to go uneducated? Do you think this will not effect you?

@Trappedandunhappy

You seem to not understand economics or what the position of the UK actually is.

Higher earners are already paying marginal rates in excess of 50%

Do you not understand the effect of this on eeconomicand financial decisions?

You seem to be under the bizarre impression that VAT on fees is happening in a vaccum. It isnt.
When you have high marginal taxes and high prices (inflation) there is literally no more money to spare.

Whacking someone with one or two kids in private school with an additional £2.5-£5k net per year means it becomes unaffordable for them. They will take both kids out.

And its not just them either.

Its the people with part scholarships and bursaries for private school. They get hit with higher fees (so likely cannot affors it) AND loss of bursaries (first things to go).

Your inability to understand these basic issues is shocking. You are wanting to make people poorer, and the country less educated

And thats when we are right back to "Banana Republic" territory.

What a ridiculous post. “Less educated “ 88% of schools in this country are Good or Outstanding. State educated kids perform better at uni than privately educated kids. There will be more money put into state education which 90% of children already use.

@OddSock5

If this thread is anything to go by it has revealed that State Educated folks have abysmally bad levels of economic understanding.

I am not even surprised at this point. The UK has become full of people who cannot function in society without being heavily subsidised by the hard work of others.

As one poster said: thats why higher earners are leaving and are planning to leave.

And without them, you will get a lot poorer while public services will keep deteriorating.

Ofsted gradings mean nothing. Outstanding just means they have ticked the right boxes, it doesn't equate to outstanding behaviour or facilities or resources..
"There will be more money put into education" care to elaborate on what that is above and beyond the VAT policy, or is that what you are hoping will happen?

I’m not an economist but have some knowledge of trickle down economics and that it doesn’t work if you are trying to address social inequality (which is in everyone’s interest).

I have used private education and know many that do.

I also see inequality daily in my work.

I also understand that we don’t adequately tax wealth (as opposed to income) and I understand that there are extremely complex factors that currently mean it’s extremely hard for those born into poverty to lift themselves out of it.

I am educated to PhD level so please don’t patronise me.

Private schools charging VAT will not make people poorer or the country less educated on the whole. One or two people might have to (shock horror and how awful for them) send their kids to a state school. That’s all that will happen. People and private schools will adapt. It will make zero difference to the vast majority of people.

Our local “good” primary had a lot less than half reaching the expected level of maths and English last year. That’s not my idea of a “decent” school. Perhaps that’s part of the issue. As a country, we set our aspirations for our children too low.

You are incredibly patronising. Get off your high horse.

Nope, not a chance. They think it's going to buy them a few votes due to the politics of envy, that's all. If they get into power, it'll just get kicked into the long grass and then forgotten.

Slightly off topic but do you have the research for State educated kids perform better at uni than privately educated kids ?

There were lots of headlines saying this a few years ago but actually it was a data error in the HEFCE report the headlines were based on and they had transposed the private and state figures. In fact the private school students were more likely to get a good degree but the corrected report was put out quite quietly and a lot of the original articles (written on the erroneous figures) are still available:
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/university-funding-body-admits-disturbing-blunder-over-state-vs-privateeducated-pupils-degree-performance-a6718561.html

My recollection is that the data shows that for students who don't get high A-level results, state students will outperform private students with the same grades. e.g. if you get CCC from a private you will be less likely to get a good degree than CCC from a state. That's not really surprising as if you can't get good grades from private then (all else being equal) you're probably not going to thrive at Uni. The differences weren't there for the high achieving students.

I haven't seen a stark private vs state research paper since and I thought HEFCE was now more focused on finer grained analysis on postcodes etc. Would be v. interested in seeing more recent reports if you have them. Would be especially interesting for more recent reports as the data in the report in the link is a decade old and there has been a growing funding disparity since so a relative improvement in state achivement would be impressive.

@Trappedandunhappy

I’m not an economist but have some knowledge of trickle down economics and that it doesn’t work if you are trying to address social inequality (which is in everyone’s interest).

Social inequality is only in "everyone's interest" if it means standards increase - unfortunately, the socialist politics and envy means everyone will be equal but at a lower standard, which benefits no one.

Yes and they should!

Well on that basis, we ALL benefit from private education, which also turns out individuals who contribute to society.

We ALL benefit from a society where people are well educated

Precisely. So why are we trying to harm schools which are, more often than not, doing a great job at educating children? We should be encouraging them.

BouncingJAS · Today 19:12

I think you’re the one with an abysmal level of economic understanding if you really think a tiny percentage of the 5.9% of privately educated children having to leave their private schools will plunge the UK into economic ruin.😂

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXP8gH0wddE&embeds_referring_euri=https%3A%2F%2Fwhatsapp.com%2F&embeds_referring_origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwhatsapp.com&source_ve_path=MjM4NTE&feature=emb_title

This explains why it’s so hard for those who are born into lower income families will struggle to get themselves out of it. Very accessible even for us stupid state educated imbeciles.

And no we don’t benefit from private education at all. Quite the reverse. It causes huge inequalities.

A survey is the cheapest PR tactic in the book.

“Less educated “ 88% of schools in this country are Good or Outstanding. State educated kids perform better at uni than privately educated kids.

And yet posts like this and others say little advantage