AIBU to sue the NHS for medical negligence in which my Dad died.

[Fedupofdiets]

My beloved Dad died last year from multi-organ failure due to sepsis and DKA (diabetic ketoacidosis) in an NHS hospital. We had take him to hospital with a deteriorating foot wound secondary to his diabetes and staff failed to spot the signs of sepsis and also failed to do a blood test and discharged him home despite a high blood sugar reading and known cardiac issues. He was readmitted 2 day later as he deteriorated and died from multi organ failure. I raised a complaint which then turned into an investigation from which I had the report in November. I have only recently been able to bring myself to read it - they admit that had had they treated him on the first admission there is a chance his death could have been avoided (the report is very long and very technical but I am a HCP so understand what happened).

I have contacted a Solicitor and given the info they have said that there is evidence that would support a claim of litigation against the trust. I am however in two minds whether to pursue it, on one hand I don't want to add to my pain (I will be the driving force behind the claim my siblings do not know although my Mother fully supports it). The other part of me wants my Fathers name on their lips - he was in his 60s and did not deserve to die alone without his family due to their negligence. My Mother is also working FT in a minimum wage care job (70 this year) and hell yes any money would be great for her.

So my question is WWYD leave it be or pursue a claim?

Suing feels like getting justice as it hits the Trust where it hurts, an investigation and an apology doesn't it is just bullshit

I'm very sorry you lost your dad, Fedupofdiets, and know where you're coming from here. My own late FIL was killed by a glaring medication error, and though they admitted this and apologised profusely at the time, come the inquest they lied about having apologised at all and claimed the records were lost

I think what would swing it for me is that you're a trained nurse and still couldn't get anyone to listen to you - and that being the case, what chance would the rest of us stand?

It's true that it's ring fenced and comes out of their insurance, but ultimately the amount of people who sue increases the insurance premiums, which still comes out of the public purse.

I would do it. Honestly I don't think anything will change if people don't start to kick up a huge fuss when something like this happens. What happened here was unacceptable and someone lost their life as a result. In what other context would court not be considered appropriate. Everyone suing the nhs, making as much noise about poor care as possible, and insisting on better care is the only thing that will initiate the requires changes in the NHS.

Does that mean you are a lawyer acting fir the GMC? Or defending Drs eg MDU?

Do it. The NHS is currently funded by people who only see spreadsheets, profit and loss, not people. This seems to be the only way to get through to them.

That was for Utterbar

It does sound awful treatment
Nhs 100% need to give AB more easily. They have protocols they dont follow for sepsis.

The drs and nurses just dont seem to rush.

If uk tested for bacterial tonsilitis and chest infections etc we would be giving AB quixker to those that need them
It feels like drs have to guess?

I mean you would think someone having to have an amputation would need antibiotics.

My dc had double ear infections with high fevers and one was ill for weeks and crying etc. Gp couldnt see the drum refused AB ended up in hospital. They couldnt see. Diff gp saw infection and a new heart murmur.
Imo i now have health anxiety as couldnt get treatment from gp. After multiple visits.

Also while in labour my temp spiked (maybe gbs?) And hours into this they finally decided to give iv AB. I was likely dehydrated and they couldnt get a vein.
Luckily i gave birth and me and baby got AB for days.

in terms of suing though that -for me- would depend on the diabetes T1 or T2?
And was his uncontrolled sugars caused by weight and diet etc.

I think my thoughts are because my mu had a heart attack at 55 from smoking heavily for decades. Her heart attack (and previous probable clues to it going to happen) were missed by nhs. I think she was in there at the time.
If she had died yes it would have been nhs fault as aspirin and simple op.
But fundamentally she would have died so younv because she wouldnt quit.
She survived and did quit.

Not only would I sue the hospital, I'd add each attending, including GP, as individual defendants. So often people with genuine medical need are dismissed. It's not a mistake not to follow basic process. It's negligence. GPs over there sound like a right nightmare. Someone needs to hold them accountable for their lack of treatment.

As you said, people only pay attention when money is involved. So go after the money and hope it makes people start to think about their actions.

OP unfortunately we can't turn the clock back and nothing anyone here can say will make you feel better sadly. Time and therapy are the only two things that will help with how you feel.

if any compensation can help your mum, of course you should pursue that.

but I have to give you the hard truth here. don't expect the trust to change its ways despite financial settlement. most likely the reason your dad received such abysmal care is because the NHS is no longer functioning. no amount of suing will make it better and frankly the senior management won't care. the healthcare professionals involved likely already feel awful. it is very unlikely that any particular individuals to blame/ or will get blamed. it is the system that is not working.

I am not saying don't sue, especially as it might help your mum. but don't expect positive change. I wish I could say something more hopeful....

@Fedupofdiets

Persue it.

I was very lucky that I actually died on my way back into an operating room so I was resuscitated and then reoperated on to save my life. Now had I gone home originally after the first operation like the first surgeon had wanted me to (after he had sliced my bowel in two and not noticed) I wouldn't be writing this now, as I would have been dead for the past 17 years.

For various reasons I couldn't get anywhere with mine as a lot of the proof of their negligence was mysteriously missing from my notes by the time they got to my solicitor and I was to ill (from their fuck up) to fight it.

You can't get your dad back, but you can make them say his name and address what they did.

I'm so sorry you lost him like that.

🌹

I'm not entirely sure how this is going to help the OP, but I do both, I'm a barrister and I do both prosecution and defence (obviously not in a criminal sense but we colloquially adopt the same terms). I work more for the regulator in some areas and more for the defence in others.

Sorry for your loss

You’re wrong it’s funded completely separately.

Can you sue if your mum as next of kin doesn’t want to?
if he was discharged for 2 days then back in for a few days is there sufficient evidence that he didn’t deteriorate after he was discharged? Is the lawyer no win no fee? I think if it’s easy to prove negligence and your mum needs the money then go for it but I’d want to be sure you’re not going to lose money to your barrister fighting a losing case

The one thing that stood out to me OP, is what you said here:

"yes his diabetes was poorly controlled. He had been diabetic for around 30 years."

I am not medically trained and I do not have diabetes, but even I know that diabetes can kill if you don't control it.

I also know that diabetics should be checking their feet daily for signs of diabetic foot (especially if their diabetes is not well managed).

If your DF lived with badly controlled diabetes for 30 years, he will have no doubt seen HCPs with some regularity. All of whom would have told him that he needs to manage his diabetes better (sometimes with something as simple as a healthier diet and more exercise) AND that he should do daily feet checks.

Now I do not wish to take away from the tragedy of your father's death. However, your Dad lived with a medical issue that he knew could kill him if he didn't manage it properly and in your words he chose not to.

I'm sure you're in pain and you are looking for someone to blame, but the doctors will have told your Dad how to avoid getting diabetic foot, time and time again. How to check for it, to go to a HCP at the first signs of a foot infection.

You said that his foot had got to the stage where you wanted to throw up when you looked at it and at that point he went to A&E.

I do think individuals need to take some personal accountability for their health. In the same way that a chain smoker is told they have a high chance of getting lung cancer; people roll those dice with their health and think that the NHS will pick up the pieces and put them back together, but they can't always do that.

They no longer have the funding, the staff, the time or, in some cases, the will to help people; especially those who aren't helping themselves.

If you want to put a complaint in, then do so, but I think you need to admit to yourself that you're also angry at your Dad, for not looking after himself better, for not getting treatment for his foot sooner and for not taking precautions that would have led to him being around longer both for you and your mum.

I'm very sorry for your loss, it must really sting when it was potentially preventable.

it seems like this kind of thing like what happened to OP’s poor father is so prevalent. Do many people complain/sue?

do you mind if I ask - do claims have to be for things where the nhs did something wrong rather than didn’t do something? I mean I get suing for negligence I just don’t know what that encompasses or where you’d find that information

For example, is it enough that tests weren’t ordered but they could pass that off as a judgement call gone wrong or does a patient have to have had something ‘actively’ done to cause harm? I.e., been given the wrong dosage of meds or had the wrong arm amputated (for example) IYSWIM

In my case I’m in a situation where the nhs genuinely seemed to conspire to not allow me to have an operation I needed.

I was deterred/refused at every step by every healthcare provider from nurse to go for over a decade and I was chronically ill because of it.

When I did finally get the op, the surgeon who gave it the go ahead was appalled I hadn’t had it year before. I’m now free of the symptoms I suffered every day for all that time but I lost years of my life being ill and it left me with health anxiety and a total mistrust of the nhs.

100% do it - like others have said, any money comes from a separate budget. Trusts are so horribly mismanaged these days, it isn't that they 'need more money' - the trusts need to manage better! That goes for everything - funding, staffing, medical care. I'm so sorry you lost your dad in this way, you need to push it as far as you can and I'd 100% do the same if I were in your position

Utterbar
I asked because if you bring your profession into it to sort of bolster your input it's surely better to be clear what you do.
The GMC has a poor reputation atm as a regulator and due to extended investigations and several suicides they have been called not fit for purpose.
However if you represent MDU or MPS, Thankyou

Represent Drs for ..

I'm sorry for your loss OP.

We lost my aunt due to hospital negligence about 20 years ago. She was in her 50s and was having some work done at home. She literally only tripped over some tools, fell badly, broke her hip and never came out of hospital. My parents had tried to speak up for her, raised concerns with the hospital she was in and for several days it was always manana. She was about to be moved to another hospital, but died. It was my grandma's birthday and I was at her house with my parents before we were taking my grandma back up to visit. My aunt would have been dying at the time. My grandma got that awful call whilst we were there. We ended up saying goodbye to my dead aunt instead. Horrific.

The report showed negligence and my dad seriously considered taking it further. He was also told that her life was pretty worthless financially which hit him hard. He decided not to pursue in the end due to the stress, plus the impact an ongoing case might have on their mum, who didn't want to pursue it further. He felt so guilty for not pushing harder with his concerns in hospital, but the fact is, my parents raised concerns a number of times and were ignored. It shouldn't even be down to relatives to have to raise concerns.

If you have the stamina for it, do it. I'm so sorry.

My dad had his iPad stolen by a staff member on a closed Covid ward during his end of life "care" in 2021. When we were allowed back in at the very end, I was shocked at how callous and rude some staff were speaking to patients on that closed ward. Maybe they didn't know I was sitting quietly behind a curtain holding my dad's hand in his final hours. I have no words for the way a minority of staff behave. I know it's a different issue but indicative of our horrendously failing system.

2022

Who "gets away with it"?
The staff who are at breaking point and could probably earn more in McDonalds, or the politicians who are ensuring that there will be no NHS left soon?
I'm so sorry for your loss OP. We have had to wait over a year for a consultation for a life limiting illness, I am blaming the politicians, not the NHS staff, who are doing their best.

Can I just add- the EXACT same thing happened to my uncle he had a foot injury, went black, sent home, had heart attack got sepsis… he’s lucky to be alive but is now one foot less. Hell of a journey.
pursue this, he isn’t the only one and lessons need to be learned!!!!!

I'm sorry but if yous had of got his foot seen before it got so bad it would've prevented sepsis, so instead of blaming the NHS for failing to spot sepsis take part blame for it getting to that stage before getting it seen to.