When Exactly did Trans/Non Binary Become So Commonplace?

[miniaturepixieonacid]

This isn't to start (yet another!) debate on the rights and wrongs of gender identification, transitioning etc. Just pondering on how quickly and in what year it became so common.

I'm just watching an old episode of Waterloo Road (Drama set in a comprehensive school) where one of the characters (Casey Barry for anyone who watched it) realises that she wants to be a boy rather than a tomboy and everyone reacts as if it's extremely unusual. The other pupils mock and bully her, her brother gets violent and tells her she is disgusting and a freak and the teachers talk about what a difficult road she has ahead and how much support she will need.

The episode is set in 2013. Not the 1990s. Only just over 10 years ago. But in a Year 10/11 class in a comprehensive in 2024 this wouldn't even raise an eyebrow, would it. There will be several trans and non binary pupils (maybe even several per year group) and pupils would consider it normal.

I teach in a prep school (only goes up to Year 8) so we haven't actually yet had a single pupil transition to the opposite gender. There's one 10 year old who I could potentially see it happening to over the next couple of years but it hasn't yet. So I'm relatively unknowledgable about the whole thing.

Interested to know from secondary school teachers who have been teaching for 10+ years what year you think it was that transitioning and being non binary went from rare to a relatively popular trend.

These people always existed since the beginning of time, they were just not so open about their interests

I used to go to clubs & pubs in 90s with different types of people

Example
1994
Homosexuality reduced from 21 to 18 in UK

2001
Homsexuality reduced to 18 to 16 in UK

There were the AIDS campaigns

The Internet changed the world for all types of people LBGQ+ due to better communication & comnnections

It is much easier for people to make choices & changes now, although this is not the case in all countries in the world !

Yeah, it doesn't happen, does it?

A teacher friend who teaches a minority subject in a smallish high school, talked about 2 girls in her Scottish Higher class who identified as boys (what are the odds?). This was about 2018. OTOH my cousin's, previously quite macho, BIL started identifying as a woman in his 60s.

Be interesting to hear from secondary teachers the proportions of trans girls and trans boys.

So you think there were always the 107 different genders there are today?

OTOH my cousin's, previously quite macho, BIL started identifying as a woman in his 60s

That’s more the AGP demographic. Cross dressers who are sexually excited by thinking of themselves as a woman. Usually fathered children. It’s all lingerie and short skirts and fishnets.

I think this is where things cross over

'As long as it is not hurting anyone'

if a trans woman takes the place in scholarships, sports teams, high levels of business of bio women or means that bio women who have either religious beliefs or trauma have to self exclude from female only spaces then does that not hurt them?

Have people always had 'gender dysphoria'?

Or has the mission of transing the dead women who had to pretend they were men to get published/jobs/freedoms influenced you here?

It all started with John Money's horrific experiment on David Reimer. Which went very badly wrong in so many ways*

Apologies, I genuinely don't understand this post so can't answer your question. What does 'transing the dead' mean? Do you mean that people look back and use hindsight/guessing to say that people in the past were probably trans?

Why are you conflating homosexuality with transgenderism? One is an innate sexuality, the other - as we are constantly told - relates to gender identity, not sex or sexuality.

If you'd added the year gay marriage became legal to your post, you'd have essentially set out why Stonewall suddenly switched focus to transactivism: its (unarguably admirable) work to fight for LGB equality was done.

As ever...follow the money.

Maybe there is a correlation between it being featured in Waterloo Road and it becoming more widespread?! Perhaps that did play a role?

I'm not sure it was ever that widely watched tbh. Not on the same lines as a soap. But maybe, who knows?

@miniaturepixieonacid There's been a very visible push to say Joan of Arc, Louisa May Alcott (and Jo from Little Women) and many high profile women who did not conform to gender norms were in fact trans males.

See also George from the Famous Five.

They can't.
They either refuse to read them or they did read them and they realise that if they use her actual words then they can't claim transphobia.
So they go down the broken telephone route. I heard it from x who heard it from y who heard it from z who said their cousin's neighbour's, dog walker's sister's best friend told them...

Then they protect their deliberate ignorance by angrily refusing to read the words of a 'terf'.

It's all planned out very carefully. These people are incapable of reading, understanding what they read and forming an opinion on it that they can debate. They're also unwilling to actually listen to opposing views and take time to consider them because sticking their fingers in their ears and screaming KILL THE TERFS is literally all they have.

'as an openly bisexual woman who was scared to come out for the fear of judgement, that being yourself is really freeing, i don't care what gender you feel you are, whether it's the same as your assigned gender, different or you feel both, as long as you're happy, who the fuck cares?

If one is bisexual, I wonder if it is perhaps less easy to understand the viewpoint of hetero and homosexual people who really do care what sex their partner is?

🥨🥨🥨🥨

There was also the programme "I am Leo" which aired on CBBC from 2014.

It was a documentary style programme which followed the life of a girl who was going down a transitioning pathway, featured activists such as Stephen Whittle, the head of the paediatric GIDS from the Tavistock which is being closed, and was very light on actual factual content.

Have these people never heard of or understood the concept of tomboys! My sister was a tomboy in the 60s/70s god forbid if she’d been one today!

No research because transactivists have been allowed to influence child healthcare to the extent they barred research into all of this. Hence the now discredited Gender Identity Service having no research / evidence about their "treatments" of children - which is unheard of in the UK. Normally the use of experimental medicine on anyone, let alone children, is highly regulated and controlled. But not for these children who have literally been experimented on from the outset.

The Cass review has put a stop to that now but the question must be asked "Why has the NHS and society in general abandoned so many professional principles including safeguarding in order to promote transitioning children?"

I watch a lot of Alexis Blake content. Alexis has gender dysphoria and transitioned to female presenting a few years ago.

Alexis is a perfectly reasonable, normal person who understands and accepts biological fact. It's a shame that reasonable people like Alexis aren't the ones with the big voices.

In 2020 a 15 year old asked me about it and I felt free to reply that if a face-lift and hrt don't actually make you younger, surgery and hormones don't actually make you change sex. This was met with agreement. I wouldn't feel so free to say that now. So, I would say 2019 onwards it really went fast. Lockdown and too much time to navel gaze and live on the Internet???

I remember watching it in Corrie and Friends and I never rolled my eyes over it like I find myself doing sometimes now.

I remember when Caitlyn Jenner came out because said that they were jumping on the bandwagon, even though they’d spent 40+ years living a secret life.

I think the increase of internet usage has increased people’s exposure to it.

The biggest difference if today vs 20 years ago is that it used to be middle aged people but now it’s teens and often young kids.

I clearly stated that I don't agree with children being given hormones. I think it's foolish and irresponsible.

Thinking about it, if being female requires stereotypical female interests and presentation then what am I? I don't wear make up. I don't do my nails. I don't give a shit about shoes or handbags or designer stuff. Pink is not my favourite colour. I don't wear heels. I have no interest in soap operas or reality TV shows. I can't think of a single one of such stupid stereotype about what makes a woman that applies to me.

I must be a man then.
No, wait. I can't be a man. I don't like sports. I don't drink beer. I don't like to sit on the sofa with my hand down my pants.

I must be non binary.

Or maybe gender stereotypes are just fucking stupid and we'd all be better off if those two ridiculous boxes marked "male" and "female" were pissed on, stomped flat and burned.

I don't think Waterloo Road played a part.

Casey thought she was really a boy for a while because she loved football and wasn't allowed to play on the school team as they didn't have a girls team (i think that's right). Plus her sister was super girly, fake lashes, inch thick makeup etc.

Then she realised she was actually a tomboy and that it was fine to be a girl who isn't 'girly'

Actually you said you don’t agree with children being given hormones but then you followed it with

and so I would rather a child were given blockers (not hormones) until they figure things out and by that I mean a LOT of monitoring by doctors and family, listening to and observing the child and their behaviours.

Puberty blockers block the effect of hormones. Almost all children who go on puberty blockers end up on testosterone or oestrogen. So do you support or oppose the use of puberty blockers?

Attention seeking has always been around in one form or another. It'll start decreasing in popularity as common sense prevails and women's safety is prioritised.

107?! For fucks sake.

I took a look at the list, and outside of the labels from non western cultures, the others seem to be variations of ones that already exist. Christ. My brain hurts. 😵‍💫

Sorry if I have misunderstood. You agree with puberty blockers despite the mountain of evidence that there is that they cause harm, and often negative side effects not discovered until long after the treatment, but you don't agree with cross sex hormones?

If you agree with puberty blockers, and you have seen the research in the negative side effects, can you tell us why you support them and not hormones?