When Exactly did Trans/Non Binary Become So Commonplace?

[miniaturepixieonacid]

This isn't to start (yet another!) debate on the rights and wrongs of gender identification, transitioning etc. Just pondering on how quickly and in what year it became so common.

I'm just watching an old episode of Waterloo Road (Drama set in a comprehensive school) where one of the characters (Casey Barry for anyone who watched it) realises that she wants to be a boy rather than a tomboy and everyone reacts as if it's extremely unusual. The other pupils mock and bully her, her brother gets violent and tells her she is disgusting and a freak and the teachers talk about what a difficult road she has ahead and how much support she will need.

The episode is set in 2013. Not the 1990s. Only just over 10 years ago. But in a Year 10/11 class in a comprehensive in 2024 this wouldn't even raise an eyebrow, would it. There will be several trans and non binary pupils (maybe even several per year group) and pupils would consider it normal.

I teach in a prep school (only goes up to Year 8) so we haven't actually yet had a single pupil transition to the opposite gender. There's one 10 year old who I could potentially see it happening to over the next couple of years but it hasn't yet. So I'm relatively unknowledgable about the whole thing.

Interested to know from secondary school teachers who have been teaching for 10+ years what year you think it was that transitioning and being non binary went from rare to a relatively popular trend.

Being non binary is on its way out with the school kids where I live. It's all about identifying as a cat now.

When I was a neurodiverse teenage girl, I bonded with other neurodiverse teenagers about alternative music, alternative fashion, dystopian novels, and hating OTT feminine, sexist pop culture. I was definitely extremely anti gender stereotyping. I would have lapped up the current trans ideology trend. I despised being a girl/woman. I shaved my hair and wore boys clothes. Fortunately, trans obsession wasn't a thing then, and I was able to recognise my hate of anything feminine was actually a hate of being a victim of misogyny. Myself and my other masculine-female friends and feminine-male friends I am still in contact with are all happily as our true biological sex now although still dislike gender stereotypes but probably not as radically. This is why I don't believe it is simply that trans teenagers are more comfortable to be themselves because it is less taboo.

It's always been a thing that neurodiverse teenagers don't blindly follow tradition and are drawn to anything they deem alternative. It will blow over when it stops being alternative. If we are at quarter of year groups now, we are nearly there hopefully.

The first person in my own life that transitioned did so in 2001. There wasn't another (in my personal sphere) until 2008.
Since then, maybe 20?

I teach in a challenging area- not exactly a hotbed of liberal attitudes. I started in 2001. One of the students was in year 10/11 and went on to be a well known trans person. Most of our trans kids are female to male and I remember the first student I had pastoral dealings with was about 8 years ago. We have a few non--binary kids. Generally they are accepted. I think it's great they feel they can be themselves, I went to school in the era of section 28 and the age of consent for gay men was 21, funnily enough banning talking about anything gay at school didn't stop people I went to school with being openly gay but there was so much homophobia in society and the media. I think we've made some progress thankfully.

I wonder how it would go if a large cohort of middle aged women/mums suddenly decided they were trans and were to be treated with kid gloves going forward.

That ought to knock it on the head I reckon. I might give it a go. Acceptance without exception after all.

What if they did? I'm not sure what point you're trying to make.

That it would suddenly become less of a social contagion/fad amongst teen girls. Once the daggy mums are doing it they will move on to something else. Anyone who doesn't see that this is just the latest attempt by teen girls to escape the pressure of being a tteen girl is either very young or a bit dim/has an agenda.

Not sure where the teens losing interest will leave the creepy middle aged men who use those teen girls as a shield so they can stand behind useful idiots shouting about Protecting Trans Kids! But as it is already starting to happen it is worth watching.

I may try it with my own teens. I shall start demanding they use male pronouns for me and refer to me as Dad, and follow my sons into the men's. Obviously there is no need for me to change anything else about myself. I can just demand everyone else bends reality for me.

Will report back.

I had a teen in sixth form in 2019.

Of her friendship group, all of the born females were trans or non-binary except her she is a lesbian.

Now in 2024 most have retained a changed name, no surgery of any kind that I am aware of.

Secondary school teacher, 20 years’ experience.

It is a presentation of autism. Before 2014, these children would have expressed their differences by identifying as ‘emo’. After 2014, trans or non-binary.

However, it’s suddenly ‘over’ at my school. Far fewer children engaging with the narrative that if they’re different, they must be trans. It’s a fairly rare occurrence.

There's a kid at DD's school that returned after summer to start year 1, aged 5, and it was announced that she is now a girl. The kids were a little confused but accepted it well enough. DD used to say to me 'she's not really a girl, she just wants to be'. They're y3 now and I think have forgotten that this child started school as a boy. I wonder what will happen with changing rooms next year when they start swimming.

This wouldn't have happened when I was at school. I think even 10 years ago it would have been more of a big deal.

Also secondary of 20+ years and it's not a presentation of autism in the trans students I teach.

Even one of the Autism advocacy groups admits that approximately 2 thirds of trans people have autism. It's a known link.

I remember Tumblr 2011-2013 was primarily about discussing interests films and tv shows. Then sometime in 2014 suddenly everyone was labelling themselves as trans and wanted to discuss trans issues.

Not the one I was looking for, but:

@All2Well
How can one nurse have so much power?

Wouldn't the head say yes let's edcate about this but not immediately in year 7?

Also what is the Japanese anime link please.

There doesn't seem to be any main pop bands anymore or stand out stars save swift etc... People need a focus in teens it feels like their is a vacuum

When I was a teenager, so late 90s , there were trans people in the wider world that we knew off and sometimes in the media .

Teenagers ( especially alternative music types) often dressed androgynous. Boys wore make up / skirts / tights etc. It was rather popular to be bisexual. For a period in their teens, a lot of my social friendship group were at least bi- curious There were celebs like Brian Molko and Marilyn Manson. Nobody wanted to be the opposite sex, though. People were quite secure how they had been assigned at birth.

From my personal experience/view, the movement started around the same time that the internet became more accessible at home (around 2000ish). As an undiagnosed ND teen, I was drawn into places like Tumblr which quickly became a community for those who didn’t ’fit in’ elsewhere. Tumblr in particular had users making up genders as they went along - I’m pretty sure it was ‘floragender’ that had me realising that it was going a bit far even at 13/14 years old.

A lot of the gender movement has be born out of a series of events and young ND people being ignored/let down/left to the grooming of the internet over many years. If autism in particular had been recognised in girls sooner, and more importantly the mental health aspect of ASD especially around the teenage years, I honestly don’t believe gender ideology (which is often not the same as transgenderism) would have blow up the way it has. This is absolute ND (and abused) children being severely let down, and gender appeasement is the plaster over the bullet would from the medical community.

This. Neither does coming out as gay or bi require everyone around you to change their use of language, contrary to the evidence of their own eyes, on pain of being cancelled / disciplined / sacked / ostracised.

This is not merely a harmless “freedom to be oneself”. It’s harming the children caught up in this social contagion, and it’s harming adults trying to hold the line for reality.

Adult men with the paraphilia of cross-dressing need the confused teens and children (and their concerned parents) to be the acceptable face of transgenderism, in order to normalise their desire to colonise female spaces because doing so gives them a “lady boner”.

I often wonder with trans threads on Mumsnet, how many of the posters that are so virulently anti-trans know someone close to them that struggles with this issue?
i have no idea how it must feel to struggle with gender identity - fortunately it hasn’t happened to me. However I have seen a teen who is close to my heart wrestle with this topic for a number of years - they didn’t just wake up one Tuesday and decide to be non-binary. I don’t know if it will continue into adulthood or not, but I know they are now much happier in themselves, and I don’t see how that can be a bad thing.
there is a large overlap between autism and trans/non-binary. I have an autistic DD and it’s something we are aware of, although hasn’t raised its head yet. I hope that, if it does come up, we as a family can deal with it in a kind and sensitive way - I certainly wouldn’t prevent her from seeking a happier life just because I was uncomfortable with what that life looks like!

Some Mumsnet posters talk about loads of trans women ‘invading’ female only spaces - and I wonder how many of them have actually experienced this for themselves? I’m in my 40s, not a hermit or recluse, but I’ve never noticed a trans woman in a female only space. I understand that people have a genuine fear, but I wonder how common the direct experience is of this? Maybe I live in a particularly not trans part of the country, but so far I’ve yet to meet a woman with a full beard in the bathroom, let alone have had that person threaten me or make me feel uncomfortable.

largely I think people should be left alone to live their lives in whatever way makes them happiest. I’d hate to go through my one and only life feeling miserable every day simply because I didn’t fit in with what others thought I ‘should’ be.

@ProfessorPeppy wow, just wow. I’m not sure you should be a teacher. A clumsy and embarrassing misunderstanding of trends amongst kids is to be expected by any adult (emo as autism! Really?! I was at school then, you’ve no idea what you’re talking about), but your utterly bizarre claims that being trans as a presentation of autism is extremely troubling.

Where, might I ask, did you become so ill informed? Was it YouTube by any chance?

Not a teacher, but my impression is that it did begin to hit around 2015/2016. That's when Facebook introduced dozens of genders and pronoun choices. I ignored it at the time as a 'kids' fad', but then it spread into the mainstream and was everywhere.

I was at secondary school in the late eighties and early nineties. There were some gender non-conforming people, almost all girls who dressed in a boyish way. But there weren't many of them, and I would say this:

1. There was no concept of 'gender identity', or that girls who liked to wear masculine clothes were actually boys or 'non-binary'. Those girls who did dress boyishly didn't grow up to identify as men, and in fact tended to be heterosexual.

2. There was less pressure to conform to gender stereotypes. That's part of the problem today. Kids are being told that to be a girl they have to dress and act 'as a girl', and if they don't like it they must be trans or non-binary. We've gone backwards in that regard. In fact when I was a teenager, there was quite a feminist mood, and the limitations gender stereotypes placed on girls and women were being challenged - but it was clear that a woman who challenged them remained a woman, because of course she was female.

So basically, what's changed is the concept of a 'gender identity', and increased encouragement to 'act like your gender'.

That was different. Hailey had the OP, most men now keep their dicks. No-one was forced to say he was a woman. No pronouns. Not seen as a trendy lifestyle choice.

However I have seen a teen who is close to my heart wrestle with this topic for a number of years - they didn’t just wake up one Tuesday and decide to be non-binary.

Non-binary is a nonsensical concept though, it is a self descriptor, not a state of being. So whilst I’m sure this teen absolutely has struggled with their identity as many teens do (especially and more so when autistic and not receiving adequate care from doctors or their parents), they did ‘decide’ to be non-binary. It may have taken a long time to decide to describe themselves as so, but it was still an active choice unlike realising youre same-sex attracted.

I have an autistic DD and it’s something we are aware of, although hasn’t raised its head yet. I hope that, if it does come up, we as a family can deal with it in a kind and sensitive way - I certainly wouldn’t prevent her from seeking a happier life just because I was uncomfortable with what that life looks like!

This is the worrying parenting of autistic children we’re seeing. Because autism and gender ideology is so closely ingrained, it seems to be accepted that an ASD child/teen will become ‘happier’ by denying their biology when puberty starts. It doesn’t make them ‘happier’ at all, it’s just another form of masking, and to not realise that is failing as a parent of a sen child.

Some Mumsnet posters talk about loads of trans women ‘invading’ female only spaces - and I wonder how many of them have actually experienced this for themselves?

Many in MN have, but it’s not about the lesser experience. It’s about the overall issues that affect all women. Same sex spaces are necessary to keep girls and women safe. It is necessary in sports to be a fair game/competition. And there are plenty of examples to give where allowing males to be part of female spaces have had hugely negative impacts and consequences.

I’m also trying to remember. I remember being at work and having a discussion about it with my friend, perhaps 2018? Just generally talking about how hard it must be to be trans and whether we would be attracted to someone who we knew had gone through sex change surgery. It was a very open conversation! But then I feel by the pandemic in 2020 when JK made her comments, that’s when it became the enormous thing that it is now where you can’t even talk about it. I would never feel comfortable to have that conversation now.

I think that storyline was done brilliantly, and was reflective of the society at the time. There wasn't a huge fuss, just a few raised eyebrows, although there were some demonstrations of outright bigotry (graffiti and poison pen letters, I think?) and bullying too. The Hailey storyline wasn't all consuming for the whole road.

I agree that it's very dated now though, and not reflective of how society or the trans identifying person would be in 2024.