to think that British coffee is just as good as Australian?

[EmmaGrundyForPM]

DNiece has arrived at ours, she's visiting from Australia and I haven't seen her for 5 years, since she was 15.

She's been in the UK for a few days and keeps banging on about how British coffee is horrible and not a patch on Australian coffee. Her dad, my BIL, always says this when he's in the UK but I'm not convinced it's true. I've only been to Australia once, but I wasn't blown away by their amazing coffee. I think DN is just parroting her dad and wouldn't be able to tell the difference in a blind taste test.

So, I think I'm not being unreasonable. Anyone agree?

I’m Australian and always use to think the coffee my (British) PIL drank tasted of mud, but I assumed that was because they bought a cheap brand. (The low price would have made up for the shit flavour, to them.)

I have realised, though, that DH likes his coffee to taste of mud - it’s what he thinks it should taste like.

So, there could well be something in it.

(DH does that annoying thing of ordering tea in a coffee shop, then moaning that it’s not very good. He does drink coffee, so why order tea in a place where it’s an afterthought?)

I think you might have missed the bit where I said:

British coffee has improved out of sight since I've lived here and there are a lot more properly trained baristas, decently roasted coffee, and cafes that take proper pride in what they do.

I think U.K. has developed much more of a coffee culture in recent years. Where I live in London there are some great independent coffee shops that do excellent coffee. I do tend to avoid chains like Pret and Costa as their coffee tastes like shite.

Also, coffee shops in when I was growing up in Australia were mostly run by Italian immigrants. Coffee shops in the UK are mostly American chains. I’m guessing most people would agree that Italian coffee, in the main, is better than American coffee?

Lol no, we don’t like our coffee to taste of mud

DH does that annoying thing of ordering tea in a coffee shop, then moaning that it’s not very good. He does drink coffee, so why order tea in a place where it’s an afterthought

A good coffee shop should be able to make a decent cup of tea, it's not exactly rocket science.

You’re correct, I did miss that part. I stand corrected.

I suppose I’ve just been used to quite a few snobby Australians coming to England and slating us for just about everything. And it’s very pleasing when they return home. Current company excepted of course.

Are you my FIL? (I’m guessing not my MIL - she’s dead.)

Me and DM are tea connoisseurs and it can vary wildly as to which coffee shop does a good cup, preferably in a china cup.

No, it really isn’t, is it. But they often don’t prioritise it, and expecting them to seems a bit naive.

Edit: it’s one of those triumph of hope over experience situations.

If it's any consolation, a lot of British people love bashing Australians, including to our faces, so probably on the whole it's probably equal give and take.

Can’t bloody move for Indy coffee shops in my area! There are so many where I am and current ones are owned by a mixture of Greek, Portuguese, Italian, English and Eastern Europeans and one Moroccan guy. Oh and an Aussie brand too I think. The Costa has long gone!

You need a cafe belonging to a good coffee and tea merchant. Our favourite is Atkinsons in Lancaster 'Speciality Coffee and Tea Since 1837'. Lovely shop, lovely coffee, decent tea.

It’s mostly an enormous earthenware mug with one teabag in it.

It’s so easy to “hot the pot”, and pour boiling water onto the tea. But it’s not the norm, in my experience of coffee shops.

We have a few Australian regular customers who swear by our coffee and even have visiting family come to us so they can have a good cup of coffee!
When it comes to milk based drinks it really is all about the temperature, even slightly too hot and it won’t be nice.

Well (and I don’t want to get into mud slinging here) we generally or I didn’t when I was younger, tend to bash Aussies. What’s the point?! In fact we had some fun Aussie clubbing friends. I guess I found a few of them to be unfriendly (one in particular but that’s another story!).

My DM and her friends when younger back in the 60s in London got to know and have a few close Aussie friends, several of whom are family friends, one is godmother to DC of one friend, and a couple of whom settled in the UK, but maybe it was friendlier then, who knows?

Yes I am ❤️

But also there isn’t ‘something in it’, British people as a whole don’t like their coffee to taste of mud 😉

Honestly, when I first came here, I would see a difference and point it out. Not as a judgement, just as a point of interest.

The number of times I was told “well if it’s so good, why don’t you go back there, then?”

I’ve had very similar experiences and been told the same when visiting Australia and been called a whinging Pom to my face. So surprise surprise I only went there once.

You could just accept that the coffee is better in Australia OP? Why fight it?

I had an Australian au pair who was obsessed with good coffee and she definitely felt that coffee was much nicer there - she actively sought out cafes where the coffee was acceptable. She also brought the aeropress into my house (This was back in 2016).

Australian and NZ coffee is miles better. I go there regularly and their coffee is smoother and more velvety. I am speaking of the milky kind. Not espresso or black

Do you have a good independent place you can take them to op?

Melbourne does care a lot about coffee and it shows but here if you don’t do a chain it can be fine

Of course, and I love DN dearly, so I'm not going to argue with her over it. I just think, as a pp said, she's repeating a myth.

I'm very prepared to agree that Australia does better wines than we do 😁

I reckon it's nothing to do with the beans and is more about either the water or the milk.

I'm sure you didn't, and I mean that sincerely. If it was universal, I wouldn't have stayed.

But it's been two decades, an in my experience of being an Australian living in this country, it's not rare or isolated either. It is what it is, and I'm not denying that the converse is also true.