To want equality of opportunity to go to the loo?

[HFJ]

Been meaning to drop this complaint in for a while. I am sick of queuing.

So, in most public places architects’ plans for washrooms allocate the same sq footage to men and women. Here’s why I think it’s unfair:

1. Fewer Women’s cubicles compared to how many men can use that urinal trough thing
2. Women have more ‘admin’ from clothing etc so take longer
3. Children have to go to the loo supervised by mothers, including those boys who are really too old but mum keeps dragging them in anyway
4. More likely to dither at the wash basins
5. It seems like Uncle Tom Cobley and his dog need to just stand around waiting in the vicinity, thus preventing swift entries and exits to said loos

Anyone else get irate by this? It’s worse this time of year

I'm slightly flabbergasted on this thread at the quite high number of people, any more than zero is weird, who need to have it explained how pulling a cock out is a quicker process than what women have to do to have a wee.

I wouldn't want to shake hands with anyone who hasn't washed them after using the toilet. What's your point?

The phrase sometimes used is potty parity. It has its own Wiki article with links to scientific articles, for anyone questioning whether women need more toilet time

I went to a newly built theatre not long ago and there was NO QUEUE because they had way more women's toilets than men's. It was AMAZING not to have to spend the whole interval queueing.

As already said upthread, there’s little point in arguing about the reasons, it’s obvious to pretty much everyone that in the vast majority of public spaces the space given to male and female toilets is not proportional to their usage.

2. You choose what clothing you wear, and how much "admin" you need to do.

If I could unzip my fly, pee standing up and replace wiping with a shake I'd take your point but I can't so it's you who is being ridiculous.

This drives me mad

I work in architecture/engineering. There are minimum requirements according to building use. The client will often opt for the minimums as they are concerned with the available area to let (want the optimum balance between useable space and toilets). There are many regulations regarding accessibility etc., minimum space, door openings, etc.

@Gt86 You're being ridiculous Op

Are you a woman? Have you ever used a public toilet? If so you must surely know that the queue for the women's loos is nearly always far longer than the queue for the men's.

Actually, even if you are not a woman I'd have thought you would know this.

It's not architects it's building standards.

Your statement Well, it's your choice whether to spend time washing your hands or not. Nobody is holding a gun to your head. is at odds with your desire not to shake hands with someone who hasn't washed them after using the loo.

I'll put it another way: women's obligations to maintain public health mean that "to spend time washing your hands" is not actually a choice, but a mandate.

Perhaps your clients might like to know that there are pubs, restaurants, and shopping centres that I won't go to because the women's loos are so badly designed. And when I don't go there, neither do the people I am with.

I doubt that I am the only woman who avoids venues where the loos suck.

@Gt86 Of course washing hands is a choice but after dealing with mensural blood the odds are higher you might want to wash them even if you wiped them first.

Men loos have three functions.Piss,shit, vomit. Women have one more - piss shit and periods. Plus pregnant people (who are only women) need the loo more. For both vomit and wee.

Its NOT a level playing field however you pretend it is.

Who uses the women's toilets?
Women
Children
Babies
Trans women
Young boys (who's mums are too worried to let them go to the Men's alone)

What are women's toilets used for?
Going to the toilet
Taking child to the toilet
Changing babies nappy
Changing feminine hygiene
Washing hands

Who uses the men's toilets?
Men

What are men's toilets used for?
Going to the toilet.

Hardly surprising there's a huge queue outside the women's toilets.

Mens toilets are also used for bringing children to the toilet, and washing hands. Around here, the vast majority of baby changing facilities are in the accessible loos, not the ladies.

Yep. This is a really important one.

Agree with your main point. But:

Men take children to the toilet too.

Women don't dither - it's derogatory. We might spend longer at the sinks if we want to freshen up hair and makeup.

The addition of men (aka transwomen) now using the women's toilets certainly doesn't help. What we have now is basically men's toilets and mixed sex toilets.

At the Nec, birmingham, the mens lines seem to go down faster than the ladies, i would add more toilets etc to the womens toilets. @HFJ

Totally agree OP. Also, while we are launching this campaign, can we also ask for a hook on the back of the door to come as standard so you don't have to put your coat/bag on a dirty floor?

There are also disabled and family changing toilets.
When I'm taking more than one child with me I use those.

Equality of privacy? Men have far less of that.
They often drink more and need to wee more so need the quick, public display urinals and don't mind them.

I prefer to wait for the fewer but private cubicles with doors.

And I love the Ladies toilets that have the separate room to the side with long bench and mirrors just for make up and hair. Some also house a lounge/baby feeding room.

How do the men cope with reapplying their make up?

And if you aren't going to fit a lock that works can you make the cubicle short enough so I can keep the door shut with my foot?

Yes, this is it entirely.

Men's toilet provision is currently pretty much fit for purpose, as can be seen by the lack of long/slow-moving/any queues.

Women's toilet provision is woefully lacking, hence all of the queues you see in a great many public toilets.

That's all we need to know in order to address it.

I was having this exact conversation with another woman earlier this evening. We were at the Barbican Centre in London and the queues for the women's loos were soooo long whilst the males just nipped straight in and out of theirs.

The Barbican was built in 1982. We figured that the men who made the building had never noticed women's experiences or listened to women talk about their lives or cared much anyway. I'm not sure much has really changed 😕

Equality of privacy? Men have far less of that.
They often drink more and need to wee more so need the quick, public display urinals and don't mind them.

I don't think most men mind their backs and the back of their legs - fully clothed - being seen 'in public' (well, by other males). Why would they?

It's not like they pogo around in the middle of the room, doing big willy windmills and spraying wee everywhere in full view.

Agree in principle, but don't like 'dither at the washbasin'. That's some internalised misogyny right there.

How about you reframe that as: women more likely to wash hands thoroughly.