Really upset at the school need to vent

[AnnoyedTeacherrrr]

Apologies in advance for any typos I might make. I am very upset right now and need to vent/get advice.

I worked as a supply teacher in a secondary school. School was very happy with me and wanted to keep me on as permanent. They said things such as my work ethic is amazing, I’m hard working etc. a couple of months later there was an incident where I was pushed very aggressively by a 14 year old student. It was not accidental, he purposely pushed me and I was hurt. The school did nothing, no consequences, talking to him, nothing at all. He was back in my class the next lesson which I questioned and headteacher told me he is still investigating it and has to look at it from both angles. I decided to give my notice in and left a week later as per supply contract. The school tried to convince me to stay and said they’re sorry how it all escalated etc.

I applied for a permanent job as I’m sick of supply teaching, everything went great; I did amazing at interview, the lesson observation was amazing and I got offered the job against 3 other applicants subject to references.

I got a call this morning from my new school saying there has been a concern raised from one reference (the school with the incident). The HR has told me I need to write a statement and they need to investigate it further as it’s a safeguarding concern. She wouldn’t tell me exactly what was in the reference as I need to get a written request in to view but she said the reference “is very positive” just one slight detail related around an incident involving a student.

The old school (supply position) is being very petty aren’t they? I feel so angry I feel I don’t want to let this go and I actually want to contact someone like governors etc but I don’t know what I should be doing. I’m on phone to my union now but I’m like position 8 still!

Please help. I’m so worried I’ll never get a job again. I have two young kids to support plus rent to pay and bills.

You're welcome, @AnnoyedTeacherrrr . I can appreciate how stressful this all is, especially when you've done so well to get yourself a great new position.

Please don't worry - your new school obviously think you're worth having and I would imagine the Heads in the local area are very aware of what your old school are like.

It's been a long and stressful term - I have had my own fair share of shitty incidents this term (with parents, rather than kids!) and it does make you wonder why you bother. You need to do some proper self care and have a nice early afternoon glass of wine and some chocolate. Sending solidarity x

@Tortoise2go thank you.

can I just ask everyone opinion - I’ve had an email from old school angry that the new school told me about the reference and should not have as it was confidential, she threatened to contact school as they shared the details with me. Obviously new school
didbt share reference with me just asked me to clarify what the incident was. Why is the old school so angry? Doesn’t that show something?

Thank you @EnidSpyton yes I need to relax now and stop spiralling! I’m so sorry you’ve had to deal with difficult parents. Just think of your good kids to get you through rest of the term.

Your old school are completely incorrect in even being angry about this.

When you start a new job you can ask them for a copy of any reference that they have been given by your previous employer. This is your right under DPA.

I have no idea why your old school would be angry about this because it’s a well known fact, so makes no sense at all.

The old school has no right to be angry with you.

The new school has every right to clarify details of a reference with you.

I would send a very short reply saying 'Please do feel free to contact X School directly with your concerns regarding my reference' and leave it at that. Don't enter into any further correspondence with them.

Your old school is angry because they obviously believed you would never know what they had written. This shows they need to brush up on the law, as no reference is confidential. The subject of a reference can always request to view a reference through a subject access request. Hence why references always need to be factual.

Also OP, this is even more reason you need to request to see entire reference.

If you have been given an unfair or misleading reference then you may well be able to take it to court if you can prove it is unfair or misleading/inaccurate.

See what they have said before you say anything else to your new employer.

@Mrsttcno1 thank you

To me as someone from the outside I'd take that email with a pinch of salt.

It would prove to me that the way the head teacher delt with the situation was totally wrong and they're taking out on you for the other school now knowing that they are pretty incompetent at doing their job, further proof is the fact they've totally misread the fact that the new school hasn't infact given you any details of conversation/correspondence from your old work place.

I remember your other thread. I strongly recommend posting in the Staffroom where you will receive accurate information relevant to the sector.

Your old school was right to include the incident in their reference. Your new school is right to follow it up. If it had made them want to rescind the offer of employment they would have done so by now.

Surely the old school can recognise that there is a need to investigate a potential safeguarding concern and so even if they wanted it to be anonymous you’d have to be spoken to?

The old school are angry because it's highlighted the fact they didn't deal with your incident properly.

They've no right to be angry, you have every right to see the reference they gave you if you so wished.

This is dreadful. I don’t understand why anyone would want to work with kids, especially these days. I’m sure some are lovely but the ones with no discipline…. I couldn’t deal with the rage I’d feel!

I really hope this is sorted for you OP.

Surely the previous school HR or Head is aware of basic GDPRegs and that you are legally entitled to see everything that they have recorded that mentions you, which obviously includes any references?

In your shoes, I’d be contacting the previous school to request a SAR and see what other information they have kept from your period of employment with them. They don’t sound very competent at all, so I’d be concerned to ensure that the information recorded is factually accurate.

I re-read it. You are telling OP, it is not petty.
Then asking her to wait for the details before passing the judgement. You picked on her usage of the word pity. There was no understanding in your post abput how stressful this must be for OP, straight to the lecturing, nor there was any practical advice on who should she contact for help.

Also, I understand that the new school would ask for a reference, so not sure you why you concluded from my post that I needed to be explained that. Do you have a habit of explaining others for the sake of explaining?

Good luck. Op. I dont have much knowledge about employment in the edication but I really hope you can keep this new job. You deserve it.

You very clearly didn’t re-read chick because if you had, you could have saved yourself hammering this little response out😂

1. I was telling the OP that the previous school have not included details of this incident in the reference to be petty. It is not petty of them to include it- it is literally their legal obligation. Any contact like this between pupil and staff must be recorded for safeguarding purposes, other posters have also said this, and in my initial reply (which if you’d re-read you’d have seen) I said they have a duty to mention it, they are not mentioning it to be petty. I haven’t picked on the “usage” of the word petty, what I am saying is the school have not included it in the reference to be petty, they had to include it.

2. I asked OP to wait to see the full reference for exactly the above reason, because in all likelihood they have just mentioned it briefly as that is all they HAVE to do to comply with their safeguarding practices, the bare minimum. (Again, this was in that post if you’d re-read “as it may have literally been mentioned as briefly as possible”).

3. “Nor was there any practical advice on who she should contact for help”, you really have embarrassed yourself with that one chick because again, from my post which you so quoted and claim to have re-read, I have quite clearly stated “stay on to speak with your union”.

☺️

don't these people know that one of the reasons so many leave teaching is because of incidents like this - or rather the lack of support and appropriate discipline. Thank god I don't teach anymore.

I'm genuinely asking here, not being difficult, but what does it say in KCSIE regarding a reference in this sort of incident? I understand if there was something under investigation at the time of an interview but don't understand why the school needs to disclose the teacher was the victim of a physical assault.

Incidentally OP, did the school fill in a physical assault form and forward it to the county? Schools where I am are required to do so.

@Creational no, no form was filled out. It was very obvious they didn’t care at the time. It was very much the attitude that I’m “just a supply”. I’ve still kept in contact with some teachers since leaving and they’ve told me it’s not because I was a supply but they are very weak in dealing with student behaviour. There was never any response from them. No one even came when I called for help after the incident. I was still teaching the rest of the day and no one came. Not one senior leader asked if I was okay. Everytime I went to speak to any of the SLT team they behaved like I was a nuisance.

I know It might sound odd to some people but it was very traumatic. Having to now deal with it and give an account to my new school is bringing it all up again. Funny thing is the person who wrote the reference would never have known if I hadn’t directly told her! She had no knowledge of it as the senior leaders had not bothered telling her.

I also hope you went to the police. Who would be a teacher these days, eh?

I hope it all works out for you, @AnnoyedTeacherrrr

That's appalling.
Firstly, how long does it take to investigate?
We'd have got it done within 24 hours so the culprit would be in isolation the next day.
Secondly, to be told your witness statements weren't valid. Ridiculous. The first thing anyone would do, including HOY, would be to ask students to write down what they saw and heard.
It's quite normal to move on in Supply - you were good to give a week's notice. You didn't have to - it's the only benefit to the job.
Hard lesson learnt OP: photocopy emails/statements of altercations. I am still uncertain as to why it wasn't wrapped up - he didn't deny it, did he?

Just to say I'm so sorry about what you've been through with this.
Your old school didn't dispute the assault, they just didn't deal with it appropriately. The assault itself wasn't being investigated and just like all other inappropriate pupil behaviour has no place on your reference. Good grief.

Old school clearly angry that they have been caught out! I wouldn't be too tight lipped about this once you're settled in your new role. Treat staff like shit= don't deserve staff.

So glad the new school are being sensible. I'm sure it'll be resolved soon and you can enjoy your new permanent role :)

Good grief, @AnnoyedTeacherrrr , what a nightmare! Your new school are doing the right thing by following up on the reference. Hopefully they will realise very quickly what an awful and incompetent place the old school is. They are miffed for a reason: a proper investigation will make them look like fools!

If you really were at fault (which you clearly were not), they were in the wrong for not firing you on the spot and reporting you.

If you are telling the truth (which we know you are) they are awful at behaviour management and safeguarding staff.

In any case the only party who will come out of this looking like right idiots are the old school. Stay calm and trust the process.

emails are never entirely lost. Make a subject access request for the witness statements supporting you.

I honestly think schools should have CCTV in class.

PS my old Year 6 teacher made 4 x as much money tutoring after leaving teaching