Had enough with excuses for bad behaviour

[Ribenaberry12]

I work in a secondary school and have done for a long time (20 odd years). I currently work in a pastoral support role and part of my job is contacting parents to let them know when their child has been placed in detention/isolation. I reckon that, in the last term, 9/10 parents have argued with me and/or tried to excuse their child’s behaviour. Even when the situation is 100% clear cut - think caught vaping or heard swearing. I’m getting sick of it and thinking about jacking it in.

I’m a patient person, I’m good at my job and my school is really good - we have lots of support strategies that we offer but I’m just sick of the lack of accountability from parents. Honestly, some of the excuses I’ve been given are unbelievable.

I used to phone parents and they’d apologise for their kid’s behaviour and we’d work together to support them and we’d make sure it didn’t happen again. The bond you’d get with kids and their families when the kids turned it around was fantastic and it was great to see their successes. Now I cannot remember the last time a parent admitted that their kid was in the wrong and didn’t argue the toss - sometimes aggressively, sometimes pinging off countless emails at all hours of the day and night. Sometimes personally attacking staff who have pulled their kids up. It’s so time consuming and draining. I see the teachers and SLT so drained by it too. It’s never been this bad.

AIBU?
YABU - it’s your job, suck it up
YANBU - there’s a lack of accountability and it sucks

I hear you - but maybe those kids behave that way because they go home to parents who don't give a shit, don't set boundaries, don't care - often kids act up with people and in places they feel safe

I agree. No one seems to take responsibility for their own actions any more. It's always "someone else's fault" or there's some ridiculous reason why.

I don’t think many parents understand how damaging it is the long run for their kids to never take responsibility for their own actions.

Sounds awful OP.

Yep- there's been a big shift recently.
Kids just assume their parents will back them up, and they're usually right. Regardless of what has happened.
Happens on here all the time- teachers judgements being questioned.

I say yanbu but I did make an excuse for son the other day, got a mail to say he’d been late in and I said both times were our fault as late getting out of the house. They ignored it and I got a please talk to your son about his lateness back!

The parents get them back
when everyone else declines the pleasure of their company at work and in life, tho.

Yay. Justice prevails for once.

I have read a few similar threads recently about how difficult parents have become for teachers. What the F is going on? I can't imagine arguing if a teacher told me my son had misbehaved. Even if I thought the punishment is excessive I would accept it. I can't understand why this defensive thing had become the norm

Parents just don’t want to parent any more. The amount of times I have heard that they are my problem when they are at school and not theirs is mind boggling!

I would also accept any punishment they fished out - even if I thought it was unfair - they were promised a punishment and got one - that’s on them.

I want my kids to be respectful.

I also left teaching for the very same reasons - on spiteful girl could do no wrong!! Her mother was a nightmare. I wouldn’t go back.

What do you think has caused the change?

Yanbu. Though I think not taking responsibility for actions is becoming the norm at large to be honest. So many people would swear blind that red was yellow, so as not to have to admit they maybe in the wrong.

Thanks @Noicant The worst bit is I feel sorry for some of the kids sometimes as, most of the time, when you talk to them about what they have done, they know what the rules are and know they’ve ballsed up and are often apologetic and just want to get their consequence out of the way and get on with things but their parents are still banging on about it by phone and email sometimes weeks later. Oh, it’s exhausting!

I agree. I can’t think of a single thing that adults are expected to take responsibility for these days. It’s either the fault of the tories or their kids school.

@BingoWings85 Wish I knew!

There are several threads on here that confirm exactly what you are saying. The one that immediately springs to mind is the one where a year seven boy was disrupting a school play and given a day in isolation as his punishment. His mother felt it was too harsh as he had only been a bit silly and, furthermore, had been egged on by another boy. Most posters, including me, pointed out that her precious son had behaved very badly indeed and deserved his punishment and, if she worked with the school rather than against it, it would help him to take responsibility for his own actions and grow up. However, a few posters had some very “interesting” views. The most eye watering was the one who said that children and adults were equals, that teachers needed to earn their respect's and all that was needed was an apology! Another stated that we needed the free thinkers who didn’t obey the rules because they were our future artists and musicians. I have been a musician all my life and can assure this lady that conformity is very much part of the musical education and much self-discipline, hard work and acceptance of criticism is required. Then special needs are trotted out. I have two adult children at different ends of the autism spectrum. We made sure that they knew how to behave (although my daughter instinctively knew in any case). It is hard work. I realise ADHD can be be particularly difficult, but it means that parents have to work extra hard to make sure they behave appropriately. Of course there is a need for understanding but special needs cannot be an excuse for bad behaviour. When my children were teenagers, I was often told that I was “lucky” to have three well-behaved youngsters. There was no luck involved - they knew how to behave because we had put in the very hard work of parenting them. Unfortunately, many parents these days seem to abdicate their responsibility in this respect. You have my sympathies.

*respect not respect’s.

I have worked as a secondary school teacher for 20+ years. Covid has had an enormous impact, especially on the younger ones. Colleagues who work in different places say the same.

I think thats the point of the OP isnt it, that there are no boundaries because the parents are crap and make excuses and dont parent, so its pretty much a given the child doesnt have good parenting at home

It can sometimes be the case that children act out more with people they feel safe with but thats not usually the relationship with teachers, its more likely to be that way if the child comes into care. Sometimes children act the way they do because they are modelling behavour they see around them at home, its all they know, theres no 'acting out' in fact, its just how the whole family behave and interact with the world and they will repeat this with their own children

Not all bad behaviour is 'communication' as is said so often on here, sometimes its just bad behaviour because they can.

YANBU

I've told mine before they start secondary that any detentions dolled out will not be contested by myself or their father but if they have a genuine issue with something we would support them dealing with it maturely.
DS got a few in Yr 8 for talking in class, he tried to blame another boy who started it first but we weren't having that and made him take responsibility for choosing to take part and talk back.

You know which ones are going to have parents like this though from the start, they all seem to have an issue understanding the uniform code ( that they agreed to upon accepting the school place! ) on the parents group, they take no personal accountability and think the rules shouldn't apply to their children.

Completely dosagree with violinist64. You can impact a child somewhat, but they are their own person. Some will intentionally do stuff no matter how strict you are or how much you explain. Or sometimes they just dont realise.

Also in terms of schools having parents arguing, sometimes it will be because schools have things wrong (which seems to happen a lot more than when I was at school). Plus detentions are dished out much more easily.
Dc1 y7 one teacher has dc confused with another. Then another member of staff has also confused them. Luckily its not punishment, but dc has missed out on at least 2 'positives'. Then also dc moved classes and so was behind (which teacher would have known..) Got told off and told may have to move back -- when it was all due to a school error. Dc didnt seem to know when subject test would be and it wasnt shown on online system. And has set homework for a day they dont see the teacher.

I dont agree with isolation except for say swearing at teacher or violence etc. As the kid will just get behind and increase distruption.

Dc class are getting a lot of being sent to behaviour support and it seems to be escalating. The process doesnt seem to be being followed.

But i think setting for more subjects would have helped as there are kids getting 0% in with those getting 100%.

I think some high schools have taken it too far with the uniform policy, putting kids into isolation for minor infringements and not letting them go to the toilet etc. Some of the reasons for being put into isolation are ridiculous and I just dont agree with it as a punishment for anything but the worst behaviours. So I think from that point of view, relations between parents and staff are at an all time low.
I know my school never had to contact my parents over anything, because these harsh rules weren't in place when I was at school. So if they had received a call about me, it would have been taken seriously.

My son was recently suspended for 2 days for vaping cannabis and I was totally apologetic to the school. They just wanted to support him. I was happy for them to report him to the police as he needs to answer for his own actions. The parents of the other boy were happy to sweep it under the carpet and I was very shocked. Like if he never takes responsibility and is honest then he will be a monstrous adult. YANBU at all. I don't understand what goes through some parents heads.

You’re part of the problem, then.

I bee teachin nearly 30 years in a secondary school. I hear you op.

I must say, I don't remember the school ever calling my parents. But then, I was absolutely terrified of teachers, and would never talk back to them.

When the schools call me about my dc's behaviour, I always support the school and try to work with them to turn things around. I know that my dc's are no angels. Things have been a bit better lately behaviour wise touch wood, but I'm currently trying to kick my 15 year old up the arse to study for his GCSEs.

If they play up at school, get into fights, swear at the teachers, then yes they're going to have to face the consequences. I remember my ds crying to his dad (we're separated) because he'd been sent out for swearing at a teacher. His dad was going to go to the school and tell them they were out of order... He never went. I went to a meeting with the school and told them I supported them 100%, and it was absolutely unacceptable behaviour from my ds.

I tell the schools that I am happy to be contacted if anything goes on. I won't have it, it's completely unacceptable, and they can't go through life like that. They need to learn to solve their problems in appropriate ways, to be held responsible and accountable for their actions and self control. They need to face their consequences and make amends for the wrong they have done. They can't go through life swearing at people, being violent and disrespectful.

Kids will try to come out with all excuses. Everyone else was doing it.... Someone talked to me so I talked back....They made me angry ... Blah blah blah. It's always someone else's fault. I have to bring them back on track and say We're talking about you and your behaviour here. The rules still apply to you, even if (insert lame excuse here)...

I make mine say or write down I was wrong. Not even an apology. I'm sorry. Who cares? You don't mean it. You need to write it down I was wrong. Next time I will do this instead. Writing it down gives them a sense of completion.