Banging on the door of the Accessible Toilet

[HunterHearstHelmsley]

Why do people do this?!

I've just used the accessible toilet (I need to use the accessible toilet). I'd barely sat down and someone started banging on the door. I wasn't in there an unreasonable amount of time - probably about 30 seconds when the door banging started and 3 minutes overall. I was in there because I needed to be, banging on the door isn't going to make me quicker. If someone was taking the piss, it'd probably make them stay longer!

It's not the first time it's happened but it's so frustrating. It happened a few weeks ago also, that time was a woman wanting to use the baby change... the baby change wasn't even in the accessible loo!

It's really annoyed me this morning, it's not something I've noticed when using non-accesible toilets so I think it's just an accessible loo thing. But whyyyy?! I can't go faster 😩

Surely the point in this context is that if you can run in heels and you are using a parking space intended for someone who has mobility difficulties you should be selective in how you use your badge. On a good day when you can run in your four inchers, maybe leave the space for someone else. I have a fluctuating condition and on days when I can walk pain free and don’t have to use my chair, I park elsewhere. There are people for whom not finding a disabled space in a supermarket car park means they can’t do their shopping. It’s called consideration for others. Just because you have the badge doesn’t mean you should use it if and when you don’t need to.

Or possibly less piss takers using facilities not meant for them, if they know they will be challenged ?

That depends on the nature of the condition though.

ds generally doesn’t wear heels but on a good day can bounce out of the car and look fine. But that can change in an instant and he can have a flare of one of his conditions meaning he is in pain/struggling to breathe/at risk of unconsciousness or in a massive meltdown over something. He needs to be able to get to the car quickly hence having a blue badge.

now we could use his wheelchair every trip but when we don’t need it we don’t and shouldn’t have to to avoid other people thinking they are experts!

But people self governing spaces and facilities invariably will catch plenty of people with a genuine need in the cross fire and its horrible to feel like you have to justify yourself to someone. In honesty do you really think someone who thinks it's fine to use facilities when they don't need them because they're selfish is going to listen to someone taking it upon themselves to challenge them? No. But it could well really affect someone else.

I presume your DS doesn't drive though. I wouldn't assume that a person that is being driven has no need of a disabled space even if they bounce out of the car and run to the shop as there are obviously many conditions that don't prevent running but still require a blue badge. However, I can't think of any condition whereby the person can drive and run and also needs to park in a disabled space..

Exactly. I only use disabled parking if I need it too.

I don’t know how many times people need to be told to use common sense… in the (statistically unlikely) event that you don’t have any disabled staff then obviously you use both toilets.

In the event that a single member of staff is disabled- then continue using both since there are only a few of you, but just don’t be a dick about it! You know, maybe just give the disabled member of staff first dibs on the only toilet they can actually use.

I really don’t understand why so many people feel the need to pop up with “but what about?!” gotcha! Comments- do you genuinely think that disabled people are greedy toilet horders that are just revelling in having something you don’t like three year olds with a new doll?

We aren’t, we just want to be able to take a piss like everyone else. You really don’t loose anything by trying your best to keep accessible toilets free for disabled people when at all practicable.

Just because you can’t think of a condition doesn’t mean it doesn’t exisit. That’s why people with more understanding of the individual decide who should and shouldn’t have a blue badge.

in the whole they are a battle to get in the first place

I agree. I think it’s really difficult and I’ve experienced both sides of the coin so to speak. I’m old school, as you may have gathered by some of my posts and replies - been disabled since birth with a degenerative condition, and am now in my early sixties. When I was younger I could walk fairly well but have bladder and bowel problems which necessitated the use of the then ‘disabled’ toilets. I’ve been challenged numerous times over the years and have come to the conclusion that if you ignore the arseholes who just want to be nosy and demand you give every detail of your condition, most people are only looking out for others by challenging and are mostly reasonable - many people if not disabled themselves have told me that they have disabled relatives and have seen them struggle because they couldn’t access the facilities, so I think you have to look at the reasoning.

I don’t get challenged so much these days because I’m mostly in a wheelchair, but I do get it that when you’re desperate and don’t have much control, finding the accessible loo occupied by someone who doesn’t seem to have much need for it is frustrating. But hidden disability exists, so it’s difficult to tell who is in need and who is just selfish. I have able bodied friends who will openly tell me they will always use the ‘disabled’ loo because the facilities are so much more convenient - more room, hand basin next to the loo, hand drier etc. it’s completely lost on them that those facilities are not meant for them.

I think challenging someone who doesn’t look disabled is not ideal, but as disabled people we all know facilities like accessible toilets and blue badge spaces are widely abused, but as disabled people we don’t want to unnecessarily cause anyone else distress. So other than challenging respectfully and with the experience that comes from being disabled ourselves, I don’t think there is an easy solution.

What I do agree with though, is the post upthread which suggests that just because you have legitimate eligibility for something, it doesn’t mean that you should use it if you don’t need to. I’m another who has had a blue badge for years - old enough to remember when it was the orange badge !! On my good days I wouldn’t use it. Similarly accessible toilets. Maybe if we all self regulate as a starting point and examine our own behaviour with regard to entitlement for entitlement’s sake, that would help, and maybe if/when we are challenged try to remember that it’s probably not a personal slight against you, but someone just trying to ensure these facilities are better targeted . Beyond that I don’t know what the answer is.

I find this so arrogant and ignorant.
I came out of a disabled toilet with my daughter, someone passed a comment about us not ‘looking disabled’….

I always wonder how society got so ignorant to disabilities.

For example colostomy bags are so small these day that you can hide one under a skin tight dress and no one would know…but you need the bigger cubicle in order to manoeuvre, I had a friend have one at 17 for a whole year… it’s awful to think people would bang on the door or shout at her when she left, she went through so much!

My daughter has an invisible disability, we do usually use the normal toilets, but if the queue is ginormous and she’s desperate then we occasionally nip in the accessible one as it is simply safer for not to wait in line… but she hates queue jumping etc because of comments made in the past, which I find extremely sad.

I agree. There’s actually another thread on here about PIP (Personal Independence Payment) and some of the comments actually suggest that the Motability scheme should be abolished because if you can drive, you’re not really disabled !! But I do think, as others have suggested, that if you have a variable condition and are able to park elsewhere on good days then you should. And on the question of being able to run, thinking about it, I think people need to remember that blue badges are not just awarded for mobility issues - they can be in respect of heart conditions, incontinence and other issues unrelated to mobility.

This. Well said.

Blue badges aren’t just awarded in respect of mobility issues though. They can be for anything from a serious heart condition to having a stoma and urgency/incontinence issues. So being able to run doesn’t necessarily mean you’re not disabled - you may be rushing for the loo before you have an accident or something similar.

Agree so much with @Bigstones I can honestly say I never recall once in my life when I was so put out because I didn't use the disabled toilet. The attitude of people towards disabled people is truly disgusting

I always wonder how society got so ignorant to disabilities.

Me too. I’m early sixties and in the ‘old days’ most disability benefits were awarded for disabilities that were clearly evident. Disabled loo usage and blue badges were the same. The assumption was that if you couldn’t see it, it wasn’t there. Thankfully we’ve mostly moved on from that, but there are still those who will jump to that conclusion. I think as a society we’ve become a lot more inclusive of disabled people but there’s still a way to go if some of the comments here are anything to go by and translate into the general population beyond MN.

The key I think is always keeping in mind what we can see of someone is only a tiny picture of their reality.

Larger toilet cubicles which are within blocks of standard male/female toilets, are not actually for the exclusive use of disabled people - they can be used by anyone who needs a bit more space. Mums with pushchairs, etc. The stand alone unisex accessible toilets however are not. They are intended exclusively for the use of disabled people and their carers. They are not meant to deal with keeping the queues for the standard toilets down, they are there for the convenience of people who have difficulty using standard toilets and in many cases they are the only facilities some disabled people can use.

Biology isn't your strong point is it?

Someone with a serious heart condition probably wouldn't be driving and running. I'm pretty sure urge or continence issues alone wouldn't make someone eligible for a blue badge (although obviously it is a reason for using disabled toilets) where I live.

I agree, clearly not. Horribly ignorant and ableist comment. Spinal injury is a common reason for people to be confined to a wheelchair, and it can affect bodily function in a range of ways - sometimes very severely and causing issues from urgency, to complete bowel/bladder incontinence and involuntary voiding. Many wheelchair users have stomas for this reason, or have to use catheterisation to control bladder. It’s not just wheelchair users either - many disabilities have bowel and bladder incontinence/urgency in common. I don’t think this poster understands that for some people if they can’t find an available accessible toilet they’re going to have a very public and very embarrassing accident. That’s one of the reasons we have accessible toilets and why the unisex stand alone accessible toilets should always be left free for the sole use of disabled people.

I think they were just examples of disability not directly linked to mobility. But in my own experience blue badges absolutely are issued for continence issues alone. Stoma patients and those with incontinence/severe urgency issues can access the blue badge scheme without any other disability or mobility issue if their condition is severe enough to cause involuntary voiding or they have an unstable and difficult to manage stoma.

According to this, a stoma alone would not normally entitle you to a blue badge. People with one have probably got additional health issues that mean they are entitled to one. https://iasupport.org/information-support/faqs/

The most eye opning thing is that if 24% of people have some sort of disability why on earth have we got such poor toilet provision in general. I dont see a quater of toilets being accessible toilets.

Accessible toilets are supposed to make everyone's life easier. There's no point in leaving it empty if there's a queue for normal stalls and no one needs it.
I used to use one if I needed to during a heavy period, because I needed a sink inside the cubicle. That's completely reasonable, I think.

People with urinary urgency or IBS might need to use one, even though they don't have a disability.
Some people with small children need the space. Pregnant women might need it.

The toilet is accessible to make life easier for people with additional needs.

Absolutely so