Do you think the new £38K income visa threshold for UK spouse visas is fair?

[zendeveloper]

It is set at the same level as for work visas.

Feels completely crazy to me, but then, I am also an immigrant (although the changes don't affect me), so probably too sensitive to the topic. Would be interesting to hear MN opinion.

So how could it have been avoided in the first place

This is a great summary. EEA migrants were huge net contributors to the British economy.

There is a lot of ignorance and covert/direct racism on MN and society in general. These kinds of threads bring it out.

I wonder how many of the supporters are net contributors themselves. Well I can guess.

I don’t think it’s too much to expect a much-needed care worker to be able to live with their spouse, whatever their income. It’s basic humanity.

Will this policy lead to the government increasing the salaries for care staff, nurses and teachers? I doubt it.

Or the immigration levels are actually okay and what we have is chronic under-investment in affordable housing and services because money is spent on the most ridiculous things and not the things we need?

I don't think they are.

Too much housing being built everywhere I look

Roads are too busy.

The affordable housing is a myth

In what parallel universe is a net migration figure of 672,000 in one year considered an OK level?

And @nonmerci99 , for what it's worth... I have gone back and read my previous comments and yes I do agree with you that some of it could be seen as misleading. I think I was just trying to simplify the citizenship process for people on this thread (let's be honest, 99% of people have no idea what we are talking about when we mention things like ILR, FLR(M), IHR etc), so I was just trying to explain the pathway (after 5 years, you can get citizenship).

I didn't purposely skip over the step of naturalisation! I was just trying to explain it in a simple way. So I apologise!

There is a lot of ignorance and covert/direct racism on MN and society in general. These kinds of threads bring it out.

I am not sure that's fair. If people's genuine concerns were addressed and they were not referred to as 'racists' debate would be more free flowing.

As it is that's not the case then at election time we have a Tory swing as people feel they are the only party who listens to them.

And that's as a Labour supporter.

If something is "much needed" it needs to be paid properly, not staffed by people desperate to escape poverty in their own country, the EU was also all about suppressing wages (Freedom of Movement was the "sweetener" for non-critical thinkers)

Do the health and social care industries have the budget to pay more though?

"I am not sure that's fair. If people's genuine concerns were addressed and they were not referred to as 'racists' debate would be more free flowing"

People dont care any more, Cancel Culture/Woke/Whatever you say I dont like is "racist" - is over, the Tories know this, they are learning the Brexit lesson (look at BJ`s majority FFS?) and are now fully playing to the gallery on the side of the house where all their votes are going to come from, the guy bought Twitter and renamed it "X" FFS, how more plain does it need to be - Cancel culture is cancelled!

The government and taxpayer do yes, the government has printed it`s way through the banking crisis (15 years of artificially suppressed interest rates!) and Covid, they can make minimum for a care worker in a basic care job £16 per hour any time they want IMO, the care agencies manage to pay that and more just by exploiting legal requirements like minimum staffing levels etc.

I don’t see people holding back from ‘debate’ really. It all seems to flow pretty well. I think it’s important to realise when prejudice plays a part in people’s opinions, don’t you?

Well why aren't they starting with that then?

Because they dont want the "little people" getting 20 quid an hour to push a wheelchair round a care home garden, they might go part-time, or even save a little, or be able to pay off their mortgage debt! The whole game is rigged to keep the majority on the Hamster Wheel, paying debt for as long as possible. The Covid money hose was a one off, that was to prevent mass debt default during a crisis (which would have hurt the big players) they dont want decent money to the masses becoming a habit (although they couldnt prevent the commercial property meltdown which has now started to bankrupt some councils as well as big landlords)

Fair enough! I just bristled a bit at the original post since I am not a citizen and with 3 kids, I don’t know when I’ll feel the £1,000+ fee isn’t a bit of a luxury.

So migrants suppressing wages is the issue? But cutting net migration won't solve it because they won't actually pay more? So what exactly is the point in these new restrictions? Or is it just less forinerrs?

Yeah I obviously didn't mean to downplay anyone's individual circumstances. I am just aware we are on Mumsnet, not an immigration forum, so the majority of people won't know anything about the complicated process, hence the need to simplify it.

On the flipside, I hope you are able to apply for it soon. And I agree it is a luxury and imo, an unnecessary extra expense after all the hoops we jump through.

The point?

Its basically electioneering of the worst kind.

It doesn't solve the problem at all (in fact it will make it worse), but the Tories will keep mentioning how nasty they are about immigrants and how much they are doing to cut net migration to chase headlines.

Thats all this "anouncement" is.

They will pay more if forced by the courts (see the recent court cases on sleepover rates, where someone would now be getting paid a hundred quid to sleep in a bed at their work in case they are needed - but it seems from a quick search that the original ruling is being challenged and maybe rolled back?) and they will if people just dont take the jobs (minimum wage for near zero stress/responsibility in a shop or something approaching £12 p.h is going to be more appealing to some people than an 8 hour shift with 6 people with dementia or learning disabilities? A recession will muddy the waters though because the shop job wont be there any more while the care job still will be, I am hearing a lot recently that supermarkets/grocery chains are cutting staff ( 2 now on the floor instead of 4 etc.) and not re-employing for retirement etc. that is ominous for the economy TBH.

So, my original question, if they can force a pay increase, why aren't they starting with that? DM headlines is why.

Indeed.

Apparently 60% of the population earn under 38k, so you’ll need to set up family with someone here or stay single. Only alternative is having a spare £63k floating around in your bank account 😳.

One argument against bothering with citizenship is how lightly this government have stripped their citizens of citizenship.

"Over 1,000 citizenship deprivation orders were made from 2010 to 2022."

As we know from the well-publicised Shamima Begum case, this includes people who were born and raised here, so I don't see why they wouldn't strip me of mine if it were convenient to them. They have no regard for human rights law or wider international law-- and seem to be proud of the fact.

Speaking of... do we all think they will try to raise the £££ for the savings route as well? If they use the same calculations for the current £62,500 threshold, that would make it like £100k+ right?

I’m guessing they were in so much haste to make this sensational announcement, someone missed the saving element of the coin (thankfully).

Or maybe they’ve gambled on the fact that most people also do not have that much in savings, so it’s just as unlikely they will be able to bring their spouses in.

Financial resilience is at an all time low, so they can take advantage of that 🤦🏾‍♀️.