To wonder how anyone can be a teacher?

[Howdaretheydisciplinerudekids]

I think I am quite an understanding parent when it comes to my kids schools. However, I do contact the schools whenever I have a concern. I am always polite and understanding of school issues but flag things up when necessary.

However, I hear how some parents speak to and about their children’s teachers and I am pretty disgusted and wonder how anyone remains in teaching. I have so many stories from friends about the crap they put up with from headteachers, parents and children. Who else has similar stories?

1. A friend of mine was told on more than one occasion by a child that he wanted her dead and was going to shoot her. Her headteacher didn’t even ask if she was ok.
2. The same child regularly used to throw things in the classroom and trash the classroom. The headteacher refused to get involved and instead blamed the teacher for their being equipment on the floor (that the child had thrown) and asked why she hadn’t picked it up. The child was still throwing things (this time aimed at the class teacher) at the time.
3. I have heard many occasions of friends who have been out on capability plans for the most minor things. It would seem that bullying of staff from leadership is absolutely rife. For example, one teacher friend told me about the staff having a staff training day about a certain way of delivering maths. Part of the day was spent then planning maths in the said way. The headteacher went into maths lessons and then called all of the staff together because she didn’t like how they were teaching maths and told them all off. She said they should have ignored all training. Several friends have given me the same sort of stories.
4. My teacher friends are always making excuses why they can’t go out. They have too much work to do. They are too stressed. They are off sick. They have marking to do, leSsons to plan, forms to fill in, statements to write, parents to contact, documents to complete, emails to send etc etc. Then when they have done all that, they have to actually teach a class for 7 hours. They get no let up in that time. They have to be physically and mentally involved and face verbal and sometimes physical abuse, with no chance to recover.
5. Then they have parents to deal with. Parents who complain constantly because their child has been told off. Parents who constantly criticise teachers because their child, who has done something wrong, is then worrying about it. Or they have 2 sets of parents both claiming that their child is being bullied by the other. Or parents who have fallen out, expecting the schools to separate the children because their grown ups can’t resolve their own arguments.
6. One relative of mine, was put under disciplinary procedures because they dared to speak sternly to a child who had been stealing from them. They did not even raise their voice. However, they now have a safeguarding concern about them because a member of staff heard them telling the child how upset they were to have had their personal items stolen by them, and the member of staff didn’t like their tone of voice. My poor relative was in bits over this accusation because they had taught for nearly 30 years and now felt like they had been blamed for being a victim of crime. My relative had to take early retirement.
7. Another relative was teaching In A primary school and was filmed by a child on their phone, and it was shared around social media. My relative then told the child how upset they had been about this. However, instead of the child receiving any sort of consequence, instead my friend had to apologise to the child, for telling the child how upset they were. Sadly, another friend tried to commit suicide after all of the constant monitoring and accountability became too much for her. My friends and relatives who work in schools tell me about the lack of funding in their schools.

Just after covid I decided to move schools (primary) and had to wait until Summer because there were next to no vacancies for Jan or Easter starts other than the odd temp mat cover.

Looking now, 136 primary vacancies within a 10 mile radius desperate for immediate start or Jan start.

I honestly believe state education is going to collapse within the next 2-3 years.

I work in a support role in a typical high school. It is awful, you couldn't pay me enough to be a teacher. Yet I seriously considered it at one point and thought going into a support role in my subject would give me a good incite as to what it would be like.

It certainly has given me good incite and totally clear that there is no way I will do my teacher training. The kids are so disrespectful and parents often unsupportive. The level pastoral issues schools have to deal with is ridiculous.

The kids break things and don't care and we don't have the budget to replace some equipment. The number of laptops that get damaged and broken is ridiculous. The conversations I've heard teachers having to have with parents is truly terrible. When a parent is supportive of a teachers actions we tend to find out as the teachers are pleasantly surprised by the support.

Yet some of the kids are actually lovely.

I agree. I’ve been shocked by the posts in my local mums Facebook group. ‘Please help teacher is harassing my child by telling them off when they throw their books/chair’ type thing. Cue many outraged responses about reporting the teacher to OFSTED or letting the child stay home rather than go into school. It’s utter madness.

I am dreading the current school lot turning into adults, I can’t even imagine how shambolic the workplace will be, if they turn up at all

I taught for fifteen years in secondary schools. Took a tentative step out of it, thinking I could go back if I wanted to. That was four years ago. I’ve never looked back. I get so much praise and recognition for my work now and it’s a fraction of what I was doing as a teacher. It’s a totally different world. The stress, the abuse from kids and parents, the constant monitoring, the feeling of never having done enough, everyone living in fear of inspections and walk rounds. I didn’t realise how totally wrong it all was. Now I can create a to do list and actually tick it all off in a working day! Who knew you could get so much peace from that. A friend of mine has been teaching 25 years. She is hands down the best teacher I’ve ever seen. She’s patient, she’s knowledgeable, she’s creative, she has a wealth of teaching skills and I spoke to her the other day and she’s totally burnt out and wants to leave. It’s a damn shame that someone like that will be lost from the teaching profession

"TAs are leaving to work in supermarkets because the pay is better and in exchange for dealing with difficult kids, they get awkward adults but cheaper groceries. I don't blame them in the slightest. Buildings are falling down or as in my school, parts are shut down due to RAAC but thanks to our "fucking awesome" Secretary of State, nothing has been done about it, so we are hemmed in to every available space. Kids who struggle with noise suffer."

This time x10, we have so many classrooms closed due to RAAC and the kids are squashed into the rest of the school as we are still waiting on the completion of our temporary classrooms since the start off September. So many kids are going to be affected by this and yet the DofE doesn't want too give any concessions for them. It's also making behaviour worse and more difficult to control.

Actually our SLT have been as supportive as possible but we are at the mercy of DofE in sorting it all out.

Yes there are plenty of horror stories around, but I don't think it's helpful to suggest that all state schools are awful.

My daughter is in her second year of teaching at a state secondary and absolutely loves it. She is working long hours, but it's manageable, and she's hoping that next year she won't have to spend so much time lesson planning.

She rarely has problems with behaviour. She exclusively teachers sixth formers which no doubt gives her a different perspective, as all her students have chosen to study her subject, but she sometimes has to cover younger classes and she tells me that on the whole behaviour is good in those too (not perfect, but nothing she can't manage)

There are some children, including some she teaches, with difficult/chaotic lives, but in her (admittedly limited) experience, parents are supportive and appreciative and so are SLT.

Why on Earth are children and teens so violent now? Frightening thinking about them being adults

I'm fortunate to work in a school with very supportive colleagues and caring management. Even so, I would not be a class teacher because of the time demands. I notice there are no mothers of primary aged or younger children working fulltime in my school, although there are some fathers of small children ( with partners who pick up the slack) . Most of the teachers are quite young, ( and therefore energetic)and some of them still live at home with their own parents providing support and running the house. Even so, they don't go out in the week.
Sadly, I've come across more adult bullying in schools than anywhere else I've worked, I was really shocked when I first started working in education, I'd never come cross it before.

I work in a primary school and the disrespectful behaviour has definitely got worse since covid. The class I have at the moment think they can do as they please with no repercussions. They often say they will tell their mum if you reprimand them. As it happens I am not bothered by such threats and tell them to go right ahead as I would welcome a chat about their behaviour with their parents. I haven’t yet had any parents complain about me but know that other members of staff have. Parents will openly defend their child and try and justify poor behaviour even when faced with evidence (cctv in some cases). There are limited consequences that a school can give out for poor behaviour and those we can use the children are not that bothered about anyway or will get mum and dad on the case as above. It is virtually impossible to exclude a child now as it is always seen as a failure of the school and its policies.

YANBU

I spent 8 years as a TA and SEN 1:1

By 1 or 2 years in i was damn sure i'd never want to be a teacher and had my eyes opened for how demanding the job was.

By the end i couldn't even hack being a TA any more!

There must be some terribly run schools! I plan all the English and reading from scratch, and several foundation subjects, in a two from entry school. I teach year 6, so it’s very fast-paced and busy. I work 8am - 4pm. I don’t understand what people are doing to start work at 4am, but my goodness, that is an incredibly unreasonable expectation from your HT, and you need to go the Union asap.

Because most behaviour problems are genetic and therefore will become more prevalent in each successive generation.

Because many kids, especially boys, with adhd are in the worst possible environment for them in schools. They need to be out doing. Historically they might have left school as early as possible, now they are stuck there until they are 18, often with very little achievement throughout secondary. Worse we tell them how shit they are in virtually every lesson they go to, even if they aren't told they know because they cant do it.

Because 90% of what they learn is utter rubbish and completely unnecessary fof the work place

Oh and weed. Weed is a disaster yet still I hear otherwise sensible people saying it is harmless

What is frustrating is that it could be so different. We have children with needs that need to be met but we have to spend so much time writing about what we are going to do in our plans that we actually run out of time to fully prepare for the actual learning. We also have to change all our planning when the next 'new' teaching idea comes in which seems like every 5 minutes!

The curriculum needs urgent review. It was written in 2014 and we live in a different world now.

I still love actual teaching but not all the rest that drags me down and takes up all of my time. I'm not sure I can do another 20 years of this but it's all I have known and ever wanted to do.

You’ve just described my life pretty accurately, OP. I’ve been teaching 25 years. I used to love my job but it’s unmanageable and a thankless task. I’m looking into exit routes.

I enjoyed teaching for nearly 30 years (primary) and felt supported dealing with difficult children or parents but then a change of Headteacher and move to Academy status changed everything. Fortunately I was near enough to 60 to escape.

Because most behaviour problems are genetic and therefore will become more prevalent in each successive generation.

Would you mind elaborating on this for me please?

Tbh I don’t know either- my sons come home telling me of kids being thrown out of class for horrendous stuff- throwing things, smashing stuff, in things like woodwork and home ec things are set on fire etc etc. The worst thing is these things aren’t one off, they’re regular, kids telling teachers to eff off, shut up, that they’re going to get their parents in- and this is a school that wouldn’t be seen to have a bad reputation

Because most behaviour problems are genetic and therefore will become more prevalent in each successive generation.

Do you mean inherited ND? Because it’s not that they all have behaviour problems. It is that they are not educated in the right environment, and are expected to conform to being in a NT school. And can’t. And why should they?

There should be enough schools for HF ND. These are the ones that are let down by the current system. Not severe enough for special ed, but can’t cope with a NT environment.

So whilst genetics may be at play, it’s the shit system that’s causing the problems.

It's pretty shit. I could never teach in mainstream education again. You get far more autonomy and appreciation in special Ed.

@Elendel utter shite that parents who can afford to pay “care more” 🙄. It’s that smug superior attitude that means my kids are at a state school. Vile. Money doesn’t make you caring - fuck me no wonder this country is so fucked.

@WhyMeWhyNowWhyNot money doesn't make you care more but it does give schools more clout to deal with bad behaviour. There has been an expulsion in DDs (Yr 7) private school due to persistant disruptive behaviour over the last half term. No discussion, straight to expulsion. If state schools had the same options then I bet behaviour would dramatically improve but the issue is that there is nowhere to send constantly disruptive kids in the state sector. Ultimately it always comes down to the fact that the state sector is woefully underfunded and under-resourced.

Couldn't agree more.

But you can also see severity increase generation to generation. Or it could be that actually everything from the table layouts to the lights to tic tock conspire against kids these days.

I ask myself this on a daily basis. Used to love my job as a secondary teacher but it's a completely different ball game now. Kids with a reading age of 5, violent and aggressive children, children with significant ASN, all shoved in a class of 30 with no support yet I am asked to meet all their needs and have innovative learning and teaching strategies. Impossible task.

I’ve recently had a training session and agree the majority of it was about behavioural management. I think the number one problem is parents not having enough time to parent. Two parents out of the home, often in jobs that require long hours. Child care is farmed out or else screens are nannying the kids. It really isn’t too surprising we have so many children unwilling or unable to follow a school structure.