To think it is not possible to understand what it's like to have children unless you have them

[Goldenray]

I am in the process of separating from my husband. It is fairly amicable thank goodness.

Our two dc both have SN. Our ds did not sleep through the night until he was 6 years old. I was up with him every night and usually got between 1 - 3 hours sleep. After which he needed so much attention/ guidance and help. He was diagnosed on the autistic spectrum at the age of 4. I spent a lot of time and energy on getting his EHCP and he now has his EHCP and is in a specialist school.

My other dc has SN, suspected ADHD, and has needed a lot of time/ attention/ energy.

When my ds was a baby, I asked my dh if he could organise his work days so I could go back to work. He refused, saying it wasn't possible. I begged him to do so, as I was really struggling being at home full time. He said that he couldn't cope with sharing the child care and being up at night and also working (I was proposing that we both shared work and child care). I was upset, but gave in, and became a SAHM for 10 years.

Now I'm working but not earning as much as my DH by any means. We are now separating.

Speaking to friends, I have three who have all said "You're lucky he's sharing his money with you" "You're lucky he's sharing his pension" and once when I went out for a meal with her when the children were young "Who's paying for this - your DH?"

The three I have mentioned above do not have children. The ones I have spoken to about me and DH separating, who do have children - the subject of money does not seem to come up. I feel upset and angry and like the friends who don't have dc think I am taking advantage of my DH somehow - but how can I explain the situation? Unless you have DC with special needs, a stubborn DH who won't compromise, no family help and no extra money to pay for help - how can anyone understand what it was like. I get the feeling that they think I was relaxing at home whilst poor dh was slogging away at work.

Sorry, I didn't mean that. I didn't mean at all that everyone without children lack empathy and are judgmental.

YABVU to endorse a stupid stereotype that people without kids by default have no empathy. Seriously offensive.

Your friends are just arseholes, but not because they don't have kids.

This.

Based on my own experience, when you become a parent, you’re pretty much exactly the same person you always were, just with a child.

I get what you mean OP. I'm not going to analyse your words or phrasing as that's been pointed out. Until you have a child hanging off you and had your nerves tested passed the brink then it is really hard to truely understand what being a parent is like.

I'd distance myself from those people.

@Oxomoco I know. That's why I said most people try to understand/empathise with their friend's situations whatever they are, whether they involve children or not.

once when I went out for a meal with her when the children were young "Who's paying for this - your DH?

So nothing to do with having kids then. Just an obnoxious question about your finances. All of your examples are about finances.

I'm childless and there's no way I'd make comments like that - nor would anybody I know.

Are your friends British OP?

Because I'm foreign (from the continent) and in my country and the neighbouring countries we don't have the concept of SAHM. (Nor did my mother's or grandmothers' generations.) So not working for women would be seen similarly to how it would be seen for men.

(Of course to support this there's state provided childcare from a very early stage.)

Similarly as regards SEN these are approached differently - I think the approach in France might be the one that is known about somewhat in Britain, as an example. (In short it's a more traditional approach.)

I’ve a damn good idea what it’s like to have children. Which is exactly why I don’t have them.

Totally agree OP. I have a female relative who never managed to have children but has a real bee in her bonnet "just because I'm not a mum it doesn't mean I don't know what it's like to have children".

I try not to argue it out with her when she's had a full night sleep and works a few hours a day and spends the rest pottering on her own and watching TV in her perfectly clean and tidy house.

I know the op has already said she didn't mean that people who do not have children are all judgemental and lack empathy but I'm sure this response about a childless woman will cement that for the op and I'm honestly so sorry for any childless women on here who read that post.

Your friends in this instance are just rude. I’m sorry they have responded like that.

I do agree that if you don’t have children you can’t know what it’s like. Same as I can’t know what it’s like to want children and not be able to have them, or to not have children at all. But I have plenty of friends without kids who can empathise and care about situations that involve them.

your friends have just been shitty. Are they usually like that?

Wow. And it’s childless women that supposedly lack empathy?

Only arseholes would judge you op.

I don't think OP is saying ALL people without kids. Why chose to take huge offence unnecessarily? Sounds exhausting for you.

Its your friends. That's not a normal reaction from them. You sound like you're doing great, don't worry about what they think.

Her title says exactly that: “it’s not possible . . .”, i.e. no one without kids can.

I don’t think it has much to do with not knowing what it’s like to be a parent. It’s simply that they’re not very nice people and are definitely not your friends.

My friends that don’t have kids aren’t like this, just like my friends that do have kids aren’t. They’re nice people, they support me.

Remove these nasty bastards from your life, no one needs people like that, especially people that disguise themselves as your ‘friends’.

I don't think all (many I've met if I'm being honest) non parents get it.
I came into the work the other day, my colleagues had no idea I had dragged my ASD dc to school without shoes on as she refused them all, spent 1/2 hour deescalating her, been punched, kicked, verbally abused before wishing her a good day as she was manhandled into the school building. They don't see all that.
So when I get little comments about not being as well turned out, or not going to the gym or not eating breakfast, it stings. They just have no idea. A lot of them say they want to be parents but have no idea about the actual reality. They say stuff about one of them will get up at 5am and go to the gym, then go home and relieve their partner who will then go to the gym at 6.30, all because they don't want to 'let themselves go' and they want to 'prioritise their relationship and stay attractive for each other' which is obviously where all of us single parents went wrong. Its all idealistic bollocks based on Instagram. I don't tell them that.
Another thing is some of the views on making a relationship work and 'happiness' which I disagree with. My friends bloke left her at 6 months postpartum. She was in treatment for PND. Some of his childfree friends (who were women!) said that he had the right to be happy and she was cutting him off from his friends (by saying things like please don't go out every Friday and Saturday night as I haven't slept in days). They couldn't comprehend that now was not the time to leave the relationship. That it actually isn't controlling to say that a father shouldn't spend all of his time at work and socialising. That 'I'm not happy' is just not an excuse to walk out when you have a young baby and are mentally unwell due to that baby, which both of you agreed to have.

They don't sound very close if they're not actually aware of what a normal day would be like for you, then they're not really showing an interest in you are they. They do sound like shit friends.

Your friends are awful, they literally have no idea about how families with children function/don’t function. They are utterly ignorant, I think most childless women would have the imagination to understand your position. I would have completely had your back on this before I had my DC 100%.