To ask what the country was like under a Labour government?

[user6776]

I'm too young to remember a proper Labour government. I was 12 when the Tories got voted in back in 2010 so that's all I've ever really known.

How much better was it than it is now? Why did Labour lose the election back then anyway?

Interested to hear people's opinions.

Doubtless but she was elected with a majority of 12000 and was more than welcomed into the Tory party, so what does that say?

Why shouldn't the views of Dover be represented within the Labour party?

Bit snobish to dismiss them.

I hadn’t heard of her but the reason she gave ‘they didn’t stop the boats’ and then going to Labour made me laugh

Labour have no chance up against billion dollar, financed and marketed trafficking networks with their ‘smash the gangs’ - and yet Labour it was.

Well if you're in one of the circa 39% of seats unlikely to change party, it won't matter much, so you can stop worrying.

We really need a proper electoral system.

https://www.electoral-reform.org.uk/the-non-battleground-election-millions-of-voters-are-ignored/

Labour have much more of a coherent strategy than the Tories current plans like -
Stack them all up in hotels and make them wait years
Send a tiny number to Rwanda (possibly) at massive expense
Get into rows with our neighbours to appear tough instead of negotiating

None of that is exactly smashing the gangs either.

No one can abolish trafficking networks, not unless international law changes

What can be done is re routing people, hence Ireland’s reaction to increased border crossings.

Or make it too hard as Aus does

Trafficking networks will still exist they’ll just market and sell other routes instead

In your opinion what is it that Labour will do that will work?

I’m saying Labour claim to have higher standards, and accepting Natalie Elphicke undermines this.

The OP’s question was ‘what was it like under a Labour government’ and according to some posters, it was all just brilliant- we all had money and the country skipped about holding hands saying ‘after you’. I’m saying, it absolutely wasn’t and the wealthy got wealthier.

I think as inflation rose and as the BofE is being led by an inept Governor (the very chap who did an absolutely shite job at the FCA and whose hiring will go down as a massive mistake for the Government) who hasn’t pulled all of the levers he could to change the economic course… the only thing left for the government to do as a way of putting money back into the pockets of workers was to cut NI. Are the issues in social services solely down to the NI cuts? No - but obviously there is less to go around. The issues regarding SS (if you have ever had cause to use them) run far deeper and not all of the issues are down to money.

Snobbish Like Lady Emily Thornberry you mean? Sneering at white van man and anyone flying a St George’s cross in Kent?

i Don’t think either side covers themselves in glory tbh.

I’m saying Labour claim to have higher standards, and accepting Natalie Elphicke undermines this.

Labour are held to higher standards which isn’t quite the same thing. Compare the fuss the Tories are making about the £1500 capital gains tax Angela Rayner might not have paid and their apparent indifference to the £4 million Zahawi failed to pay when he sold YouGov.

Nope. Both are being held to the same standard. The sums of monies involved are irrelevant, both of them have acted inappropriately.

The case against Angela Rayner has yet to be proved. You do understand the concept of innocent until proved guilty, don’t you?

Indeed I do. Do I personally think AR has acted appropriately? No I do not. Do I think the same of Zahawi? Yes.

Do I personally think AR has acted appropriately? No I do not

On what evidence? HMRC seems to be struggling to find any, perhaps you have some and could help them out?

I remember being elated when Labour came in and thoroughly deflated by the time they left. I suspect it depends on your demographic as to how much it benefited you or didn't but I certainly don't see them as a golden ticket or the answer to all the country's problems.

For me, my biggest gripes were tuition fees, the call for everyone to go to university (it isn't practical, desirable or necessary) and tax credits which had such a negative impact on salaries paid and types of contract and has led to people being trapped on 'top-up' benefits. They also began the privatisation of the NHS that the Conservatives are always accused of doing.

That said, the Conservatives have some truly awful policies at the moment and I don't doubt we'll see Keir Starmer in no.10. I just don't think it's going to be the positive change so many Mumsnetters seem to think it will.

It's beyond ridiculous to assert that the tax affairs of Zahawi and Rayner have any sort of equivalence. It's like trying to say a person doing 32 mph in a 30 has behaved identically to someone doing 110 in the same place.

My mum was forced to home Ed under Labour due to school system.
i was forced to home Ed under the conservatives for the same reason.

I said it was (Labour's) a more coherent strategy. In the end, as you say, if there is to be progress on the boats, it's going to take a lot more than just UK action. The current government is doing precisely nothing though - the idea Rwanda will have any effect is nuts - if the boat crossers are indeed just the product of a billion dollar criminal industry why would a few hundred (at most) people going to Rwanda make any difference? It won't.

It’s now a police matter and out of HMRC’s hands for the time being so I don’t think they need my help….However,. Sir Keir can’t lose here - he says he hasn’t seen the ‘tax advice’ (nice cleans hands) and she has said if she’s found to have ‘done something wrong’ she’ll resign.Do I think neighbours would generally queue up to assert (and seemingly prepared to give evidence ) she didn’t live at the house she claims was ‘her main residence’ when she did? No. Why would her eldest child have registered to vote at a house where apparently neither of his parents actually lived? It’s a shame because I think the LPP have let her tie herself in knots. She was at least someone who people could identify with and it would be a shame if she does have to fall on her sword. But if it’s a resignation issue for one party, it almost certainly has to be for the opposition.

Did you see this from Ireland?

It’s not actually nuts that traffickers can move in to exploit concern over deportation. They are profiteers and if someone wants to leave the U.K. to NI to Ireland they’ll mobilise and take funds to help them.

If you think about how traffickers operate you can start to track migration flows and how they change based on policy

https://news.sky.com/story/amp/rwanda-bill-causing-migrants-to-opt-for-ireland-deputy-pm-says-13123078

But in the instance you’ve used here, the person doing 110 mph would be treated very differently than the person doing 32. One would receive a fixed penalty or maybe the offer of a Driver awareness course and the other would receive a likely lengthy ban if not a further prosecution for dangerous driving. With respect to paying tax, depending on whether or not you claim you forgot/was careless/didn’t understand the rules/you can just pay up and that’s the end of the matter providing you haven’t deliberately evaded paying tax. The amounts are relevantt according to the rules. It might not be palatable, but it is the case. Tax evasion and tax avoidance (such as the once- legal tax avoidance schemes that many celebrities have fallen foul of after the event )are two very different things. One you can pay up and move on, the other lands to you in jail.

How many millions does Angela Rayner have in offshore trusts?

Trying to paint Rwanda as a success because a politician in Ireland says it's making life harder for them is a bit desperate even by the standards of the current shit in power in the UK.
Rwanda is by any sensible measure, an expensive gimmick to try to win a few votes from the hard of thinking. It won't "work" in any sense other than that, and it will waste a lot of taxpayer cash in the process.

I don’t care whether you are convinced or not, you think Labour have the answers.

You can say Ireland are lying or whatever it’s 🤷‍♀️to me.

If they are seeing a spike due to trafficking and put it to deportation then it’s up to them.

I managed to leave my abusive ex and go to university while having a young child. There was proper support to do these things unlike the harsh and punitive system these lot have put in place. In my line of work I regularly see student parents at their wits end unable to pay the rent, needing food banks, unable to attend due to childcare issues (nursery is too costly so they rely on friends and relatives). They are being condemned to a life of low paid work and benefit dependency when 3 years of proper help would get them qualifications and a chance at a graduate job. It's just so short sighted. That's before we even start on schools, roads, the NHS. We need these lot out at the next GE.

I should add I am aware that tuition fees had just come in when I did my degree but student loans were still sane amounts and there was more help for those with extra needs.

You do realise you’ve just argued against yourself?

The sums of monies involved are irrelevant

The amounts are relevantt according to the rules.