Primary school dilemma - Please help

[Carbonaranight]

Which primary school to choose out of the two below for our reception child that starts in September? Please help!

AIBU - Local primary , 8min walk from home, good reputation over the years, ofsted rating good (last inspected last year) and many current friends from the nursery will go to this local school meaning that our kid will have some friends to begin with

AINBU - CofE primary, 15min drive, needs supplementary form from a Christian church to get in but our priest signed this form for us, good reputation over the years, ofsted rating outstanding (last inspected last year) and our kid won’t possible know any classmates.

We are Christians from a different denomination, believers and don’t mind the churchy part of the second school. We also love that it’s outstanding but the commute and the fact that our kid won’t have friends in the beginning worries us.

Please please please help us chose! Whichever we put first, we will get an offer 🙏🏻

AIBU - Go for your local good school
AINU - Go for the churchy outstanding with longer commute

I would go for the local school, convenience and local friends are big positives.
When I was a child, my parents sent me to a school 4 miles across town and I remember they were always stressed in the mornings.

DD’s school is actually ‘needs improvement’ rating but it’s a 2 min walk from us. I actually think it’s a really good school.

Depends which primary will pave the way to the best secondary, imo.

My DD and DS went to the same local primary, 14 years apart. When DD went, it was rated good, for DS it was outstanding. I can't tell the difference. At all.

Local good school, every time. I certainly wouldn't be being dazzled by an outstanding Ofsted. In terms of the churchy thing, I do think that marking the church year, events across the school community etc could be a positive, but not a strong enough one to outweigh the benefits of being within walking distance and her having friends to start the school with. You can provide religious education and involvement in a religious community through your own church attendance.

Trust me...go for the walking distance school. I've hated our commute. It's never just 15 mins...it's a hour round trip all up. Don't do it.

As a teacher, I wouldn't base any decision on the Ofsted rating. I'd personally want the school closest.

We had a similar dilemma, although our faith school is a walkable distance (just much further, there's another school across the road from us).
For us the faith school was a no brainer mainly because it's a feeder school to the only decent (Catholic) secondary around here. The others have a terrible reputation and we would have safety concerns.
I'd consider the future. But needing to drive is a bit of a pain unless you can split it or its on your route anyway

If you’ve never done school runs then you won’t know what a huge bonus it is to be able to easily walk to school. Assuming you’ve visited both and liked the feel of both, go local!

Look around them both and use that, and what local parents say to decide IMO. I’m a teacher and wouldn’t get excited about the difference between good and outstanding, it makes very little difference to the kids.

We live near two primary schools that were logical options (one walking distance, one a five mins drive). I assumed my kids would go to the closest one, but actually I didn’t like it when I looked round. The other school had a much nicer feel and I was impressed by all the things they did, so I picked that one and have never regretted it, it’s a brilliant school.

You will be committing yourself to 7 years of driving to and from the faith school. Is there a sibling you need to consider?

I did both of those school runs but for the same school. We chose local because it was outstanding and a 10 minute walk but the local secondary was going downhill fast when Ds hit KS2. So we moved into the catchment for an outstanding secondary but it would mean I would now have to drive 12-15 minutes every day to do the same school run because we kept them in their old school.

But I was a sahm, long term due to disability so my circumstances ie job, hours etc would never change. The distance did mean that I always offered to drop play dates back to their home rather than make someone come all the way over to mine and back so a 30 minute journey.

It also meant they had no friends local to us too, but my children were best friends, still are so just enjoyed playing with each other. The worst part was if one had an after school club as I had to make 2 school runs to collect one child, then go back for the other. Too long to sit in the car just waiting for a child.

But definitely look ahead to secondary, and don't always just go off an outstanding ofsted report either, there is more to a school than that.

At reception, friends are fluid, I wouldn’t base it on that. So other things to think about:

Go round the school, look and listen to the year 6s. Is this how you’d like your child to be in year 6?
DD1 in year 6 was very independent, walked to and from school picking up a large bunch of friends on the way. They met up to go to the park etc. What do you want it to be like for your DC when they get to year 6?

Apart from Ofsted and church, what are the differences between the two schools? Curriculum, activities, clubs, music lessons etc. what is important to you?

Is the 15 minute drive really a 15 minute drive? How long is it actually door to door at school pick up/drop off time? I’d do a dummy run and include finding somewhere to park. Are you able to commit to it for the next 7 years? Can you cope if you’re ill? Work?

What it then comes down to is that is the drive and commitment to that drive to school B for the next 7 years plus play dates, parties etc. worth it? It will be worth it for some children and in comparison to some schools, it won’t be for others.

Friends are irrelevant…they make new ones, but having support from other local parents can be invaluable. Ignore ofsted reports… .neither of ours thrived at an outstanding school …how do both schools feel? Do you know any local teachers, where do they send their kids?

Good local school.. More convenient and your child will have local friends, local playdates, a local life.

Loca school unless the outstanding school gets you priority for a better secondary.

We went for a local primary and the community benefits, combined with a super short school run are fabulous. Friends at schools that are much better thought of (and where people pay ££ for houses as well as jumping through church attendance hoops) have had no better primary school experiences, and in many cases worse. This is doubly so if you have any SEN.

Local school 100%

From what you’ve said, the local one. As PPs have said, convenience in terms of travel time, independence for older DC, local friends really important. If you have more than one child then particularly helpful when you’re back and forth eg when one starts part time or one goes to a club at school and one doesn’t, etc.

Difference in Ofsted rating may be due to paperwork, how things went on one day, “hiding” difficult children. Or one being done more recently under regime when harder to get outstanding. Or may of course be because one better than other. (If eg one outstanding and one inadequate this would be much more likely.). Look at where good school wasn’t as good - what do they need to improve and are those things likely to be important for your child?

As a Christian myself, of course there’s benefits to a church school but if they are getting Christian input from you and your church then it’s not vital. Though I would still want my child at a school that taught values that aligned with mine. My DC were at a very values-based primary school with lots of emphasis on kindness, resilience, honesty, cooperation etc (in comparison to DS’s secondary where they said they were important but actions suggested otherwise). I’d also be uncomfortable with them at a school teaching them that men can become women and there are many different genders (ask what used for RSHE and if any of it endorsed by Stonewall or they refuse to let you know then run a mile).

How did they feel when you went round, as that’s probably most important? Did teachers seem caring? Did kids seem well behaved but not robots? Were kids given some responsibilities? Did teachers treat kids with respect and vice versa? Did they appear to be differentiating appropriately so all kids learning at right level for them?

Local school, no question. You can’t underestimate how important it’ll be to have local friends who are walking distance away.

Also I never understand why people take so much notice of Ofsted grading. Every “outstanding” school is only a head-teacher-change away from “requires improvement”. I’ve seen it happen. A school near me was consistently awarded outstanding rating, always oversubscribed, well known as being the most sought-after school in the area. Then the head teacher left for a new post. The new head wasn’t popular, teachers left, supply teachers were used a lot, new posts took a while to be filled, parents got fed up with it, kids moved schools, numbers dropped so staff were made redundant - all within a couple of years. They had another ofsted inspection and they were rated as requiring improvement.

So I would never ever base a decision on Ofsted. Look at the bigger picture. And for most kids, it’s very important that they can go to their friends houses after school and at weekends without it being a drive away.

Ofsted can be misleading as is snapshot of a particular two days perhaps from a few years back.
My DCs went to the more distant church school - it had previously had a great reputation was oversubscribed etc. although once there was not impressed had been relying on it's former glory.
Then the headteacher retired and it went from bad to worse.
Parents are now saying how good it is now but applications low as still awaiting Ofsted regrading.

How recent were the ofsted inspections and have there been any major changes since then; headteacher for example? What do the ofsted reports actually say?
Have you visited the schools and what were your impressions?

I would definitely go for the local school unless you are confident based on your visit and recent feedback (eg ofsted, parents with children at the school) that the further school is significantly better.

Thank you all!

So to add a bit of more information:

• Local school: Rated good by Ofsted in Spring 2023. New headteacher came in September 2022, which was the reason it was inspected. Previous outstanding inspection was more than 10 years ago and I consider it superseded anyway. Local school is an infant's school, it feeds to another good local primary school, next to door to the infant's one (Year 3-Year 6).

       Points that Ofsted raised: 

• In a small number of subjects, leaders are at the early stages of identifying the knowledge they want pupils to learn. This means that pupils’ knowledge in these subjects is not yet secure. Leaders need to ensure that the precise knowledge is identified and carefully sequenced, and checks should be made to ensure that pupils retain what they have learned.
• The teaching of phonics could be more effective. As a result, some pupils are not making expected progress. Leaders need to ensure that all staff have clarity about how to deliver phonics consistently well. Leaders should continue to assure themselves of the impact this is having.

• Faith school: Rated outstanding by Ofsted in Spring 2022. Had a SIAMS inspection 5 years back and it was also rated as outstanding. Previous ofsted inspection was more than 10 years back which was also outstanding.

We live in a heavily grammar school area and the primary school has no effect on which secondary they will go. Both schools feed into the same secondaries and have very similar grammar school pass rate.

First one, but for all the other reasons other than them having nursery friends there - that won't make a difference to most kids.

Being Ofsted outstanding really isn't a big deal. The rating can disappear overnight. Plus some good schools miss out on being outstanding for essentially trivial reasons like not having things fully recorded in their paperwork, or because they choose to concentrate on the wider curriculum rather than having a narrow focus on what gets them good results in SATs. You can bet that the local school is currently working hard to demonstrate that it is addressing the issues raised by Ofsted, and having a new headteacher in place will help with that process.

You'd be mad to go for anything but the local school.

I Know it’s very early but I think you need to secondary school choices too, if the primary school impacts on getting in.

Also does the drive to the church school coincide with the drive to work or shops or anything. The drive is less of a factor of you will be going that way anyway.

Based on this, I'd still go for the local one. Have you visited them?

Will you even get to the one further way? Does it have a catchment?
I vote for the closer one with out a doubt.